Petzval Lens Enthusiasts

smieglitz

Thanks Andrew & Dan (who responded via pm). It looks like the lens is from 1881. It is not marked as a Euryskop. I believe it is the original Petzval design. I just disassembled it and cleaned the lenses and the rear group is not cemented. Physically it is about 8.5" long with 4" barrel. Flange OD is ~5.25" The rear group is about 3.125" in diameter and the infinity focus is 12" from the waterhouse stop slot (or about 9" rear focus). 12"/3.125" give f/3.8 for the max aperture. I figure it is probably a lens intended for full-plate. The hood & barrel is a little chewed up but the focus is silky and the glass is very clean for a lens of this vintage. I'll have to slap it on my 11x14 and see what it covers and if it is swirly.

It is marked:

5A
No.25851
Voigtlander & Sohn
Wien,
Braunschweig
 

Barry S

Andrew-- Very cool. I've read about the "cone centraliseur" and would love to own a Darlot with one, but they usually go for big money. My guess is the cone was a bit of a marketing gimmick, since you don't need a cone to switch out the groups. I've also pretty much decided that the diffusion control on my Vitax doesn't really do much other than defocusing the lens. Wollensak just made a minor change from the Dallmeyer diffusion "feature". Dallmeyer switched the rear group around so the negative element was at the back of the lens and it could be unscrewed to "diffuse" the lens. If you read some of the articles on Dan's site, you can see not everyone was convinced of the utility of that "feature". The Vitax also has the negative element in the rear, but includes a radial drive to move the positive element of the rear group forward. The Vitax is an amazing lens, beautifully sharp in the center, but I'm not finding a lot of use for the diffusion control.

I'd love to see some photos with your Darlot's groups switched out. It sounds like the Petzvals have some similar properties to the rapid rectilinear lenses in that you can use a single group at about double the focal length, but somewhat uncorrected with a single group. Although since the Petzval isn't exactly symmetrical like the RR, it sounds like you got something on the order of quadrupling the focal length--from 6" to 24".

Joe-- That sounds like a nice classic whole plate Petzval. If the Voigtlander reputation is true, it should be an excellent lens.
 

ishutteratthethought

Very cool site Andrew. I have not seen this one yet. My Darlot has writing on the side which appears to be a serial number, their name of course and another fraction type number which is hard to make out. It is written in pencil.
I should try the set up you speak of, my Calumet has a very long bellow which should work.
I also agree with you on the comment of the petzvals. they are truly an amaizing lens and the near 3D effect just floors me... i do not have any other lens that comes close.
Steve
 

gandolfi

Andrew and others.
I've known about this site for some time and find it interesting too.
If you go to the image section here, you'll see Claus' (bluelemon) "new" old Jamin Darlot, which proberly had a cone originally..

Still a fantastic (big) lens, for portraits and landscape..

(there was a url link here which no longer exists)
 

ishutteratthethought

that cover would be the shutter i believe. i see it is missing the focusing gear. how do they know it's a wide angle? little spendy for a no-name.
steve
 

smieglitz

perhaps it is a magic lantern lens. The cover would allow for a quick blank screen when changing slides.
 

Barry S

I also think it's probably a lantern lens, but that shutter is interesting and a bit unusual. It looks there's also a slot in front of the lens--maybe used for color filters for effects? If the back focus is 6", that would make the focal length closer to 7 or 8 inches. From the look of the barrel--it's an old lens.
 

Colin Corneau

Interesting...well, I really have to beat the bushes to get set up. This is a type of photography I really want to pursue, and especially for a resident artist program with the Canadian Forces. I'd like to do portraits of armed forces personnel serving in Afghanistan - probably one reason Andrew Moxom's portraits with his Petzval really struck me so much. It's a timeless place, and I like the idea of a timeless look and method of photography.
Soooo -- if anyone has a lens (or preferably lens and shutter) to sell, I'd really love to hear about it. In talking with contacts in the Forces, it seems they will want to see examples of my work before approving any application from me, so...suffice to say I have work to do!
 

edtbjon

Hi all!
First post in this group, but in short: I got my hands on a Busch-Neokino 62,5/120mm lens (translates to 2½"/4 3/4"). About $40 at a swedish auction site. It looks similar to the lenses which Jim G. sells now and then and when I looked in the brief Vade Mecum which is online, it just says that this should be a Petzval.
I will give it a try tomorrow, but in the meantime, I wonder if anyone have some additional info on the lens. I do know that this is a 35mm film projection lens and given the short focal length I expect it to clip the corners on 4x5". But is there someone else who has had any success with this lens?

//Björn
 

smieglitz

FWIW, I'll be putting three Petzvals up for sale as soon as I can get some jpegs together. Two will be Seroco Portrait Series II f/5 Petzval lenses for 5x7 (10") and full-plate 6.5x8.5 (12") formats. These two lenses are in Studio shutters (need some work) and have their dedicated mounting flanges. These apparently were rebranded Wollensak Vesta Portrait lenses sold by Sears. They are also convertible and are considerably smaller in size than the f/3.8 or f/4 Petzvals. As a result, they can be adapted to smaller cameras for use outside the studio.

