"Pocket Spot" Mini spot meters are available finally!

Donald Miller · Aug 25, 2005

Apparently you failed to understand my question about IR cutoff. My Zone VI digital (Pentax) has been modified to cut off IR influence that occurs when you photograph foliage...in particular green foliage like pine trees. Does this meter eliminate IR influence in those situations?

Without IR cutoff, a meter will be influence by IR emissions in addition to visible light and thus will indicate an erroneously high meter reading and hence an underexposed negative.

While your description of color influence may apply to other meters it does not apply to the modified Pentax. I have tested the modified Pentax over twenty years of field use and found that I can meter through filters with definable results.

I am not trying to diminish the meter that you address or your enthusiasm for it...I am just trying to determine what this meter is honestly capable of doing.

hortense · Aug 25, 2005

Donald Miller said:
While your description of color influence may apply to other meters it does not apply to the modified Pentax. I have tested the modified Pentax over twenty years of field use and found that I can meter through filters with definable results.
I.

Donald, I agree with you. I've used a modified Pentax Spot Meter since Zone VI introduced the modification to read through filters and found when printing, they are "right on" (even with greens).

User Removed · Aug 25, 2005

The question about IR cutoff is a good question that I cannot answer. I would maybe email Meter Light and ask them, since they ARE the makers of Pocket Spot.

However, it does say that since it is setup to yeild proper exposure on black and white film, results with uncommon black and white films, infrared, red sensitive, and blue sensitive films many vary.

User Removed · Aug 25, 2005

hortense said:
Donald, I agree with you. I've used a modified Pentax Spot Meter since Zone VI introduced the modification to read through filters and found when printing, they are "right on" (even with greens).

Yes, that is why I was compairing this meter to the Penax Zone VI. However, a new Pentax Zone VI meter cost more then 399.00. It also is about 6 times the size and weight.

dancqu · Aug 26, 2005

McPhotoX said:
Yes, that is why I was compairing this meter to the Penax
Zone VI. However, a new Pentax Zone VI meter cost more
then 399.00. It also is about 6 times the size and weight.

A shirt pocket size meter; just the thing. I've come close
with a Sekonic L-228. Ever look at one of those? Dan

User Removed · Aug 26, 2005

Sorry. This thread was not supposed to turn into a "which meter is better" debate. I just wanted to inform people of a great product on the market that I thought lots of photographers might be interested in.

Sure, one meter might do something another does not, and one might be cheeper then the other. Whatever product someone decides to use is their personal preference in their photography. Comparing totally different meters is like comparing apples to oranges.

Even thought the Pocket Spot might not have tons of bells and whisles...I feel it is the most efficient and simple tool to get the job done well.

Ryan McIntosh

laz · Aug 26, 2005

McPhotoX said:
Sorry. This thread was not supposed to turn into a "which meter is better" debate.

Why apologize? FWIW I learned a great deal about the Pocket Spot and now I'm enjoying the debate and learning about other options.

I say thanks for the thread!

-Bob

User Removed · Aug 26, 2005

laz127 said:
Why apologize? FWIW I learned a great deal about the Pocket Spot and now I'm enjoying the debate and learning about other options.

I say thanks for the thread!

-Bob

Well, Okay then! Good!

df cardwell · Aug 26, 2005

Just ordered mine.

And for the Peanut Gallery, over the past 30 years, I've looked at every meter on the market.

User Removed · Aug 26, 2005

I found some information on IR sensitivity in light meters, so I will post it here.

"Why does green always appear in the print darker then it meters? I thought it did that because the film was comparatively insensitive to green or the meter was overly sensitive to green. Wrong......

It isn't the green color that is upsetting the meter, it is the chlorophyll in the foliage which has an interesting idiosyncrasy. Although everything in nature reflects infared light to some extent, foliage can reflect 100% even thought it is preety dark in the visible portion of the light spectrum. The people who design light meters dont worry about these fine points and most meters respond vigirously to infared. The problem is that panchromatic film does not respond to infared at all. That is why you can underexpose foliage by FOUR Zones in late afternoon!..."

Fred Picker. Zone VI Newsleter, #33, September 1982.

He then goes on to talk about how the Zone VI modified meters will not have this problem.

Alexz · Aug 26, 2005

McPhotoX said:
I found some information on IR sensitivity in light meters, so I will post it here.

"Why does green always appear in the print darker then it meters? I thought it did that because the film was comparatively insensitive to green or the meter was overly sensitive to green. Wrong......

