Passing work off as your own

Ian Grant · Jul 29, 2008

I looked at the Portfolio of someone I used to work with today. He's a graphics designer / wannabe photographer. I found artwork and CD covers which were designed by others, some by me !!! (they use my images with permission) and so I went on to look at his studio photography which is very mediocre. All these by the way are in very large 100 - 200 Mb downloadable ZIP files in the Portfolio section of his website, no thumbnails or visible images.

So I checked out his "Live portfolio" (shooting Rock bands) and thought wow he's got some great shots here. Then realised I'd shot every image, it was all my work - he'd done good job of editing.

Now these images are a mix of analog and digital, he's made no effort to hide the EXIF info which show Canon and model (he has Nikon equipment) and of course I have all the original negatives, mostly 5x4 and 35mm. I should also add he's never owned a film camera in his life.

If someone else had done this I'd take immediate legal action, I own the copyright outright on many of the images, and share copyright with the record company for the rest. He's lucky I won't, I still work as a consultant & Photographer for the Company, I've been working with the founder for over 30 years but a very hard slap on the wrist is in order.

Ian

Jose A Martinez · Jul 29, 2008

Why? I mean, why you won't take legal actions?

keithwms · Jul 29, 2008

Frankly: slap on the wrist, my ass! This a fundamental issue of artistic and journalistic integrity. You must be given credit for the images, and if he wants to take credit for creatively postprocessing them fine (maybe, with your written permission). But credit for your initial work must be clearly stated. And you can (and should) collect a fee for their use henceforth and retroactively- for however long they were on display.

Jose A Martinez · Jul 29, 2008

I agree with Keith, you deserve more than credit, and with you the rest of the photographic comunity.

Ian Grant · Jul 29, 2008

Remember I do have full credit for the work where it matters. This guy's Website isn't going to get many hits, and the images are hidden away in ZIP files.

I also have enough power to get him dismissed instantly, but I happen to be on very good terms with his "twin" brother, (they job share) actually he's one of Triplets but the third looks totally different and has all the brains

Legal action costs money, even if I won, which I would he couldn't pay anything in compensation and I'd be out of pocket. Plus I'm not going to take legal action against an organisation I headed for a while, and still work very closely with.

So because this is almost an internal matter it will be slapped wrist, a kick up the backside and a written warning that if it happens again he'll be dismissed. He's made no money from selling my work, if he's got work for himself on the strength of it he's probably not impressed the clients judging by the quality of his own images.

What he's doing is misguided, unethical and immoral - so it has to be stopped.

Ian

naeroscatu · Jul 29, 2008

If you let this go with only a slap on the wrist he will do the same with others or others will figure that they can get away with stealing.

Jose A Martinez · Jul 29, 2008

Ian, if it's so, why you post this thread?

railwayman3 · Jul 29, 2008

With respect, I can't quite see the purpose of your posting, as you have already decided on the course of action.

IMHO (and having dealt with business matters), I wonder if the "slap on the wrist" should be in the form of a lawyer's warning letter rather than just something from you. That shouldn't cost more than a few £ from a UK lawyer ("solicitor" over here), it shows that you are not joking and leaves the door open for something more serious if the guy ignores your requests.

He should understand that, if he seriously wants to be a successful commercial photographer, he needs to understand copyright rules fast. Otherwise he will find that action by others less kind than you will soon bring his blossoming career to an end.

thebanana · Jul 29, 2008

Jose A Martinez said:
Ian, if it's so, why you post this thread?

Sometimes a person just needs to vent . It's healthy.

MattKing · Jul 29, 2008

Ian:

Thanks for posting the thread. If nothing else, it is fascinating to learn how much unmitigated gall some people have.

I can understand why your primary goal is just to have this individual stop doing what he is doing, as well as have others learn about what he has done.

Maybe you could save some bandwidth, by linking to his versions of your images, whenever you want to share your images .

Matt

Stoo Batchelor · Jul 29, 2008

Blimey.

I can imagine that you have sat and pondered for many nights to decide your plan of action. Full credit to you for acting in the dignified manner in which you have chosen. It says alot about the person inside.

Stoo

Ian Grant · Jul 29, 2008

Yes I need to vent.

I've had far worse on the internet with people stealing images and the threat of legal action has put an instant stop to it.

I raised this issue more about why do they do this, they can't produce the quality if they get work of someone elses back (well this guy can't).

Ian

Ian Grant · Jul 29, 2008

Stoo Batchelor said:
Blimey.

I can imagine that you have sat and pondered for many nights to decide your plan of action. Full credit to you for acting in the dignified manner in which you have chosen. It says alot about the person inside.

Stoo

No only a short time, I was downloading more Zipped images as I wrote.

I actually spotted this earlier in the year, and brought it up in March, at that time my images were blatantly all over his website. Now they are archived in Zip files

Ian

Trevor Crone · Jul 29, 2008

Ian, have you asked him to remove ALL YOUR material from his website?

MikeSeb · Jul 29, 2008

the guy's a plagiarist, liar, and thief just as if he'd copied your term paper at school; stolen your car; burglarized your house; or pickpocketed your wallet. As a person with little or no integrity, he is unworthy of your forbearance. It's even worse that he's done this to a former co-worker and a person whose trust and confidence he'd enjoyed.

