Rangefinder forum has been expanded + General info on forum expansion..

Sean · Aug 25, 2006

Hi All,

The Rangerfinder Forum on APUG is one of the first of our forums to undergo some new expansion into subforums. I believe the size of the community is now large enough to begin fragmenting several of the main forums into more detailed subforums. This will add a new level of managing the content so that members are not overwhelmed by post volumes. For example the new software we are upgrading to soon allows great control over which forums you want to view. If you are only interested in Leica M rangefinders you may want to put on a block to the other rangefinder categories. The end result is when you check posts in the morning you don't weed through 30 rangefinder posts, you just see the 5 or so leica posts. If you adjust several other forums like this you can begin to tailor the info you get rather than coming back from a weekend holiday to 2,000 new posts.

I decided to start with the rangefinder forum after reading Stephanie Brim's posting from the other day. She has worked with me to expand the categories and will be moderating that forum and subforums with the current team. So thanks Stephanie

Now would probably be a good time for suggestions on expanding some of the other forums. We don't want to get too fragmented (for example having 100 subforums under 35mm forum). Thanks for any feedback.

Sean

Sean · Aug 25, 2006

Also, the forums most suited to fragment would typically be the busy ones such as B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry with 5,000 threads. This shows there is plenty of activity there and some subforums might come in handy..

Michel Hardy-Vallée · Aug 25, 2006

I have a brilliant idea Sean: Why not split the Film, Paper, Chemistery forum into three separate forums. Each of them named Film. Paper. And Chemistery.

argus · Aug 25, 2006

Michel,

I would only split in 2:

- paper & chemistry
- film & chemistry

Greetings,
G

Michel Hardy-Vallée · Aug 25, 2006

Argus: clever!

copake_ham · Aug 25, 2006

I'd like two Nikon subforums.

One in the RF Forum for the S- mount line.

The other in the 35mm Forum (maybe renamed "35mm - SLR"?) for the F-mount line. In this regard - perhaps a subforum for each major SLR maker (Canon, Leica, Nikon, Olympus, Pentax etc. - tried to be "alphabetical" with my examples list....).

I like to use the "global" view but glad to see these subforums for gear. Will really be useful when you are looking for some specific help on a particular camera type....

Yeah, Sean. Good luck Stephanie (quite an honor, BTW).

copake_ham · Aug 25, 2006

Sean,

A thought regarding the RF Forum/Subforum.

Could you be perhaps preparing for an in-rush of RF filmsters after the digi-M8 comes out and the RFF site "goes digi"?

df cardwell · Aug 25, 2006

Sean

How about an addition for Kiev rfdrs ?

More than enough variations, peculiarities, and lore to fill a forum !

copake_ham · Aug 25, 2006

df cardwell said:
Sean

How about an addition for Kiev rfdrs ?

More than enough variations, peculiarities, and lore to fill a forum !

The "other site" approached this with a FSU forum.

But I have a Kiev 4, that is compatible (m/l) with Contax RFs. And then there are the FSU "Leicas" (e.g. the Zorki and FED lines).

So should we segregate the FSUs - which results in a cross-over?

Or should we put the "FSU equivalents" in their respective "major" subforums (e.g. Contax, Leica etc.)

OMG - could there be sub-subforums?

Jerevan · Aug 26, 2006

Well, basically the subforums is a good idea, but I feel it may lead to fragmentation of APUG as a whole. And going through 40 subforums don't appeal. As for splitting the Film, Paper, Chemistry forum into two or three (sub)forums: many of the questions are related to each other, like what film to what chemistry and so on. On both RFF and the LF forum, they seem to have gone in the other direction, less subforums. Larger forum groups seems to make for slight confusion but also a lot of healthy crossbreeding.

Whatever, don't go bananas with the forums, that's my take.

Sean · Aug 26, 2006

Thanks for the feedback everyone. I definitely do not want to go overboard generating subforums and new forums. Overall it should be fairly subtle. Over the next few weeks I'll get a framework in place and run it by everyone first for another session of feedback.

Sean

reub2000 · Aug 26, 2006

What about a Yashica Electro 35 forum?

raucousimages · Aug 27, 2006

Contax G?

Stephanie Brim · Aug 27, 2006

I think the Zeiss forum should possibly be renamed Zeiss/Contax. The Russian forum should be renamed Russian/FSU. I don't really want to go too far overboard with this. I think that Yashica/Petri/other compact rangefinders can be talked about in the main section of the rangefinder forum without much confusion. I'm not belittling those cameras, it's just that they probably don't have the userbase to have a forum of their own.

On rangefinderforum things are a bit different because that's all the site focuses on...but here, we don't really need to be that specific. At least in my opinion.

Dan Fromm · Aug 27, 2006

reductio ad absurdum

reub2000 said:
What about a Yashica Electro 35 forum?

reub2k, you're a piker. What we need is two forums for Yashica RF cameras, including Nicca, one each for mechanically and electronically timed shutters; for Minolta RF cameras; for Olympus; for Canon, leaf shutter and focal plane shutter; for Konica RF cameras; for Aires; for each of the other Japanese makes of fixed lens RF 35 mm cameras; for Leica thread mount clones, including Nicca; for Afga RF cameras, all formats; for Regula; for Foca; ...

The MF forum should be split by maker and type. Rollei TLRs just don't fit in the same space as Rollei SLRs.