It isn't the green color that is upsetting the meter, it is the chlorophyll in the foliage which has an interesting idiosyncrasy. Although everything in nature reflects infared light to some extent, foliage can reflect 100% even thought it is preety dark in the visible portion of the light spectrum. The people who design light meters dont worry about these fine points and most meters respond vigirously to infared. The problem is that panchromatic film does not respond to infared at all. That is why you can underexpose foliage by FOUR Zones in late afternoon!..."

Fred Picker. Zone VI Newsleter, #33, September 1982.

He then goes on to talk about how the Zone VI modified meters will not have this problem.

Wow, very interesting fact (if this is true indeed).
If this is the case, we shall feel exposure problems while using spot metering in color photography also. Spot metering (say, by in-camera spot meter) off the grass or green foliage, the measurment can be thrown away by en excesive IR reflection, so without particular correction that takes into account IR influence, we risk to underexpose severily, unless color films are responsive to IR accordingly (are they ?)

RichSBV · Aug 26, 2005

Just my opinion, but I think if the dropped the price (in half for me) it would sell much better. As stated by someone else, for a simple light meter, it's just too expensive. I would give it the tag a "cute".. I would surely love to own one, but not when I can get a spt meter that also does averaging, zones, flash, etc for half the price... Great for those who think it's worth it...

As far as IR sensitivity. Almost all modern meters have IR blocking filters built-in and are blind to IR light. That should be no problem today. There are exceptions like the Gossen Ultra Spot (may have been changed in the Spot II?).

As many people have sited, almsot all modern meters work just fine through filters. I can meter through any filter with my Minolta Spot Meter F. It has some sensitivity to IR, but not enough to affect standard film... My Mamya L-718's are completely IR blind and work perfectly through any filter... Oddly enough, my old Gossen Luna Pro F's which have a beautiful full sensitivity to IR also work perfectly through any filter. Even an 87C!

And I just can't see this 'story' about the building and sky? The meter simply measures light intensity. If I put a filter in front of my Minolta (or 718 with spot attachment) and there is actually an intensity difference between the building and sky, the meter will read that difference. What kind (and how old?) was that meter the person used to compare? I just don't believe there would be a difference with modern meters...

All that said, I'm not trying to knock this little spot. I just don't see it as being something magical with properties no other meter has... And it's just too expensive...

laz · Aug 26, 2005

RichSBV said:
I would surely love to own one, but not when I can get a spt meter that also does averaging, zones, flash, etc for half the price...

Okay, I'm putting you on the spot and will ask what $200 meter do you have in mind?

-B

RichSBV · Aug 26, 2005

That's all I paid for both my SPot Meter F's... Used of course, but like new in both looks and function. Yes, I know I'm comparing new to used, but cost is cost and function is function. How many of us here have never bought used?

Ooops, I lied ;-) The "F's" were more like $275 or so. It was the model "M" (no flash) that was ~$200... Sorry...

And if I'n not mistaken, isn't the Soligor/Adorama spot meter ~200 new?

df cardwell · Aug 26, 2005

The Spotmeter F doesn't "see" the same as your film.

For that matter, which film is important, becuase they ALL have different sensitivities.

REALLY. The Spotmeter F is a convenient, all-around meter for commercial use (like shooting chromes in the studio, then shooting chromes in the field) but it is a big step below the Zone VI spot for critically filtered B&W.

If you get mysterious exposure issues throughout a range of exposure values, have your Spot Fs recalibrated... they DO go out.

Since I've been trying to pick up a new Zone VI, and the timing was always off, I jumped all over the Pocket Spot.

Loose Gravel · Aug 26, 2005

I have tested my Pocket Spot through filters onto HP5+ film. I photo'd a grey card through all the different filters I had, blue to red --- including green, yellow and the lot. I metered through the filter and then made the exposure appropriately. Developed the film and measured all the frames with a densitometer. I don't think there was more than a 1/6 of a stop one way or the other.

Also, you could probably run over this meter with a truck and it would work. After having my Pentax calibrated so many times, I know that isn't true about Pentax. It is an added cost of Pentax. I think it was $60 to cal.

As far as costs, well $400 is less than a Pentax was and way less than a Z6 Modified Pentax. Let's not forget that this is a new piece of gear designed specifically for the analog photo market. You don't see that much anymore. When was the last time dear old Kodak did us any favors?

laz · Aug 26, 2005

Just want to pop in and say I am still thoroughly enjoying this thread and learning alot. I must say that I've spun around on my opinion of the Pocket Spot several times and I'm not quite sure what direction I'm pointing at the moment!

