Plate holder madness

Ole · Aug 4, 2006

In an attempt to get hold of some plate holders for my 6.5x9cm KW Patent Etui, I bought a boxfull of plate holders on German ebay.

The attempt was successful, I got nine fine KaWee holders in great shape!

So now I have most of a boxfull of plate holders which I just don't need...

Instead of putting them in the "classifieds", I decided to mention them here:

Stereo plate holders:
5x Zeiss Ikon 721/004, 6x13cm plates.
1x Ica 721/001, 4.5x10.7cm plates.
3x nameless, 4.5x10.7cm plates, very small holders without flange.

10x15cm - one holder, flange along both sides, no flange on bottom.
9x12cm: Several, various designs. I'm keeping the "millionenfalz" ones, they fit my Voigtländers and Rodenstock

4.5x6cm: Several shiny ones, marked "EGLÉ Breveté SGDG", no flange.
A couple of Ernemann ones, with flanges.
Several Ica ones, some marked "721 33", some "721 14". The "33" look similar to the Ernemanns.
A lot of nameless ones, some with the "crinkle finish" similar to my best Voigtländer-compatible 9x12cm holders. Same flanges too - maybe I should look for a 4.5x6cm plate camera instead?

I'm not trying (hard) to sell these, but if anyone has a "need" for them they can have them. If anyone has information about them, that would be welcome too!

George Papantoniou · Aug 4, 2006

Hi cousin...

I have two packets of (almost) 100 year old glass plates (Gevaert and Lumiere) that are 9x12 in size. Would they fit in one of your holders ? Would the holder then fit in one of my 4x5 cameras (even with the help of a home-made adaptor) ?? Then I would surely be interested, because the only other way I thought of using them in-camera would be to use double-sided tape and stick them on 4x5 holders (fidelity), but that's a drag...

Ole · Aug 4, 2006

George,

I also have a nice Linhof plate-holder-adapter for international (or spring) back 4x5", with matching plate holder. Or perhaps a "real" Linhof Universal film&plate holder "mit Auswerfer" for 9x12cm film or plates?

I use some 9x12cm plates myself, but mostly in 9x12cm plate cameras...

Mike Kovacs · Aug 4, 2006

George, why not spend $25-100 on a decent 9x12 plate camera? Probably cheaper than adapting to a 4x5 camera.

Ole if you ever have any for the 9x12 KW Patent Etui for sale I'd like to know Actually, I do have 5 holders for it which should be enough for most days but I haven't tested them yet.

George Papantoniou · Aug 5, 2006

Mike, I'm not really the old camera collecting type. But I would gladly give 25-50 bucks for a working camera that will expose my plates. Do you have a suggestion ?

On the other hand, I can borrow an adapter from my cousin Ole (if he is so kind as to lend it to me) and shoot them with my beloved Super Technika... After all, it's just two boxes and they will not last forever... after they have been shot, I won't have anything to do with the 9x12 camera.

Dear Ole, will you lend me an adapter that I can use on my Linhof 4x5 with the glass plates ? On my part, I can offer you a series of nice prints that will come from these plates a while after I use them...

Ole · Aug 5, 2006

Sure George, send me your address and I'll send you the adapter and a 9x12 plate holder. I'll even test it first.

Ole · Aug 5, 2006

Mike Kovacs said:
Ole if you ever have any for the 9x12 KW Patent Etui for sale I'd like to know Actually, I do have 5 holders for it which should be enough for most days but I haven't tested them yet.

Mike, I think I do. I'll look through the stack - I assume they look about the same as the 6.5x9 holders, only bigger? And won't fit the Voigtländers correctly?

big_ben_blue · Aug 5, 2006

Ole, sounds like your quest to find proper plate holderes were a bit more succesful than mine.
Try locating Thornton Pickard bookcase style holders in 5x7, LOL. Sure, there's no shortage of quarter, half, and full plate sized holders, but nothing in 5x7. Oh, and don't get me started on full plate holders to fit Cycle Graphics - a gazillion different variations in holder styles out there, but none fits the camera in question properly (having spent 40USD for a single holder just to find out it won't fit can most certainly ruin one's day).

Cheers,
Chris

Ole · Aug 5, 2006

Chris, 13x18cm bookstyle holders are very common in Europe. Unfortunately they come in about 100 different external sizes, only one of which will fit any given camera. I was fortunate enough to get a 13x18 plate camera with four matching holders. Three of the holders can take 5x7" film inserts, in the fourth one they will slip. Apart from that I can find no difference between them, even all internal measurements are the same!

Mike Kovacs · Aug 5, 2006

They are similar to the Voigtlanders, but I am told they are a little shorter. I don't have a Voigtlander holders to compare though.

The three original KW holders I own have spring loaded tabs that pop out when you pull the dark slide to remind you the plate is exposed. Nifty!

Ole · Aug 5, 2006

Mike Kovacs said:
They are similar to the Voigtlanders, but I am told they are a little shorter. I don't have a Voigtlander holders to compare though.

Yup. Four of them, and a fifth the same size with a slightly different flange (the flange stops a cm from the top, it goes to full thickness). All a little shorter than the Voigtländer holders I have.

Ole · Aug 5, 2006

Oh and...

If anyone else wants a tiny little plate camera, there's one here: http://cgi.ebay.de/KW-PATENT-ETUI-K...ryZ33193QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I'm just trying to keep myself from bidding

Mike Kovacs · Aug 5, 2006

Eine sehr schoene Kamera! Wire transfer is not worth the service fee from North America though.