The LF forum should be split by camera type: monorail, tailboard, folding press/technical. And Sean should reach out and engulf www.graflex.org.

We need a meters forum. Split by maker, including GE.

...

The RF forum split may have seemed like a good idea but I think its dumb.

gr82bart · Aug 27, 2006

Toy Camera forum please.

Regards, Art.

Helen B · Aug 27, 2006

I don't like the idea of dividing by camera make. What was broken in the RF forum that needed fixing?

Best,
Helen

David A. Goldfarb · Aug 27, 2006

Stephanie Brim said:
I think the Zeiss forum should possibly be renamed Zeiss/Contax. The Russian forum should be renamed Russian/FSU.

If we stick with the divided forums, yes, these should both be changed. Perhaps just "FSU" rather than "Russian/FSU," since "FSU" would include Russia, and many cameras were made in Ukraine.

John Koehrer · Aug 27, 2006

I also think the forums are just becoming cluttered. It's nowhere as clean looking as it once was.

reub2000 · Aug 27, 2006

Dan Fromm said:
reub2k, you're a piker. What we need is two forums for Yashica RF cameras, including Nicca, one each for mechanically and electronically timed shutters; for Minolta RF cameras; for Olympus; for Canon, leaf shutter and focal plane shutter; for Konica RF cameras; for Aires; for each of the other Japanese makes of fixed lens RF 35 mm cameras; for Leica thread mount clones, including Nicca; for Afga RF cameras, all formats; for Regula; for Foca; ...

The MF forum should be split by maker and type. Rollei TLRs just don't fit in the same space as Rollei SLRs.

The LF forum should be split by camera type: monorail, tailboard, folding press/technical. And Sean should reach out and engulf www.graflex.org.

We need a meters forum. Split by maker, including GE.

...

The RF forum split may have seemed like a good idea but I think its dumb.

Good ideas. Maybe just one fixed lens rangefinder forum will do.

Dan Fromm · Aug 27, 2006

Helen B said:
I don't like the idea of dividing by camera make. What was broken in the RF forum that needed fixing?

Best,
Helen

Helen, you are evil personified and obviously not a right-thinking person.

I like your posts very much, please continue thinking clearly and posting useful information.

Best,

Dan

df cardwell · Aug 27, 2006

Helen B said:
I don't like the idea of dividing by camera make. What was broken in the RF forum that needed fixing?

Best,
Helen

Well, lessee.

A thread begins, " I wonder what the difference is between and early and late summicron . Innnocent enough.

What follows is usually 14 posts about Leicas being overpriced, 12 about Feds being every bit as good, and 32 about know a guy whose dog ate a Leica strap and died.

When I was a kid, and on a steep learning curve, an old pro showed me three or four little tricks about handling a rangefinder - in about 5 minutes - that made life worth living, and paid off immediately for me.

Try getting into technique without being attacked for owning a rangefinder, a Leica / Contax / Fed instead of a Pentax 6x7.

That sort of thing gets lost in the Leica hate, history trivia, and general whitenoise of impassioned correspondents. Maybe, just maybe, having sub-forums will allow conversations to be a little more to the point, civil, and helpful.

With the result a few more feet of Tri X gets shot from old cameras, new cameras, and our dying craft gets a little more sustenance.

At least the Moderator has some context.

Helen B · Aug 27, 2006

"Helen, you are evil personified..."

Thanks for the compliment Dan, I try my best.

df,
Could you give us a link to a thread on APUG like the one you have just described? (there was a url link here which no longer exists) of one that didn't go that way. Isn't what you are describing a photo.net Leica forum phenomenon rather than an APUG phenomenon, or am I suffering from selective memory?

Re the death rate among dogs that eat Leica straps: you may think that is trivial, but I believe that it is a disgrace that the public must be made aware of at every opportunity. In fact, it should have its own sub-forum.

Best,
Helen

copake_ham · Aug 27, 2006

Helen B said:
I don't like the idea of dividing by camera make. What was broken in the RF forum that needed fixing?

Best,
Helen

Helen,

I think I understand some of your concern.

I generally support the expansion by camera-type in the RF forum but I'm hoping it doesn't become a mine-is-better-than-yours battleground.

The division does make sense as a means of organizing information relevant to only one particular brand of RF. It hopefully will make it a little quicker and easier to obtain what is rather arcane info of interest to relatively few.

There can never be completely "clean lines" of organizing the sub fora because there are FSU-clones of Leica and Contax. Similarly, the Nikon/Contax and Canon/Leica Screwmount relationships further complicate matters: (e.g. Query: Is a Contax Zeiss Sonnar 50mm/1.5 compatible with a Nikon S2? -- yes/no, but.... Or, what about a Nikkor 3.5cm/2.5 - can I use in on my Kiev 4? ).

I mention this only because I have a Nikon S2 and SP, a Contax IIIa and a Kiev 4. Oh, and yes, two Bessa R2S's!

Overall, I think a division by brand makes the best sense of what is a very complex camera type. If only because there doesn't seem to be any better form of organization of sub-fora that would seem preferable.

reub2000 · Aug 27, 2006

Dividing the forums up by lens mount may work better.

Also if any other forum is going to be broken up, the color forum should be broken up into slide and negative sections.

Rangefinder forum has been expanded + General info on forum expansion..

Sean

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