Opaque Fluid - DIY recipes?

M Carter · Dec 20, 2016

I remember the olden days, when I used to do graphic arts film stripping... we had that red opaquing fluid. It was easy to use and stayed flexible on film and acetate. Far as I know, it's not widely available.

Anyone know of options or recipes? I once heard something along the lines of gum arabic and red dye? Someone suggested acrylic paint, but I think that would just flake and peel. Need something that can handle detailed work.

I have an image that I want to mask on the paper plane, maybe use a lith film positive but it would still need retouching. Fingers crossed, and - happy holidays!

David A. Goldfarb · Dec 20, 2016

There might be something in "The Art of Retouching and Improving Negatives" by Johnson and Hammond, which I've seen on GoogleBooks. I have a hard copy in a different edition, but it describes how to make a number of things that didn't exist as commercial preparations at the time, or gives enough information that you might be able to reverse-engineer it.

MattKing · Dec 21, 2016

Isn't it Crocien Scarlet?
http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?99980-Mixing-Kodak-Crocein-Scarlet

AgX · Dec 21, 2016

A german manufacturer:
http://rohrer-klingner.de/index.php?id=24&L=1

Ian Grant · Dec 21, 2016

From the BJP Almanac 1924.

Ian

darkroommike · Dec 21, 2016

MattKing said:
Isn't it Crocien Scarlet?
http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?99980-Mixing-Kodak-Crocein-Scarlet

Crocein scarlet or Kodak neo-coccine is certainly one approach, builds density slowly, does not drop out tones in one pass like opaque, I would like a jar or two myself, I have an opaque pen in my darkroom. Most of the commercially available opaques are discontinued but I think Pebeo still makes a few types. For large areas Rubylith, amberlith or 3M red tape were used.

darkroommike · Dec 21, 2016

I Googled the MSDS for both Kodak Black Opaque and Kodak Red Opaque, very similar except for the pigment. The black pigment is lampblack, the red pigment is iron oxide. Another Kodak product gone but not forgotten.

Mainecoonmaniac · Dec 21, 2016

Chinese ink stick might work. It's dense and water soluble. You'll have to grind it with water before you use it. Lasts forever.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inkstick

darkroommike · Dec 23, 2016

Found something that might work, more testing needed. Crayola washable kids paint in red or black. Hobby store was out of black so I bought red. Sorta sticks to the base side of a bit of film (unprocessed) I had at my desk, sticks very well to the emulsion side, washed off using a wet Q-tip. More tests during holidays.

Geoffrey Swan · Dec 24, 2016

I too have been looking for the same jar of red opaque... wonderful stuff.

I have yet to purchase these (I am in Australia and Photo warehouse want US$95 to ship to me)... but Mark Tex pens could do the job.

http://www.ultrafineonline.com/marktexpens.html

AgX · Dec 24, 2016

We are meanwhile speaking in this thread of two completely different products:

-) permanent opaque paint
-) red paint to form film to be pulled off again

darkroommike · Dec 24, 2016

OP was looking for a recipe for red opaque similar to the Kodak product, the Kodak stuff came in both red and black and was used by pressmen and similar graphic arts types for masking and fixing "pinholes" in Kodalith (and similar) negatives. For larger area masking there were products like Amberlith, Rubylith, and 3M's red transparent tape and black opaque tape. There was also a liquid rubber cement material Maskoid(?) that I never used. I'm surprised the original poster hasn't tagged back in to better explain what he was looking for.

In the AV/Photo Lab I worked at in the mid-70's we made original slides on 35mm Kodalith Ortho Type 3, cleaned it up using Red Opaque and then either hand colored the slides with dyes to make masters from which we made distribution copies using a Sickles duplicator or made single colored background distribution copies using Diazo film. We also copied graphs and charts intended for inclusion in thesis work on 4x5 Kodalith, cleaned up the copies again with Opaque and printed the graphs and charts on A surface paper for binding with the typed thesis. No Powerpoint, no word processing, no scanners, no Photoshop, no desktop publishing, no imagesetters, you know...the good old days.

re: recipe from the BJP. Vermillion pigment is made from cinnabar a mercury ore, today it's synthetic mercuric sulfide and mostly made in China (no surprise there), wiki says it's very toxic so no licking the brush! Gamboge is a red/brown/yellow pigment made from an evergreen resin, Payne's gray a mixture of iron blue (Prussian blue), yellow ochre and crimson lake.