(although the "running it over with a truck and it would work" is a major plus. We all know what penny-wise pound-foolish holds very true with Photo gear!)

User Removed · Aug 27, 2005

The Pocket Spot is milled out of a solid block of anodized aluminum! There is no seams, screws ect holding it together. It is such a clean and simple design, that it makes it more durable and rugged.

dancqu · Aug 27, 2005

McPhotoX said:
The Pocket Spot is milled out of a solid block of anodized
aluminum! There is no seams, screws ect holding it together.
It is such a clean and simple design, that it makes it more
durable and rugged.

Prepare for a shock. More likely the case is a seamless
extrusion. The two ends are likely press fits. It must be
sent in to adjust. They have the special tool to do that.

Nice clean job no doubt. Do you think my observation
possibly the case? Dan

Andrew Forrester · Aug 27, 2005

Here is are a couple of links you may find interesting

http://www.butzi.net/reviews/pocketspot.htm

http://www.butzi.net/articles/zone VI worth it.htm

df cardwell · Aug 31, 2005

My PocketSpot arrived and it is... perfect.
Ordered Friday, arrived Wednesday.

laz · Sep 1, 2005

So, I've been out there in the trenches looking at used spot meters all week. (ebay as well as just about every web outlet for used equipment) Some of the prices mentioned here are a bit outdated, like everything else prices have risen, sometimes to a ridiculous height;Zone VI modifieds are just out of this world for used!

But is the PS truely Zone modified or does it just have some of the features?

We all know that what constitutes a good or fair price is completely relative; one man's bargin is another rip-off. However, we can reduce some of the subjectiveness by trying to compare just the features that are common to both: So, lets drop off the convienance and durability of the PS even though that seems to be it's biggest plus. And let's go with a new middle of the road spot meter as comparison, I'll choose the Adorama digital spot.

The question now becomes one of how do the plain ordinary light meter functions compare. What additional features do I get with the Adorama and how useful are they. How about ambient metering? how useful is ambient? I admit to being a bit confused by the bore sight of the PS vs. how the Adorama does sighting, how can they be the same? Can we compare them?

Are there other plain vanilla things we can compare?

What we'll be left with are a list of features such as size with which to judge the "value" an individuel can place on each. And get closer to answering the question of does the extra $150 for the PS make it a worthwhile choice?

:rolleyes: Is all the above just a too tedious or bogus exersize? Should I just shut up and make a personal choice? I know someone is going to take that last question and answer with the single word "Yes" but lets assume that's been done

-Bob

GM Bennett · Sep 1, 2005

Pocket Spot Meters are backordered...

df cardwell said:
My PocketSpot arrived and it is... perfect.
Ordered Friday, arrived Wednesday.

You guys were lucky to get one so fast.

After reading the discussion here, and Paul Butzi's review, I thought the pocket spot would be a nice alternative to my Gossen Spot Master, which is accurate but huge, and tends to eat 9v batteries if they are left in the meter too long.

I had a nice e-mail from Kurt at Metered Light, that the pocket spot is now on back order due to word of mouth (like this, I assume), for at least a week.

Graham

User Removed · Sep 1, 2005

I am glad that Pocket Spot is back to selling meters again. It was nearly a year before I could finally get mine, so now I guess everyone is jumping on top of them as well!

As for compairing the PS to any other meter on the market, I feel that the ONLY meter that it should be compaired too is the Pentax Zone VI modified Meter. Of course there is the obvious differences like size, weight, durablity, and price...in which the PS comes out on top in each catagory.

One big advantage that the pocket spot has over the Pentax is its longer EV value range, reading between -2 to 22 EV. If I remember right, the Pentax reads from 2-20? This means that the PS can read light in darker shadows, and brighter areas, more then the Pentax is capable of reading.

dancqu · Sep 1, 2005

[QUOTES=McPhotoX]
"As for comparing the PS to any other meter on the market,
I feel that the ONLY meter that it should be compared too
is the Pentax Zone VI modified Meter."

The only realistic comparison is with the Sekonic L-228.
It is also a Pocket Spot meter. I picked up one in mint minus
condition complete with a fine kid leather case and instructions
from eBay for under $50.

Like every other meter except the Zone VI, it
is unmodified. Dan

"Pocket Spot" Mini spot meters are available finally!

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