I believe Michael and Paula use ABC pyro which I think tends to have more general stain than PMK does.
This is simply not true. I print PMK pyro negatives on enlarging paper all the time. I believe Michael and Paula use ABC pyro which I think tends to have more general stain than PMK does.
I guess you haven't seen their negatives. I certainly couldn't print them on enlarging paper.
What I really meant to say was "Don't use ABC, which is what M&P use".
PMK has other problems, not the least of which is much greater general (aka fog) stain than ABC.
I still believe the best developer for both enlarging and contact printing purposes is Pyrocat.
Personally, I don't use either pyrogallol or pyrocatechin based developers for 90% of my negatives.
Nothing has been as overhyped as pyro developers, except perhaps Azo.
My PMK negatives certainly do not have significantly more general stain than my Pyrocat negatives.
You must know something I don't, then. Maybe I'll give it another try.
I think the OP asked for a moderator to delete the thread early on.
Mike
You must know something I don't, then. Maybe I'll give it another try.
"Nothing has been as overhyped as pyro developers, except perhaps Azo."
Jim, I'm curious what you mean, given your previous use of AZO. Could you explain a little? I still use your AZO prints to see what I missed out on.
GB
Hmm - I'm not sure. I follow the directions in "The Book of Pyro" and I use FP4+ film. I do not use the after bath following the fix stage as it seems to only add to the general stain. I do mix all my chemistry with distilled water and I get my PMK pre-mixed from Bostic & Sullivan. I also use TF-4 as my fixer and a plain water stop bath
Hope this helps.
Dan
I really think I've come to the wrong place, and I really don't have enough experience to be posting here. If a moderator could please delete this thread I'd appreciate it. Thanks.
Just for the opposite opinion: I used pyro, but no longer use it except in very special cases.
But that decision was made because I prefer to use graded papers, and a pyro negative that gives a decent print on G2 graded is useless for anything else. I also like to be able to switch between graded and MC papers, which you cannot easily do with pyro stained negatives.
Hutchings himself (somewhere, I'd have to hunt for it) said forget the after bath.
I have heard that a number of times before and I believe it. What I find a little strange is that the after-bath is still in the latest edition of his book. I have this edition and noted a few changes from an older edition a friend has. Even if he couldn't take it out entirely, you'd think he'd put something in there about not using it anymore.
Dan
Hello, my name is Jim and I'm an Azoholic. <"Hi, Jim!">
I still use Azo because I still have some, but I need to learn to use something else. Some day I will run out.
When one is shielded with his "I've got the amazing, secret unfair advantage" armor, the realization that it's printing skill that is the most important element tends to bounce off one's helmeted head. Lately I've been a little more open minded.
Thanks for hearing my testimony.
No No No, you have it all wrong. If you would just add 4.3 g/l of Kodak Unobtanium you will be able to make the finest prints ever made, under any lighting conditions, even on the back of a Big Mac wrapper. 'sept I bought up all the Unobtanium.....
(hat tip to kevin at B&S)
I have heard that a number of times before and I believe it. What I find a little strange is that the after-bath is still in the latest edition of his book. I have this edition and noted a few changes from an older edition a friend has. Even if he couldn't take it out entirely, you'd think he'd put something in there about not using it anymore.
Dan
My position on the after-bath alkaline wash has always been that is serves no purpose. In my article, An Introduction to Pyro staining developers, with special attention to the Pyrocat-HD formula which has been at http://unblinkingeye.com/Articles/PCat/pcat.html for many years, I state.
Do not use an alkaline after-bath after fixing as recommended by Hutchings for PMK. My tests show that the stain added by this after-bath is primarily b+f, or general stain. General stain increases printing times and does nothing to enhance the printing qualities of your negatives.
That was published at a time when it was pretty much accepted as fact that the after-bath alkaline was best procedure. Many people challenged my position back then, but not so many now.
Sandy King
So Does Hutchings still recommend it?
So Does Hutchings still recommend it? Personally, I never used spent developer as my after bath instead I used a solution of sodium metaborate. However, since I couldn't see any difference in my negatives and after reading the unblinkingeye, I stopped using it.
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