I prefer the msds for the Kodak stuff!

AgX · Dec 24, 2016

darkroommike said:
OP was looking for a recipe for red opaque similar to the Kodak product, the Kodak stuff came in both red and black and was used by pressmen and similar graphic arts types for masking and fixing "pinholes" in Kodalith (and similar) negatives.

The OP spoke of "stripping film". That was common in Germany and as I indicated is still produced here.

dwross · Dec 24, 2016

One option:
http://www.valleylitho.com/acatalog/Liquid_Opaque.html

ced · Dec 25, 2016

Meccanorma "Masking Marker" & Kimoto "Kimoto Pake - Retouching Pen" (super density) are two felt tipped pens that I know would do the job for small areas.
Not sure if these are still around but I have 2 just in front of me. (20+ years and still fine).

M Carter · Dec 29, 2016

AgX said:
The OP spoke of "stripping film". That was common in Germany and as I indicated is still produced here.

Well, the process of stripping film for graphic arts, but not looking for rubylith - something I can brush on and that can wash off if needed.

dwross said:
One option:
http://www.valleylitho.com/acatalog/Liquid_Opaque.html

That looks like just the stuff, no amount of googling seemed to turn it up for me!

Playing with red watercolor and gum arabic in a bit, we'll see...

AgX · Dec 29, 2016

What I referred to as stripping film was not something as Rybylith (a readymade foil), but a paint that turns into a red film that can be stripped off, not washed off. Still available as said.

darkroommike · Dec 29, 2016

Something like this would work too, not water soluble but I remember picking it off with tape or (gently) rubbing it off.

Dead Link Removed

AgX · Dec 29, 2016

Seems basically the same as the german stuff.

(There are also Latex-based masking fluids, but the two obove both seem solvent based.)

Geoffrey Swan · Jan 5, 2017

Purchased a roll of 3M 616 lithographers tape - ruby red 12.7mm x 65.8m (0.5" x 72 yards)...AUD$14.00 this will work for bulk masking but still need some opaque red fluid

M Carter · Jan 5, 2017

Geoffrey Swan said:
Purchased a roll of 3M 616 lithographers tape - ruby red 12.7mm x 65.8m (0.5" x 72 yards)...AUD$14.00 this will work for bulk masking but still need some opaque red fluid

Yep, I have the red tape and it's very handy, but not precise enough for what i was doing - dark red watercolor and gum arabic was good enough for this week (really what I should have done was used lith developer for my negs, but I was running low and the project was a lith print...)

I like using duplex stock for burn cards (white on one side, black on the other). White side up, you can really align a tight burn to the image since you can see it on the card. So I often use the red tape to close up a hole from a previous burn, as that stock is fairly expensive. (You can also keep a can of spray mount handy and stick white paper to black construction paper).

Andrew O'Neill · Jan 5, 2017

Red food colouring. I used some years ago in Japan, and it worked well for spotting out pinholes in negatives. I lucked out and inherited a jar of the Kodak red opaque about 10 years ago from a retired screen printer. He had it for decades. It's 3/4's full and at the rate I use it, will last forever.

RalphLambrecht · Jan 5, 2017

M Carter said:
I remember the olden days, when I used to do graphic arts film stripping... we had that red opaquing fluid. It was easy to use and stayed flexible on film and acetate. Far as I know, it's not widely available.

Anyone know of options or recipes? I once heard something along the lines of gum arabic and red dye? Someone suggested acrylic paint, but I think that would just flake and peel. Need something that can handle detailed work.

I have an image that I want to mask on the paper plane, maybe use a lith film positive but it would still need retouching. Fingers crossed, and - happy holidays!

How about creating an acetate overlay with PS and an inkjet printer?

silveror0 · Jan 5, 2017

How about this:
http://stores.photoformulary.com/crocein-scarlet-biebrich-scarlet/

Opaque Fluid - DIY recipes?

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Opaque Fluid - DIY recipes?

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