Plus-X vs T max

So, I have been out of photography for a while. I have searched around the web and this site and can't really find the sort of discussion I am looking for, so I will just ask.

I am going to Ethiopia in 3 weeks. I am getting my first 35mm film camera in 20 years shipped to me tomorrow, so I am not really going to have a lot of time to experiment before I go.

I plan on taking city shots of addis ababa and maybe some outdoor and indoor portraits of my sister and her new son.

Anyway, way back in 1985 I was shooting plus-x and tri-x B/W film. I see that Kodak has a new (to me) film in Tmax.

What are the practical differences between these films and what is the current feeling here about them? I have a historical attachment to kodak b/w film, but no real other reason to use them. Any other suggestions.

I will be shooting with a canon AE1-program with 3 lenses at my disposal: 28mm 2.8, 50mm 1.8, 70-210 ?.

TIA. Sorry for the newb question.

MolBasser

If you liked Plus-X in 1985, most likely you will like Plus-X now. It hasn't changed much.

I shoot Plus-X regularly, although mostly in 120 recently.

Tmax 100 is sufficiently different from Plus-X to make it worth trying, and I like it, but I don't think it is a good candidate for first time experimentation while in Ethiopia (or any other such major trip).

Matt

I agree with Matt. Both are great films, but if you are familiar with Plus-X I would take that on a trip to Ethiopia. T-Max can be kind of finicky if you haven't used it. T-max is much finer grained, but Plus-X has a really nice grain (to me anyway!)

I think that the most obvious(at least to my eyes) is this:

Traditional look(grain-wise)=PX or practically grainless(TMAX)?

both are GREAT films, but having shot TMAX(400 mostly, with some smatterings of 100 here and there) for over 2 years now, I'm going back to the traditional films more and more now, for more of a "traditional, old school look". now, there are obvious ways of increasing contrast and grain in the TMAX, but not enough to really look like TRI-X or Plus-X.

so, I'd assess the look that you're going for, and get that. ONLY you can make the final decision.

just so you know, the Arista Premium 100/400 films are pretty much undoubtedly re-badged Plus-X and Tri-x. just at 1/2 the price .

freestyle is the only place to get em. they're darn tootin' cheap for a 36xp roll too! I love the 400 for loading up in my p+s cameras when I go out with friends. souped in HC-110 dil H, gets me what I want, and its stupid cheap . that's IF you soup your own.

-Dan

check out freestyle's page for more info on the 100/400 A.Prem films

http://www.freestylephoto.biz/arista_premium.php

-Dan

Thanks for that!

MolBasser

I am experimenting with Tmax-400. It took me 4 rolls to come fairly close to the result I can accept. The first roll was awful in one way. The second roll was pretty bad the other way (I over corrected). I have been narrowing down the difference ever since. I find, processing Tmax requires pretty accurate temperature, agitation, and time. I don't recall having this much problem 25 years ago!!

I think I'd be reasonably ok in two more rolls...

You already have a film you are familiar with.... and you can always take that... but why don't you just experiment with Tmax and see what you think? Tmax400 is so fine grain that it favorably compare with ISO100 film of the last generation. I plan to stick with it for a while.

I find that Tmax 100 to be a great film, though I used it in 4x5 more than in 35mm (actually used it in 120 and liked it).

I think you will find that the Tmax film will be more forgiving in exposure than the Plus-X, but as tkamiya mentioned, it is much less forgiving in its developing.

After being away from film photography for 25 years, I don't think familarity with Plus-X is a big factor. No matter what film you use, once you get back from your trip, you should consider shooting a few rolls of the same film and "practice" developing those rolls before developing the rolls from your trip. And, of course, quickly shoot a couple of rolls before you go, just to check out the camera and meter. If you are running out of time, you can shoot some slide film and have it processed locally to get quick feedback on the camera and lenses. If you have one, you might include a gray card in some of your shots as an exposure reference.

Hell, take a bunch of both films, shoot a lot, bracket a bunch. Film is dirt cheap compared to all your other expenses, so burn it up like a big dog!

And DO NOT put your film in your check-in baggage!!!!! The X-rays will turn it into toast. A few times through the carry-on x-ray machines will be fine...especially with the ASA 125 or 100 films. In the USA, you can hand the unopened, sealed film to the TSA folks and ask for a hand inspection -- may not work overseas. That will reduce some of the exposure.

A good friend, great photographer and local photo teacher at the Junior College was with the Peace Corps in Ethiopa many many years ago. His stories are great -- have a blast!

Vaughn

I have used both Plus-X and T-Max and like them for different reasons. You could bring both, for the hell of it.

Jeff

Since you're just getting back into it, I'd stick with the old Plus-X/Tri-X combo for your trip and save the T-Max for when you've more leisure to experiment with it.

Tabular grain film like T-Max is worth checking out for what it offers, but as others have already said, it's not only different in visual character, but also pickier in processing. No real reason to take on those uncertainties when you're going to be shooting somewhere you're not normally going to be around.

I have tried both, and both have their uses. I think that for a city like Addis Ababa, Plus-X would make a better choice, just based on the grain working with the architecture and the environment.

Plus-X is my favorite, although some of my favorite photos from Ethiopia were taken on Delta 100...I don't remember why but I didn't have enough Plus-X to bring only that.




I went around this time of year and it was super-sunny every day. Almost everything was shot on Plus-X, Delta 100, Reala. The only higher-speed film I used was a couple rolls of 400NC, and it was definitely overkill in most cases, I just used it because I'd brought it and didn't have enough extra of the low-speed stuff. Tmax (or Tri-X) could be great for indoor portraits but for outdoors, unless you want a lot of night shots, it probably won't be necessary.

In general I like both Plus-X and Tri-X much more than old Tmax, but am running through a roll of new Tmax now to see how it looks.

In my opinion, a trip abroad is not, again in my opinion, the place to test a new film. You may find your ISO is different than the manufacturers in your lab and/or for your shooting style. I would stick with what you know until you develop an eye for how the new material works for you. It's not just about grain, it's about tonal scale, processing variations and exposure methods.

~Steve Sloan

I just re-read the original post in context....

He said, he is getting his first 35mm camera in 20 years. He also said, his previous experience with B&W film was from 1985.

This tells me few things. His "new" camera isn't brand new. It needs to be tested few times before taking it to a big trip. It also means, he has not shot or developed film in 24 years. This time table kind of echos mine. When the time span is this big, memory is fuzzy. All I remember is, I had some image. I don't recall characteristics or quality of image. I was younger, too, and prospective was different. Yay, I developed film! was the extent.

Developing was something else, too. I had to read and make mistakes as if it were the first time. I wouldn't trust myself to process important image for the first few times.

What I would encourage is to just pick a film, run few rolls through their paces, develop them and make sure major screw up will be done and over with. With such a limited time available to test, I'd work on avoiding major disappointments - not fine differences between films.

I think his issue will be somewhere other than choice of the film to be honest. Of course, I made a whole bunch of assumptions based on few paragraphs. I could be way off.

Either way, enjoy your trip, new camera, and re-entry to B&W photography!

experience...

seems like t-max 400 and delta 400 are amazing forgiving films in both exposure and developing with almost no grain
finding grain is like finding waldo

when bracketing do +/-3 to have much of an effect, mostly due to latitude
magical speed seems to be about 1/250, but also works at 1250