Please help! looking to use 120 film back on my 4x5 camera

Analog_life · Nov 8, 2023

Hello!

I am hoping someone can help me with my quest to shoot 6x17 120 film on my 4x5 camera since I don't have a kidney to sell for a dedicated 6x17 camera.

I have a Lostus view camera which does not have a Graf lock back (please see picture attached) the ground glass does not come out to fit the 120 film back.

Any suggestion on modifications or available kits?

Many thanks to you all!

Farouk

MattKing · Nov 8, 2023

Welcome to Photrio.
Technically speaking, a 4x5 camera isn't big enough to create a 6x17 negative - you need at least a whole plate or 5x7 camera to get a 17 cm long negative.
6x12 is certainly achievable though.

Analog_life · Nov 8, 2023

Matt thank you for the reply.

I thought it was possible with the right film back and a lens that covers the angle which my 150mm does.

Romanko · Nov 8, 2023

A 6 x 12 cm film insert for your glass plate holder could be a good starting point. It can be made out of sheet metal or even cardboard. Since you are using a view camera I doubt that you will be able to fully utilize the speed and convenience of a roll film back.

DREW WILEY · Nov 8, 2023

You could order a custom 4X5 to 5X7 extender back for your Lotus, and then use a special 5X7 film holder with a two narrow darkslides in it, for sake of 6X17 shots on each piece of film. Or, just take a regular 5X7 shot and crop it. Under your circumstances, 6X12 is more realistic. Without Graflok capability, you'd need a slide-in holder instead, capable of that proportion, like a Sinar Vario, PROVIDED the thickness of a slide-in holder can be accommodated by your existing back. It would be smart to contact Lotus before taking your next step.

Dustin McAmera · Nov 8, 2023

Shen Hao does/did a 6x17 'Art Panorama' back for 4x5-inch, but it does go on a Graflok back. Badger Graphic is offering it for sale now.

There is/was a Sinar RFB; I think it's called Zoom and has a mask insert called Vario, which allows formats up to 6x12 and inserts behind the screen in the same way as the much-more-common Calumet 6x7 back. I bet it's rare to find.
Here's the instructions for it:

https://sinar.swiss/assets/Uploads/GA-Rollfilm-Holder-Zoom2-EN.PDF

mshchem · Nov 8, 2023

I would call Badger Graphic, this is what they are experts on. You may need to get a different camera.

Sharktooth · Nov 8, 2023

It's probably easiest and cheapest to just shoot 4x5, and crop the final image to the aspect ratio you desire. There's no ready-made accessory that will do this on your Lotus, so you'll spend a lot of time and effort working on a "kludge" that may or may not work well, and could also be quite expensive. That doesn't make sense if you just want to try the format, so why not use what you already have for the moment.

If you find that you really do like this format, and you want to shoot most of your images like that, then at that point you can decide if it makes economic sense to go to a real 6x17 camera.

_T_ · Nov 8, 2023

There’s a sinar vario on ebay atm going for around $500. The seller doesn’t specialize in photo gear and the description states “seems to be working”. If it’s functional and fits in your camera, that’s going to be the cheapest way to shoot 6x12 roll film on your camera.

But for 500 dollars you could buy like 200 sheets of 4x5 HP5, shoot that and crop it. So you’d have to shoot something like a minimum of 55 rolls of 120 film through it before it would become worth buying it.

koraks · Nov 9, 2023

Analog_life said:
I thought it was possible with the right film back and a lens that covers the angle which my 150mm does

5" = 12.7cm
6x17 has a nominal length of 17cm (in reality, negatives will be 16.xx cm)

So 6x17cm simply doesn't fit in a 4x5" area. Hence, a 6x17 back for a 4x5" camera will need to extend to the back in order for the larger image circle to be projected onto the film plane. Yes, it's possible, but it's not the kind of back you see for 6x7 up to 6x12 formats. Not all field cameras support such a roll film back.

_T_ said:
But for 500 dollars you could buy like 200 sheets of 4x5 HP5, shoot that and crop it.

That's a very sane comment.
For color film, it's a little different, though.

guangong · Nov 9, 2023

Sharktooth said:
It's probably easiest and cheapest to just shoot 4x5, and crop the final image to the aspect ratio you desire. There's no ready-made accessory that will do this on your Lotus, so you'll spend a lot of time and effort working on a "kludge" that may or may not work well, and could also be quite expensive. That doesn't make sense if you just want to try the format, so why not use what you already have for the moment.

If you find that you really do like this format, and you want to shoot most of your images like that, then at that point you can decide if it makes economic sense to go to a real 6x17 camera.

Simple solutions are never welcome.

Ian Grant · Nov 9, 2023

There's a downside to extension backs, you are very limited in terms of the Focal Length lenses you can use with them. I looked into it some years ago and bought a dedicated 6x17 camera. I use a 75mm f8 Super Angulon with mine, with no Centre filter you need careful exposure and development as you have to dodge the edges quite a bit so yo don't want under-exposure, I have no problems with my 75mm f5.6 on my 5x4 cameras. I now have a couple of Centre filters.

Ian

Dustin McAmera · Nov 9, 2023

I guess you could make a half-height dark-slide to mask half the 4x5-inch frame. Then you can make two 2x5-inch exposures on each sheet; use rise/fall to centre the lens in the reduced frame. It would add a bit of extra business to each exposure, with extra risk of getting confused. You'd need to keep on top of which half you'd exposed. It's not as wide a shape as 6x17, but wider than 6x12; and it would only cost you the price of a dark-slide and a bit of cutting.

neilt3 · Nov 9, 2023

_T_ said:
But for 500 dollars you could buy like 200 sheets of 4x5 HP5, shoot that and crop it. So you’d have to shoot something like a minimum of 55 rolls of 120 film through it before it would become worth buying it.

Quite right .
I tend to use Fomapan 200 quite a bit , that's currently about £50 a box of 50 , used to be much less .
But for $500 , you can still get around 500 sheets of film to just crop .
That's a lot of film , and you've still got the option of not cropping , without carrying extra gear .

Analog_life · Nov 9, 2023

Thank you all for all your suggestions. I really appreciated it.

I decided to just keep shooting 4x5 with this cameras, I placed an order for a Chroma camera 6x17 3d printed with a cone that fits my current lens for about $550. that's the best solution I came up with.

Thank you!

Charlie Brown · Jun 20, 2024

Analog_life said:
Thank you all for all your suggestions. I really appreciated it.

I decided to just keep shooting 4x5 with this cameras, I placed an order for a Chroma camera 6x17 3d printed with a cone that fits my current lens for about $550. that's the best solution I came up with.

Thank you!

I just ordered the Chroma Six:17 with an extra back. Have you been happy with it?

Please help! looking to use 120 film back on my 4x5 camera

Analog_life

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