You should at the LEAST send him a strongly worded letter from a lawyer DEMANDING that he desist, remove all of your work from his site, and even better, own up publicly on his site to his actions, and publicly apologize there. If you really have the power to effect his instant dismissal, that is leverage to get the result you want. There also needs to be a paper trail on this guy, such that if/when (I suspect the latter) he pulls this stunt again, his track record will be know to all.

If you're really on good terms with his twin brother, then the brother should be just as appalled as you at his brother's duplicity and thievery. You've been f---ed my man, and you need to stand up in the most vigorous terms, up to the fullest extent allowed by the law.

It doesn't matter that the files are zipped away, or that his website will get few hits; or whatever else you tell yourself to justify not confronting this person or his employers.

2F/2F · Jul 29, 2008

You can't teach ethics no matter what you do to someone. They are instilled in childhood and are there to stay. He simply needs to be fully exposed to as many people as possible. His wife, kids, boss, the public, my grandmother, etc. Forget suing him. Just tell the truth to as many people as possible. It may ruin his reputation and his professional life, but that's what he gets. Do it factually, with evidence, and without flaw. It's not personal. It's business.

Then shit in his boots at night when he is sleeping. (Make sure you shake it down to the toes so he doesn't notice!)

Phil · Jul 29, 2008

Here's a post from another photo site that dates back quite a few years:

http://philip.greenspun.com/copyright/hall-of-shame

So, you could do something like this to your photos to 'tag' them as your own...

http://www.garykessler.net/library/fsc_stego.html

Mike Té · Jul 29, 2008

Hi, Ian.

Is this fellow a friend (former friend)? If so, I can appreciate your level of measured discretion in dealing with this issue. In that case, a calm no-nonsense speaking-to is in order, with the goal of making matters right. If he's a professional acquaintance, I think that I'd get a bit more serious with him. It seems that, the first time around, he didn't quite understand the nuances of the situation. Time to spell it out for him.

Anupam Basu · Jul 29, 2008

I didn't get that bit about Canon exif if you shot negs. But either way, a slap on the wrist and much more is definitely in order.

mark · Jul 30, 2008

People do it because they want to be something more than they are. At least that is all I can figure. Venting aside, I think this post brings up a very interesting thought. When would it be more than a slap on the wrist. The man stole from you.

Ian Grant · Jul 30, 2008

Anupam Basu said:
I didn't get that bit about Canon exif if you shot negs. But either way, a slap on the wrist and much more is definitely in order.

I did say the images were a mix of film & digital, for some of my professional work it's unfortunately no longer a matter of choice, the specialist Kodak /Fuji push-process E6 films I used to use aren't manufactured any more.

As Mike Té says above, this particular case needs a level of reasoned discretion, it's someone who worked at the desk next to me, and although I left the company I still work closely with them when I'm in the UK. Looking at the situation today, compared to earlier in the year my images are no longer splashed all over the guy's website, that website itself appears to be tinder reconstruction, all the graphics are archived in Zip files.

None of that is any excuse he's stolen images and tried to pas them off as his own work, he's also stolen other peoples artwork & designs etc. It's now up to the senior management of the company involved, they also share joint copyrights of many of the images, so it's their responsibility to take action & discipline the person (employee) involved.

Ian

keithwms · Jul 30, 2008

Ian you disappointed me, I had my sword drawn and was ready to disembowel the infidel, along with the bubbling throng....

Well do what you think is best for this person and for yourself.

eclarke · Jul 30, 2008

Ian Grant said:
Remember I do have full credit for the work where it matters. This guy's Website isn't going to get many hits, and the images are hidden away in ZIP files.

I also have enough power to get him dismissed instantly, but I happen to be on very good terms with his "twin" brother, (they job share) actually he's one of Triplets but the third looks totally different and has all the brains

Legal action costs money, even if I won, which I would he couldn't pay anything in compensation and I'd be out of pocket. Plus I'm not going to take legal action against an organisation I headed for a while, and still work very closely with.

So because this is almost an internal matter it will be slapped wrist, a kick up the backside and a written warning that if it happens again he'll be dismissed. He's made no money from selling my work, if he's got work for himself on the strength of it he's probably not impressed the clients judging by the quality of his own images.

What he's doing is misguided, unethical and immoral - so it has to be stopped.

Ian

If not corrected, you can lose your rights...EC

Stephen Frizza · Jul 30, 2008

I have a good client base which is developing, They call themselves artists have shows and are getting good reviews however they haven't done any of the works they are exhibiting. They have approached me, asked me to make them a body of work and are exhibiting it as their own work. Good thing is I look at it as though I have sold every one of my artworks and they may only sell a few? I figure if the dollar is right then I really don't care if i dont take the credit. And I wonder how much can this bring the "artists" satisfaction? is it not like them paying for sex?

Edwardv · Jul 31, 2008

I would inform the guy that I am aware my images are on his website; that I want them removed or legal action would be taken. You worked hard to get the photographs, why let someone get recognition for your work? You never know, he could have made some bucks off the images.

Good luck

Passing work off as your own

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