Photography with Color Head of an Enlarger

[Mustafa Umut Sarac]

Has anyone tried to control colors with color head attached camera during photography. I found that it could be a good idea.
I think 35mm color heads are usable at travel , I dont know the sizes of larger formats .

There is even an lens on the head and there are excellent ones like rodenstock, color enlargers are cheap and dissambling the color head may be is about
removing the head from geared rail. May be a lens with a shutter could be attached to the one of the boards also.

I was thinking that there was a need an LCD Color change filter for polychromy- rgb+orange+ violet+different tones of rgb colors etc- but an color head could satisfy that and more.

Umut

 

[ic-racer]

The filters in color heads only cover a portion of the light path. They need a mixing box to make the light even, so they would only be good as a light source; you can't pass focused light through the head to make a picture. If you try to take a picture through the dichroic assembly of an enlarger head, it will act like a graded filter. That is, only one edge of the image will have the color.

A common non-darkroom use for color heads is a light source to color correct (or manipulate) copies from slides (transparencies). Either by copying with a film or digital camera.
Picture shows an enlarger converted to a copy stand and a Omega Chromega D Dichroic head used as a light source for slide copies (no slide is present in the picture, but it would be above or below the glass).



If you were to place the filters exactly at the nodal point in the lens, you could get a more even coloration. This was done with the Janpol enlarger lens (which may be adapted to a 35mm camera for close-up photography.)

 

[Mustafa Umut Sarac]

Hello,

I can invent the wheel , if the color head is only for rgb or cmy - whatever- separately , can we take one frame for one color and than match at computer. I dont know any flexible analog color control system and if you want to desaturate the image and if you have color pallette and color index numbers for sky , dress , skin , or limelight in your mind , color head could help.

Give me some information or think about it for to invent the wheel.

thanks,

umut

 

[Mustafa Umut Sarac]

If you were to place the filters exactly at the nodal point in the lens, you could get a more even coloration. This was done with the Janpol enlarger lens (which may be adapted to a 35mm camera for close-up photography.)

why close up ? What is the price of that lens used ?

Lets simulate,

We have a red flower blossom tree , red is 80 magenta , 70 yellow , 10 cyan.

How can we desaturate or saturate with that lens ?

Umut

 

[ic-racer]

Close-up because if you want to focus the lens, you will need a focusing bellows and it may not collapse enough to get infinity focus. For example minimum extension might be 50mm which needs to be added to the flange distance of the camera (46.5mm for Nikon). This total needs to be less then the "Flange-Focal" measurement of the lens (for example 77.5mm for a 80mm Schneider Componon-S; unknown distance for the Janpol)

Desaturation not possible. Saturation is a function of film chemistry and processing. Filters can only change relationships between the colors.

https://www.google.com/search?q=JANPOL+Color&rlz=1C5CHFA_enUS532US532&es_sm=91&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=WVZnVYHKIcKWygSOwIGoDA&ved=0CAgQ_AUoAg&biw=1341&bih=1194

 

[Mustafa Umut Sarac]

ic-racer,

Thank you very much for your answers.

you said :Filters can only change relationships between the colors.

Can you please explain that ? I am totally idiot on that.

Thank you very much , by the way , you mean with filters as janpol lens , dont you ?

I am sorry about my ignorance.

Umut

 

[ic-racer]

you said :Filters can only change relationships between the colors.

Can you please explain that ?

Perhaps PE can describe better, but just to say that in the entire book "Photographic Sensitometry" by Todd and Zakia, the word "Saturation" is not listed in the book. The intensity of colors is related to the contrast of the individual emulsions and the book goes into great depth on that. The control of contrast is at the emulsion creation and processing level.

Perhaps there is a treatise on "The Science of Unnatural Color" as it related to film, but from my perspective, "Saturation" is either a knob on an old TV set or a menu item on a digital photography system.

 

[Mustafa Umut Sarac]

I know Hue and Chroma. I dont know how to connect that in to janpol lens ?

