Press release from Ilford Photo

I've not used Kodak B/W paper for the last 20 years. Ilford, and many others, have been producing papers superior to Kodak for years.

Kodak no longer the leader!

So what will Kodak do? They are not a technology company and now they have killed off what has been their bread and butter for decades. Fuji took away market share with their color films. Ilford, Oriental and others have made better papers then Kodak. Chemistry is no big deal to make. Kodak will not be able to keep up with the technology changes. Digital products, inks, papers are easily made, very low profit margin items.

Instead of looking for ways to innovate and expand analog photography, they have shrunk back and followed to crowd. They are no longer the leader, or a leader in the photography industry.

As I see it, Kodak as a viable company, is seriously in jeopardy. If I was a shareholder, I would selll out and maybe even short the stock.

Les McLean said:

John I appreciate your comments re the website and will mention this to Ilford Photo when I next meet with them. I know that they are anxious to provide a complete service to the traditional black and white market and this includes clear access to product information but I'm sure you will appreciate that there is much work to be done in the aftermath of the situation of the past 12 months. I have no doubt that the website will be sorted in the future.

.

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Les--since you have a contact with the company--is there any way you can ask them to address the problems their customers who use their machine processors are having in regards to a lack of spare parts and support?

In the US, they have a vendor, GEI, to replace SERCO--yet in the past few months, every time I have called Ilford in need of parts, they have put me through to GEI. GEI has not been able to supply the parts, and told me last week that there would be "no more" parts available after they sold out of this odd lot they have. They couldn't tell me what they had in stock either. There is an ex-Ilford employee providing some parts on his own now, and he has told us that they are still being made. Ilford has told us, they aren't being made anymore. Why can't Ilford just level with the customers?---either the parts are being made, or they aren't. If they don't want to sell them, then pass along the manufacturer and we'll get help elsewhere.

I need gears--we've bought a junked 2150 to gets parts off, and what I can get seems to be slightly incompatible with our machine. The machine is slowly dying--and I'm looking at a file folder of ten years of service contracts and wondering where all the money went. I estimate over 20,000 dollars worth of money has gone to them in the form of yearly contracts and parts, in addition to paper and chemistry.

So is there any hope of getting the parts again, or are we just out of luck? How can they sell the 2150s last year, and not be able to provide any support for them? They sold 2 machines new in my town. One is at a state agency, the other at a private university. What sort of warranty can they offer these people now, with no parts?

It would help if they would release a statement about their machine support in addition to their current product line. There are still Ilford machines in use---I know of at least 6 within a several mile area of ours, and the place I work for has had 2 since the early 90s. I think they could at least give us a straight answer, out of respect to the years of service contracts and materials ordered. Roger Hicks relayed some of these concerns for me to last year, at the time they were bankrupt, and the answers I got were that there was only one employee left to handle the processors. I have been in contact with labs in this country, all looking for parts as well. This is a problem they need to address.

Thanks--

Kent Thompson

So, will Kodak be making cameras for cellphones now?
Because I don't see how else they will survive in consumer photography...

Ari,

It sounds like their focus is going to try and win the consumer digital market, which does not surprise me as their CEO used to work for HP, which has tried the same thing for many years now, what I am surpised as, is why the CEO that could not make HP a big winner in the consumer digital market, thinks he can do it with Kodak!

Dave

Dave, I think they just want to use the name.
"Kodak" they think is so tied to photography and especially to unaware consumers that they can just go with it. HP is too tied to computers and that scares the vast majority of people. After all, digital as they market it is the the new face of photography not just something to tie with computers. The average person is afraid of computers unless they have an one-button-one-jobtype of relationship with them (press a button for the game, press another for the photo to print, etc).

Unfortunately history has shown that a name is not enough.
I have been a long time user of Commodore computers to know that.
I am not sure if Kodak can pull it off.
Its a huge corporation that became huge because of chemical photography.
Digital is another thing.
I think the only option would be to withdrawn from the public and forget about the average consumer and like IBM focus mainly on the most demanding professional markets.

DKT said:

Les--since you have a contact with the company--is there any way you can ask them to address the problems their customers who use their machine processors are having in regards to a lack of spare parts and support?

Kent Thompson

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Kent,
I'll certainly ask the question when I meet the directors in the coming weeks. The problem is that Ilford Photo the UK company who grew out of the ashes of Ilford Imaging UK is now totally independent of Ilford US and I don't yet know what the connections may be. As soon as I have spoken to them I'll let you know.

I don't worry about Ilford or Kodak, Bergger Photo makes a great bunch of papaers and they are here to stay. The quality is great and so are the prints.

Mac

carbromac said:

I don't worry about Ilford or Kodak, Bergger Photo makes a great bunch of papaers

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I admire your naivety

Unfortunately Bergger don't make film or paper, they used to repackage and sell french manufactured Guillemot papers under their own brand name when they ceased trading they switched to Forte.

Yes Bergger will continue buying from who ever is left.

Ian

Les McLean said:

I had the following press release sent to me by Ilford Photo's PR Company...
.... This can be downloaded from the ILFORD Photo website at www.ilfordphoto.com by clicking ...

