Proposed UK law to restrict roadside camping

Arthurwg said:

What would you do with the homeless? Just wondering.

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The West Los Angeles VA has started construction of veteran housing. They opened part of the grounds for future tenants and issued standard tenting for them. That has relieved part of the local problem, but there is a long way to go for the rest of the homeless in the city. The city is rent motels for them and renovating and repurposing old buildings but that takes time and money. It will be a long term problem with the best efforts.

I must say I visited LA a few years ago and my son took me on a tour of the homeless camps. Completely appalling. Many of those folks were obviously mentally ill and walking around like zombies, dressed in rags, one shoe on, one shoe off. Frightening. But all this is a long way from sleeping in a van to make pictures in the morning. See Tom Heaton on Youtube.

I've just realised that this is such an old thread that the petition referred to has long ago closed (>54,000 signatures) and the Government responded - AND IT WAS MY FAULT FOR RE_OPENING IT. An excerpt from the govt response shows that the OP need not have worried:
<<The conditions of the offence apply to those residing on land in or with a vehicle who cause significant damage, disruption, or distress and who do not leave when asked to do so. Those residing on land in a vehicle who do not cause significant harm will not be caught by the new offence. The high threshold to be caught by the offence helps ensure any enforcement action is proportionate.>>

On the other hand, it could be the end for campground crime dramas. I've never seen one, but it sounds like they could easily move to municipal parks round here.

Going back to the original point I cannot understand anyone wanting to camp on the roadside anyway. So for me it is a non event.

Is this not directed in real terms at the what are called 'Travellers' in other words the Gipsy fraternity. It may be bit discriminatory but certain groups do have a reputation of leaving the places they hold up in worse than a pig sty.

BMbikerider said:

Going back to the original point I cannot understand anyone wanting to camp on the roadside anyway. So for me it is a non event.

Is this not directed in real terms at the what are called 'Travellers' in other words the Gipsy fraternity. It may be bit discriminatory but certain groups do have a reputation of leaving the places they hold up in worse than a pig sty.

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I do not think that the word you want is discriminatory. The word you are looking for is B*I*G*O*T*E*D!!

See photographer Tom Heaton on Youtube.

Sirius Glass said:

I do not think that the word you want is discriminatory. The word you are looking for is B*I*G*O*T*E*D!!

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I think that is getting into unnecessary territory. The problem faced by the law-makers is to distinguish well-behaved from anti-social people by their actions, not by their ethnicity or social circumstances.

snusmumriken said:

I think that is getting into unnecessary territory. The problem faced by the law-makers is to distinguish well-behaved from anti-social people by their actions, not by their ethnicity or social circumstances.

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I suspect the problem has more to do with narrow roadways with little or no easements so any vehicles pulled off the road, tents or lean-tos crowd the road.

Sirius Glass said:

I suspect the problem has more to do with narrow roadways with little or no easements so any vehicles pulled off the road, tents or lean-tos crowd the road.

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The problem is made very clear in the Govt. response that I linked above.

Sirius Glass said:

I do not think that the word you want is discriminatory. The word you are looking for is B*I*G*O*T*E*D!!

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I will stick with my description, not yours. If you can see what is left after an encampment is moved on you may change your mind. Clearing up after them costs the Local Authorities many many thousands of pounds a year. They alienate the regular population with bad behavior, and it is noticeable the crime rate rises at the same time.

Sirius Glass said:

I do not think that the word you want is discriminatory. The word you are looking for is B*I*G*O*T*E*D!!

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Maybe educated yrself before throwing words around like that?

BMbikerider said:

I will stick with my description, not yours. If you can see what is left after an encampment is moved on you may change your mind. Clearing up after them costs the Local Authorities many many thousands of pounds a year. They alienate the regular population with bad behavior, and it is noticeable the crime rate rises at the same time.

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Leaving a mess is never acceptable. I was talking about the racism. The two are not necessarily linked.

Here makeshift homeless camps are synonymous with deadly fires, rampant drug abuse, and frequent serious crimes like murder and rape. I can certainly sympathize with those who have lost their homes or suffer from schizophrenia (very common in homeless encampments around here), and have nowhere else to go. But the way it now is, many of them live in daily fear of those around them. Free medical treatment is generally available, but many of them simply don't want it. Some are so far gone mentally, I've literally seen them run back into severe fires to save their little collection of mere garbage, and had to be forcibly restrained by fire fighters, police, or bystanders just to keep them alive. General risk to public health is also a great concern, because things like drug-resistant TB, typhus, and even cholera are real worries in such conditions, and are not merely hypothetical - they've been detected. But given our temperate climate, it's hard to keep the homeless from coming to this area. No simple answers.

Makeshift motorhome retirement parks out in the desert and so forth are an entirely different subject, but themselves inevitable for many who lost their jobs or actual homes for one reason or another.

Then there's the third type : Deluxe RV campers and small motorhomes parked alongside Silicon Valley streets, often with a bicycle or two attached. When even a couple making over $300,000 per year together can't afford a home in that area, and don't want to commute long distances either, it makes perfect sense. Many have gyms, showers, and cafeterias available at their high tech workplaces, commute short distances on their bicycles, and by living this way ten years or so, can save up a couple million dollars instead of being outright broke after extravagant monthly mortgage payments.

neilt3 said:

See the first link I provided in the first post .
It's the new "Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill"

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This is an all encompassing law to attempt to cure may ill's that are perceived to create problems, but there are previous laws which can be enforced by various local councils under the term of a Bye-Law, which prohibit the over night camping on laybys on the edges of roads which are intended only for short stay parking and as a place to park up if you wish to go walking during the day.
This 'no overnight parking' may be due to the mess that some miss-guided individuals leave behind them that need to be cleared up at a cost to the councils purse, and also my be to get their owners to use official campsites where there are facilities such as toilets and rubbish disposal facilities. Of course using them incurs a charge they avoid by stopping at the road side but pass on any clear up costs to the councils.
Of course people living in much larger countries such as America Canada or Australia will find this idea a quite alien. But for those who have never been here, Britain is a very small country with too many vehicles that try to use the same roads at the same time.
Most folk tend to be law abiding and stop away from roadsides and don't leave a mess behind when they leave. Once this law is finalised it will remain on the statute books and in time will only arouse contention when something major takes place.

I suppose the "refuse to leave when asked" covers most of the fear about imprisonment and getting your van destroyed. If they ask to leave just come back the other day for the shoot and be done. Also lets remember that public property means it is for everyone use not just yours so in a way it is protecting the rights of the next perdón. Just My two cents.