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Hello,

I can invent the wheel , if the color head is only for rgb or cmy - whatever- separately , can we take one frame for one color and than match at computer. I dont know any flexible analog color control system and if you want to desaturate the image and if you have color pallette and color index numbers for sky , dress , skin , or limelight in your mind , color head could help.

Give me some information or think about it for to invent the wheel.

thanks,

umut

sorry umut,I don't understand what you are trying to do here.:confused:

 

[Mustafa Umut Sarac]

Hi all and Ralph,

I thought color head as bandpass filter and optical color intensifier. I was wrong ! I am collecting information about bandpass filters and intensifier glass and dyes.

Its about reinventing oil painting art of an artist.

What was the color of the original ?
How he applied 3d optical transfer function to grade change and volume change on to his 2d canvas.
What was the color pallette materials , how he mixed them and intensify the colors .
How many layers did he use and what information -spatial- he hided
How he reliefed the image with paint ?
Which colors of original he band pass filtered and how he improved it.

I am trying to find technics to apply my photos and everyones photos.
I have few answers but I have to find a dye collection to filter and intensify colors just as rembrandt.
I have to find formulas to apply on leitz microscope relief technology to two side printed melinex film spatial composition.
I have to find a way to variable bandpass filter the original , I am reading fabbry perot but I dont think these coated mirrors serve at photography light but I am hopeful

 

[DREW WILEY]

The bulbs and even electronics can be pretty fragile if bounced around a bit. Colorheads were never built for routine travel like pro flash
units, for example. Modern colorheads do not use dyed filters. They use dichroic filtration which is subject to both the angle of incidence of
the light and the operating temp of the glass to which this coating is applied. You can get optical textbooks explaining all this. Then the light
needs to get evening mixed for diffusion. Subtractive vs additive filtration works quite differently, with the latter being much more difficult
from an engineering standpoint, but also cleaner in terms of hue accuracy. This is a different field than film sensitometry. Industrial filter
manufacturers have people on staff who can custom design coatings to do just about anything (for a price). But they have phD's in this specific field.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Has anyone tried to control colors with color head attached camera during photography. I found that it could be a good idea.
I think 35mm color heads are usable at travel , I dont know the sizes of larger formats .

There is even an lens on the head and there are excellent ones like rodenstock, color enlargers are cheap and dissambling the color head may be is about
removing the head from geared rail. May be a lens with a shutter could be attached to the one of the boards also.

I was thinking that there was a need an LCD Color change filter for polychromy- rgb+orange+ violet+different tones of rgb colors etc- but an color head could satisfy that and more.

Umut

Umut, You always have been very creative but,You must cut down on that turkish coffee;too much of it is not good for you

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Hello,

I can invent the wheel , if the color head is only for rgb or cmy - whatever- separately , can we take one frame for one color and than match at computer. I dont know any flexible analog color control system and if you want to desaturate the image and if you have color pallette and color index numbers for sky , dress , skin , or limelight in your mind , color head could help.

Give me some information or think about it for to invent the wheel.

thanks,

umut

If anybody can do it

 

[Mustafa Umut Sarac]

Hello all and our dear Ralph,

I drink a middle ages irish priest invention , not whisky - no money for it - but we call it light diet coca cola , I drink a liter / day.

I had been forgotten that thread , thank you awaking me , as you know autochrome have many colored starches in its filter , 2 different green , 2 different violet and many more for to create the rrggbb filter.

I always asked myself how to create these colors easily on camera , that lens , polish invention , saint paul or whatever its name , satisfy that need. Thank you very much Ralph , my sister is upset with my cafein and cigarette consumption , And for APUG and my sister, I will
quit smoking.

Cheers and happy holiday,

umut

 

[fdonadio]

Umut,


If you do want some encouragement, I've quit smoking for 8 months now and feel great. It's a really good sensation. If you feel you can do it, just go ahead. It's worth it.


Flavjo


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