Processing PanF exposed over 2 years ago

hoffy · Dec 12, 2015

Hi Folks,

Recently a friend of mine gave me some film that he exposed over 2 years ago for me to process for him. In amoungst the lot is 2 rolls of PanF+. From what I he told me, the film was shot over 2 years ago.

Now, I know there has been much debate on here about PanF+'s latent image retention, but from my own personal experience, I would say its not too good. I plan on processing the film in D76 1:1 for 8.5 mins(as per the big dev chart), but am wondering whether I should apply some compensation.

Does any one have any advice on processing in this situation?

Cheers

Ian Grant · Dec 12, 2015

Not much chance, I made a mistake and forgot to process two rolls of 120 Pan F Id shot last Autumn (2014) and only processed them this Spring, despite giving extra development )about 50%) the negatives are too thin to even think about intensifying.

I wonder whether flashing would help boost what's left of the latent image but it would need experimenting with first.

Ian

hoffy · Dec 12, 2015

Yikes! I might as well bite the bullet and give one roll a try. What if I developed with Stock solution. Do you think that would make any difference?

Ian Grant · Dec 12, 2015

1+1 should be fine as long as you greatly increase development time, as 50% extra did little for me I guess you might try 2 or 3 times the normal time, or even stand development.

I was lucky my 120 Pan F films weren't important and I was also shooting HP5 with my Super Graphic and those negatives were fine Normally I process the same or next day, or as soon as I get back home from a trip away so I just didn't think about the PAn F latency, until I read about it here on APUG

Ian

Chris Livsey · Dec 12, 2015

I would be tempted to cut one roll into sections and try progressively longer development times starting from "normal" rather than a whole roll at once.
PanF has a reputation for this issue and as usual with the WWW it is probably exaggerated. Storage AFTER exposure is a major factor, should be below 20C and Ilford recommend maximum of 3 months to process. Of course after 3 months it doesn't fall off a cliff and deterioration will be progressive. Contrary to expectation perhaps faster films hold a latent image better than slow, there are technical reasons for that.
Good luck.

Ian Grant · Dec 12, 2015

Chris Livsey said:
I would be tempted to cut one roll into sections and try progressively longer development times starting from "normal" rather than a whole roll at once.
PanF has a reputation for this issue and as usual with the WWW it is probably exaggerated. Storage AFTER exposure is a major factor, should be below 20C and Ilford recommend maximum of 3 months to process. Of course after 3 months it doesn't fall off a cliff and deterioration will be progressive. Contrary to expectation perhaps faster films hold a latent image better than slow, there are technical reasons for that.
Good luck.

I don't think the reputation for poor latent image stability of PAN F has been exaggerated on the Internet at all, it's just a fact that it occurs and Ilford do warn about it. It's also common snse to orocess as soon as practical after exposure with any film, I'd moved and hadn't unpacked tanks, chemistry etc.My PAN F films were stored at about 12-15ºC and a bit lower (but above freezing) in the colder parts of winter so that wasn't an issue the 7 or 8 months delay was.

In general slower films keep and hold latency longer but some emulsions are better than others, the characteristics which make Pan F such a good film happen to mean it needs processing reasonably promptly but then it's mainly used by more experienced workers anyway.

Ian

Chris Livsey · Dec 12, 2015

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S._A._Andrée's_Arctic_Balloon_Expedition_of_1897

33 years, good job it wasn't PanF then.

Xmas · Dec 12, 2015

Ive processed after more than 12 months and got normal contrast and shadow detail.
60 mins stand 1:100 Rodinal 20C.

hoffy · Dec 12, 2015

Xmas said:
Ive processed after more than 12 months and got normal contrast and shadow detail.
60 mins stand 1:100 Rodinal 20C.

Hmmm, I didn't even think of Stand developing.

Is that a full stand, or did you give it a little agitate at half time? I know you say 1:100, but how much fluid in total are you using?

Cheers

Colin DeWolfe · Dec 12, 2015

I've processed after 3 months, and was rewarded with random white dots (on the print) and mottling. I've processed after 6 months and ended up with thin thin negatives, lots of white dots and a decidedly retro look. I've processed after a year and been rewarded with super thin gelotypes (tm) (the silver is so thin it's reflective).