The third lens will be the full-plate Voigtlander 5A 12" f/3.8 Petzval.

I'll also be selling a nice 8 3/4" Verito in Betax #5 and a universal iris lens mount, so keep an eye on the APUG classifieds after Christmas day if you have any interest in these items. I've stumbled onto a deal for some studio lighting equipment and I'm also going to lease a studio space the beginning of the new year, so I need to raise some fast cash. I'd rather sell the equipment here than on eBay for various reasons.
 

Barry S

Hi Björn--So you've got a zoom (or varifocal) projection lens? Interesting. Are you sure it's a Petzval design? Have you found a cemented doublet and an air-spaced doublet? I've found there were many other designs for projection lenses--especially as you get into the 40's. A book titled Zoom Lens Photography briefly mentions the 1931 Busch Neo-Kino in a timeline of the zoom lens.
 

edtbjon

Barry - No, there's no way this could be a zoom lens. It just a barrel with a front group and a rear group, both doublets. I recon the 62,5 indicates the diameter of the lens. It's quite definitely a 120mm focal length.
My guess about the nomination of the lens (62,5/120mm) is so that the movie machinist can switch lenses of the same barrel diameter, but different focal lengths, so that different film formats can fill the screen. Just a guess, but it sound good in theory.
Happy new year!
//Björn
 

Barry S

Ok, I think it must have been a similar to the B&L Super Cinephor line. The name remained the same even though the design was updated from a Petzval to a six-element design. In 1931 Busch introduced the Neo-Kino zoom, but it was probably an addition to the earlier Petzval Neo-Kinos. Your shot is interesting because I don't see much color work done with Petzval lenses.
 

edtbjon

I just happened to have some color Polaroid film laying around, so... I'll be doing some more work next year when there's some light up here again. (Local time half four and it's almost dark.)
//Björn
 

smieglitz

A couple people have emailed me to express an interest or more information about the Petzval lenses I recently listed in the APUG classifieds. Unfortunately, it appears I started having problems with my email server and I have received several emails that have blank address lines and headers, or the messages appear to reference earlier correspondence that I never received. I've sent several test emails to myself over the past 2 days, but they aren't showing up either. So, I'm not sure if stuff is hung up in a queue somewhere in cyberspace. In any event, if you have emailed me about any of the lenses, please return to the ad and leave a message or contact me via PM instead of email. I want to make sure that people responding to the ads first via APUG get first crack at them. Thanks. Joe
 

Colin Corneau

Bjorn, I think we're at similar latitudes!

Anyway, a bright New Year to everyone...it's invaluable to learn so much from so many knowledgeable people. And great to just talk and share a common passion, too.

All the best in 2009, everyone.
 

Barry S

Happy New Year's to everyone! In a moment of fiscal irresponsibility I got the last Petzval lens I've been wanting for my upcoming wet plate work-- a Dallmeyer 3A (see pic). It's amazing how big Petzvals get if you want a fast lens for portraits on a decent-sized plate. Dallmeyer considered the 3A appropriate for whole plate (6.5" x 8.5") work and the flange won't even fit properly on a 6" lens board. I'll be using it for portraits on plates a little smaller than 8x10. It's a 16" f/4 lens with a diffusion adjustment that works by unscrewing the back element of the rear group. My lens was made in 1896 and the rear element won't budge, but from my experience with the Vitax, I'm not so interested in the "diffusion" effect on a Petzval. I'm finding that there are very different desirable qualities for Petzvals that are going to be used with film versus studio work with wet plate. For film shooting, the slower smaller Petzvals are a lot more practical. They're more easily shuttered, much lighter, and require less frequent neutral density filtering.
 

Colin Corneau

That's quite a hefty lens...congrats on finishing your wish list!
 

smieglitz

I also have a Dallmeyer 3A and it is my favorite wetplate lens for large plates. I think you will enjoy yours.
 

jimgalli

Just received a very nice Petzval. It is a Gundlach Series B which was their f4 series. It is surprisingly compact and a good focal length for 8X10 at 14 inches. I have a couple of 12 inch Petzvals I've used in the field with the 8X10 2D but this 14 inch seems perfect for field use. 28 inches of bellows puts it at 1:1 and a head shot is less than that. One problem I have with all of my Gundlach lenses is the disimilar metal corrosion between the brass barrel and the cheezy aluminum group barrel. I cannot get the rear group to come off for cleaning. Oh well, the image on the GG is amazing, flatter than usual with this "modern" petzval and I hope to use it this coming weekend. It shares a flange with my 14 inch Hyperion so theoretically you could take both styles of soft focus into the field with a single flange.
 

summilux

I was wondering if anyone here had built their own petzval using elements sold by companies like Edmond?
 
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