RB67 127mm KL - new or used?

nightbringer · Nov 18, 2011

There's an eBay seller, sanpoucamera, who is selling 'new in box' 127mm KL lenses for a price similar to what you can get for second-hand (or maybe a bit more than for used). Is it worth it getting it new in the box, or better to get an older, used one?

paul ron · Nov 19, 2011

If it's too good to be true, it's generally too good to be true.

I'd buy from a reputable seller so you can have some kind of return policy to fall back on. Flea-bay is an iffy proposition.

tomalophicon · Nov 19, 2011

They are extremely cheap. Check KEH's new prices to compare.
I have bought a 180mm KL and a 150mm SF from this seller. He provided good service and extremely fast shipping.
Often the second hand ones are overpriced.

nightbringer · Nov 19, 2011

tomalophicon said:
They are extremely cheap. Check KEH's new prices to compare.
I have bought a 180mm KL and a 150mm SF from this seller. He provided good service and extremely fast shipping.
Often the second hand ones are overpriced.

How was the lenses you got? All brand new, no blemishes and things?

tomalophicon · Nov 19, 2011

Definitely all brand new with factory boxes.
No blemishes or anything.

Marc B. · Nov 19, 2011

Some buyers have had problems with New Old Stock-NOS items, from some sellers.
Musty odor/mildew, and fungus issues were/are the predominate complaint. With NOS items,
you never know the conditions that the items were stored under for the past (?)years(?)decades.

I purchased a RZ lens from the Japanese seller "sanpoucamera" described above, and there were
no issues at all. Fine lens, in new condition, and not a single issue with this RZ lens to this day.

Then, about two months after I bought the lens, KEH had the same lens, same new
condition, for about 20-25% less, with shipping (USA-USA), half the (JAP-USA) cost.

Long story short; I have no reservations buying from sanpoucamera. None at all.

five · Nov 20, 2011

I bought a few new RB lenses from sanpoucamera, they were new in box in perfect condition. They were packed well and arrived in just a few days. I ordered 3 and they combined shipping. It actually worked out cheaper than KEH.

nightbringer · Nov 20, 2011

five said:
I bought a few new RB lenses from sanpoucamera, they were new in box in perfect condition. They were packed well and arrived in just a few days. I ordered 3 and they combined shipping. It actually worked out cheaper than KEH.

Did you order from their site or what? Because their eBay only lists one or two lenses but on their site they've got a few more. I am interested in getting a 50mm as well, so have been on the hunt for one not from KEH considering their internaitonal shipping costs an arm and a leg.

CGW · Nov 20, 2011

Marc B. said:
Some buyers have had problems with New Old Stock-NOS items, from some sellers.
Musty odor/mildew, and fungus issues were/are the predominate complaint. With NOS items,
you never know the conditions that the items were stored under for the past (?)years(?)decades.

I purchased a RZ lens from the Japanese seller "sanpoucamera" described above, and there were
no issues at all. Fine lens, in new condition, and not a single issue with this RZ lens to this day.

Then, about two months after I bought the lens, KEH had the same lens, same new
condition, for about 20-25% less, with shipping (USA-USA), half the (JAP-USA) cost.

Long story short; I have no reservations buying from sanpoucamera. None at all.

These NOS Mamiya lenses and accessories aren't going to last. Funny to watch chumps listing used schlock on eBay for hundreds of bucks more than KEH's NOS items.

No clue about Japanese sellers but some of the HK crew has had problems. One of the more notorious was an eBay seller, "wkcrs," who sold from both California and HK. Aside from selling the odd fungus-y NOS Mamiya lens, he seemingly vanished in late '09 leaving dozens of buyers with no merch. Another seller("pkks56") in California using errily similar photos has been selling what I suspect is old wkcrs's stock--maybe him, maybe not.