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Has anyone checked out the image for June in the "Marilyn" Calendar on Ilford's site?

Is it my imagination or is the "Bokeh" here something less than ideal? - And why is it that I really do NOT give a damn!?!?

Glad to hear people are swithching in droves. I advocated this when the shoe dropped originally. Why let them string us along while we provide the funds so they can switch to digital. They will eventually drop ALL film too as that is the the stated goal in the business plan. Start helping someone else now. I switched to Kodak when Ilford was having trouble and I guessed they would never come back.

Well I am back and you will not find a yellow box in my frig ever again. Fuji is for color and Ilford for monochrome. No more yellow stuff ever ever again.

AP's 2 July issue included a news item on Kodak's dropping of B&W papers including several quotes from John Culverhouse (Kodak's Strategic Product Group general manager). This snippet caught my eye:

"He told us that the move was largely driven by the shift to digital imaging and digital printing whereby, for example, many professional studio photographers now print of 'desktop' inkjet printers.
He added that these days it is also possible to produce a 'very good' b&w print on colour paper at professional labs."

Kodak have been stressing that there are no immediate plans to drop B&W films or chemicals, but my guess is if you'd asked them a month or so ago whether they would drop B&W paper you would have had a similar response. With an attitude like that (IMO) it's only a matter of time and I for one won't be putting another penny in Kodak's direction.

I'll be buying from Ilford in future, as well as trying out Forte, et al; when you've got manufacturers who publicly support traditional processes, they in turn are worth supporting.

Yes, I'm only one low-volume consumer, but there are a lot of us. If we all vote with our feet then (again IMO) the industry stands its best chance of long-term survival.

Ronald Moravec said:

Why let them string us along while we provide the funds so they can switch to digital. They will eventually drop ALL film too as that is the the stated goal in the business plan. Start helping someone else now. I switched to Kodak when Ilford was having trouble and I guessed they would never come back.

Well I am back and you will not find a yellow box in my frig ever again. Fuji is for color and Ilford for monochrome. No more yellow stuff ever ever again.

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I COULD HARDLY AGREE MORE - WELL PUT!

See, that was my sentiment exactly, and I have been called everything short of stupid - childish, vindictive, stubborn, small, etc. for holding that opinion, on these very pages...
I don't think there is anything at all wrong with this approach. Sure, we often react emotionally, not rationally - being a traditional photography fan does make us feel a tad unwanted by the giants of the industry... but I think in this case it works out to the same thing. Our "hurt feelings" add up tot he same thing as our rational decisions.
And people ask me "If you like it, why stop using it?" - I like Dektol... but I WILL find an alternative or mix my own for one simple reason:
Like most of you I work hard for my money, which gives me the right to choose where I spend it (especially as far as my 'disposible' income is concerned, taxes are a different story ). Its not really a "grudge" to say "no" to a company that outlines the fact that it does NOT want me for a customer in its very mission statement!!!
And I do not see Ilford as the knight in shining armour, I do not think their motives are somehow above commercial realities, pure and chaste and without a dollar or pund among them - I just think this much:
They (Ilford) want to make money and so does Kodak - difference is, one wants to make it by being commited to my interests, the other does not. They chose, and I chose as well - and I would urge anyone who has this decison to make to chose Ilford for one simple reason: your money sent to Kodak money spent beating a dead horse, money sent to Ilford adds up to incentives for them to keep doing what they are doing. Again, not because they are the patron saints of B&W photography, but because this is the path they chose, and we should support them - not out of moral or emotional resaons but simply to build for our future and maybe my kids or yours.

Peter.

Keith Tapscott. said:

I`ll second that, it`s not much fun having to load another film after only 10 exposures with my Mamiya RZ 67 when I`m doing a portrait shoot. It`s a lot more films to load on film spirals and process too.
HEY ILFORD, BRING BACK #220 SIZE ROLLS!

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Try it in a light aircraft and it's ten times worse. I wrote to the company about this some months ago and was told that their machinery for 220 was getting clapped out and it wasn't worth restarting production. Maybe if others who use 220 also wrote it might help. So far this year I have spent over 700 UK pounds on 220 Tri-X. I'd much rather Ilford had had the money, and that I been able to get a finer grained film like Delta, especially as, by the sound of it, Kodak might well not be giving me even the Tri-X option for much longer. Does any one know of any other 400 speed 220 films still available? I know Fuji make a 220, 400 speed colour neg film, but I really need B&W for archival permanence.

David.

Hi
I am from India and love using Ilford films. It is unfortunate that we do not get any Ilford films here anymore. The last time managed to get my hands on an Ilford was in December 2005 - I got a Pan 400. I am sure if properly distributed and marketed they would be a great success in India. We have a large body of photographers in India committed to film photography and specially attached to b&w photography. What you need to do though, is to explain the quality of Ilford vis a vis Tri-X, TMax.

I hope to see Ilford selling soon in India.

Sudeep

Ilford,please bring back 220 to save my fingers on cold days on Ilkley Moor etc!