Mine has the triplet Schneider Radionar but is 9x12. The Tessar would be wicked.

bart Nadeau · Aug 6, 2006

Hello Ole -

Although beyond the scope of your original post, I have a question on european style film holder that I hope you could share some light on.
In a weak moment I bought an Ica 5x7 Universal Jewul in what appears to be very nice condition. It has a spring back, not as a standard US camera does, but it isn't a slide on back like my 10x15 Ica Maximar either. The spring back on the Jewul appears only to open enough for a very thin holder. I took the ground glass off and it appears that the holder must have outside dimensions of about 157 x 208 mm but that the holder must have a rebate to fit over a thin ridge that measures 131 x 181 with an actual film or plate window of about 129 x 170.
I'm not sure my description is clear enough to make sense but does this sound like any 13 x 18 holder you have heard of?
Thank you for any information.

Bart

Ole · Aug 6, 2006

bart Nadeau said:
I'm not sure my description is clear enough to make sense but does this sound like any 13 x 18 holder you have heard of?

It does - "sound like any 13x18 holder I've ever heard about".

But I don't have any of them - the only single-plate 13x18 holder I have is a Linhof one which is different. I can't find any of them through a quick search through "the usual suspects" either, more's the pity...

bart Nadeau · Aug 6, 2006

Ole -
Appreciate the info. Can you suggest any dealers over there who might have such things. I Googled them a while back without success. I would like to actually use this camera some time.

Thanks,
Bart

Ole · Aug 7, 2006

One possible source is http://www.oldcameras.at/englisch/index_e.htm - another is http://www.photographica-world.de/.

big_ben_blue · Aug 7, 2006

Ole said:
Chris, 13x18cm bookstyle holders are very common in Europe. Unfortunately they come in about 100 different external sizes, only one of which will fit any given camera. I was fortunate enough to get a 13x18 plate camera with four matching holders. Three of the holders can take 5x7" film inserts, in the fourth one they will slip. Apart from that I can find no difference between them, even all internal measurements are the same!

Ole, you are right, on second look, my TP appears to be a 13x18 model. Well, these things might be common in Europe, but certainly not in Canada. Guess I have to scour fleabay a bit more intensively.

Cheers,
Chris

bart Nadeau · Aug 7, 2006

Ole said:
One possible source is http://www.oldcameras.at/englisch/index_e.htm - another is http://www.photographica-world.de/.

Ole - Thank you for the suggestions. I will email them.
Bart

Ole · Aug 7, 2006

big_ben_blue said:
Ole, you are right, on second look, my TP appears to be a 13x18 model. Well, these things might be common in Europe, but certainly not in Canada. Guess I have to scour fleabay a bit more intensively.

A Thornton-Picard should be 5x7", if not half-plate? On the other hand it could be an "export model"... 13x18cm are more a "continental" size.

big_ben_blue · Aug 7, 2006

Ole said:
A Thornton-Picard should be 5x7", if not half-plate? On the other hand it could be an "export model"... 13x18cm are more a "continental" size.

OK, now you got me seriously confused. The inside dimensions of my holder are 13.1 x 18.1; so it's definitely not a half plate. I got the camera from a guy in Florida actually (America didn't appear to be a prime market for TP's). Anyway, I still only have ONE lonely holder, which doesn't make for extended shooting sessions, LOL. And now I'm worried to hunt for the wrong holder.

Cheers,
Chris

Ole · Aug 8, 2006

big_ben_blue said:
OK, now you got me seriously confused. The inside dimensions of my holder are 13.1 x 18.1; so it's definitely not a half plate. ...

That certainly looks like the dimensions for a 13x18cm plate camera, yes.

I've also got a camera with only one holder. But in my case that's a good thing, as I discover every time I lift the camera and holder: It's a Russian 30x40cm plate camera...

George Papantoniou · Aug 8, 2006

If I had so many different cameras (in so many different formats) and so many different holders to fit so many different film and plate sizes, I'd go nuts (really, this time)... :confused:

Ole · Aug 8, 2006

No worries George, I've been nuts for a long time. See the title of this thread...

I currently use 6.5x9cm (two different holders, three cameras), 9x12cm (Voigtländer holders, Linhof adapter, or Linhof Universal holders, or "Regular holders for 4x5" cameras), 4x5" (only regular holders, except I have a 4x5" Linhof Universal holder if I should ever need it), 5x7" (regular holders, plate holder and adapter or Linhof Universal), 13x18cm (Same Linhof Universal, regular holders, and book-style plate holders with film sheaths), 18x24cm (book-style, with film sheath), 24x30cm (book-style again) and 30x40cm (ditto).

And today I was going out to take some 4x5" B&W pictures: A freezer full of film contained every possible size except 4x5" B&W... I shot colour instead.

meltronic · Aug 8, 2006

Ole, are any of your 9x12 holders branded "Contessa Nettel"? If so I'd love to have them. I think they may be the same as Fotokor 9x12, but I've never tried those. If you have any Fotokor holders, I suppose I'd like to try those too. I have only 5 holders for my Contessa Nettel Tessco now, so I'm anxious to get hold of a few more.

By the way, when I say "have them", I do mean "pay for them" of course.

Yours,
Matt

I've attached some pics to guide you!

Plate holder madness

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