I wouldn't hold out much hope. Even if you can push to get contrast, there will be defects in the image.

bvy · Dec 12, 2015

I would bypass the traditional developers and throw something like Diafine at it.

cliveh · Dec 12, 2015

hoffy said:
Hi Folks,

Recently a friend of mine gave me some film that he exposed over 2 years ago for me to process for him. In amoungst the lot is 2 rolls of PanF+. From what I he told me, the film was shot over 2 years ago.

Now, I know there has been much debate on here about PanF+'s latent image retention, but from my own personal experience, I would say its not too good. I plan on processing the film in D76 1:1 for 8.5 mins(as per the big dev chart), but am wondering whether I should apply some compensation.

Does any one have any advice on processing in this situation?

Cheers

If you are processing in D76 at 1:1 at 68F/20C (as you don't mention temperature), I would suggest 14.5 minutes regardless of if you exposed it yesterday or 2 years ago.

Xmas · Dec 12, 2015

hoffy said:
Hmmm, I didn't even think of Stand developing.

Is that a full stand, or did you give it a little agitate at half time? I know you say 1:100, but how much fluid in total are you using?

Cheers

The stand is my normal technique unless I have very high contrast, because I use multi tanks and various film types.
I can only use PanF on sunny days and it is processed with four or seven other films.
A reel needs 290 ml but I make up 300 ml X number of films and add 3 ml X (same) of Rodinal, stir, pour into tank invert five times set kitchen timer, leave and pour out when timer rings.
This is full stand except there may be some convection from ambient temperature difference from 20C, but I don't worry. Nor do I worry about minimum quantity.
You get edge effects with stand and less grain. Fomapan400 and Rodinal gives grain on 5x7s.
PanF is nice film my bulk roll expiry 2003 or so the edge markings are still there...
I'm a zonie so I use 25 ISO.

But I'd not use a new technique for non repeatable shots, I've been using stand from about '63.

taffer · Dec 13, 2015

bvy said:
I would bypass the traditional developers and throw something like Diafine at it.

Actually, Diafine happens to be the only developer I use since, well since always, and I got the usual mix of extra thin negatives or/and white dots also [emoji22] ...

bvy said:
I would bypass the traditional developers and throw something like Diafine at it.

Actually, Diafine happens to be the only developer I use since, well since always, and I got the usual mix of extra thin negatives or/and white dots also [emoji22]

pentaxuser · Dec 13, 2015

cliveh said:
If you are processing in D76 at 1:1 at 68F/20C (as you don't mention temperature), I would suggest 14.5 minutes regardless of if you exposed it yesterday or 2 years ago.

Is this a suggestion you have used? You may be right but this time is so far in excess( about 6 mins or 70%) of anything I have seen in the Massive Development Chart or Ilford's equivalent of D76 that if I were the OP I'd be a little worried.

pentaxuser

Athiril · Dec 14, 2015

I shot mine at EI 12, left it for a couple years, processed, did not pull process, also was rewarded with mottling and a lack of shadow detail.

cliveh · Dec 14, 2015

pentaxuser said:
Is this a suggestion you have used? You may be right but this time is so far in excess( about 6 mins or 70%) of anything I have seen in the Massive Development Chart or Ilford's equivalent of D76 that if I were the OP I'd be a little worried.

pentaxuser

Yes, I have done this many times.

AlanC · Dec 14, 2015

cliveh said:
If you are processing in D76 at 1:1 at 68F/20C (as you don't mention temperature), I would suggest 14.5 minutes regardless of if you exposed it yesterday or 2 years ago.

This does seem a lot...
For ID11 at 1+1 Ilford recommend 6 min. at EI 25, and 8.5 min. at EI 50. At 20 degrees C.

I have had good results with the following:

1+3 for 12 min. at EI 25
1+2 for 12 min. at EI 50
At 20 degrees C.

This was with freshly exposed film.....

Alan

pentaxuser · Dec 14, 2015

Thanks Clive

pentaxuser

Processing PanF exposed over 2 years ago

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