Sanpou sounds OK and is obviously closer for the OP. For anyone in N. America, KEH is the place for Mamiya now.

nightbringer · Nov 20, 2011

I heard about that Hong Kong guy, but I heard the name Sanpou Camera even before I was looking up lenses, back when I was still shooting digital and looking up good shops in Japan for gear for my trip there.
I compared prices with KEH - even considering both charge roughly equal amounts of shipping, Sanpou comes out a little cheaper for a new in box lens with hood, whereas I pay more from KEH without the hood. If I was wanting to get a second lens or some other stuff, I would probably lean more towards KEH.

wotalegend · Nov 20, 2011

I bought a 35/3.5 N lens for my M645 system from sanpoucamera late last year. It was advertised as used, not NOS. When it arrived it looked brand new apart from the usual missing black paint from the lens mount lugs, showing that it had indeed been fitted to a body. The price was excellent for what is a fairly hard-to-get lens, and I would have absolutely no hesitation in buying from them again. I have also bought several lenses and other items from KEH and I have full confidence in them too. From where I sit in Australia shipping from Japan is slightly cheaper than from the US, but I can fully understand why a US-based buyer would prefer to buy from KEH for both shipping cost and warranty reasons.

nightbringer · Nov 21, 2011

What about musashi camera? They've got stuff cheaper plus I might be able to combine shipping on two lenses they have that I want.

five · Nov 21, 2011

nightbringer said:
Did you order from their site or what? Because their eBay only lists one or two lenses but on their site they've got a few more. I am interested in getting a 50mm as well, so have been on the hunt for one not from KEH considering their internaitonal shipping costs an arm and a leg.

I ordered from them on ebay. I ordered the 127kl 180kl and 250kl all in new condition. I sent them a message and asked them if they would combine shipping. They did and it saved a bit of money. It worked out cheaper than keh for me and i'm in the US. I haven't ordered from their website, but if it is the same place, I wouldn't hesitate to.
You could try sending them an email about the lenses not on ebay.

nightbringer · Nov 21, 2011

They don't have any wides listed on their site, the widest being 90mm

Still waiting to hear back on the message I sent to musashi camera, they sell used but are obviously cheaper and have had perfect feedback.

keithwms · Nov 21, 2011

Don't bother with used for that common an RB lens. There is almost no price difference between "excellent" and "new" for RB lenses. Unless you really want an older lens for its particular character, go with new.

nightbringer · Nov 22, 2011

keithwms said:
Don't bother with used for that common an RB lens. There is almost no price difference between "excellent" and "new" for RB lenses. Unless you really want an older lens for its particular character, go with new.

Thanks, I ended up pulling the trigger on the original one from Sanpou Camera after what you said. I really wanted 50mm rather than 65mm since I am a hound for ultrawide angles, so I figure I'll get this one (127mm KL) now and watch for a bargain on a 50mm later on.

keithwms · Nov 22, 2011

Actually, I would suggest going for the 65, it is truly superb lens and unfortunately the RB 50s are not in the same class. Also, the 65 is rather inexpensive, even new. Consider tracking down a 6x8 back if you really ewant the extra bit of angle. Note that some people do report good results withthe RB 50, but after trying the RZ 50 uld... well I shan't say more. It just depends what you want from the lens.

eskerman · Nov 24, 2011

I am just about to pull the trigger with Sanpou Camera on a KL/127 3.5 for my ProSD. I am based in Ireland so postage will be about the same from Jap-land or the US. Perhaps you will drop in here and let us know what you think of your new lens when you get it.

nightbringer · Nov 27, 2011

I just got it in the mail today. I pulled the trigger last Tuesday, the seller sent it within about two hours of me paying (granted, Australia and Japan only have an hour or two different, may be different if you are in vastly different timezones), and provided me with a tracking number. The tracking didn't help much, I guess whoever was handling it wasn't too diligent about updating the tracking as I've got entries tracking its departure from Japan and after it left Melbourne the tracking stopped. It took my girlfriend coming back home to find it by my door to bring it to my attention, I was expecting a personal delivery. But that says more about the Australian postage system than anything else, so I can't fault the seller for that.
As for the lens itself, I present to you the unboxing:

The package

The side view where there has been some dents, probably at the airport

As you can see, the actual box itself is very well cushioned with wrapping paper

... and also bubble wrap

A brand new lens inside the box

The actual lens itself

Everything works, the shutter fires properly and there's no fungus, the lens is like factory new, it's pristine and there is no fungus on the lens. If I didn't know better, I'd think that this lens was made fairly recently, I think Mamiya still has a limited production of new lenses?
I'm going to take this baby to the beach later today and run a couple of rolls through and put this through its paces.

RB67 127mm KL - new or used?

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