Oops.. Bought some Rollei Retro...

Chris Nielsen · Aug 10, 2009

Yeah, this is typical for me, seeing as I find buying film very therapeutic... While I was at my local camera store today enquiring about the whereabouts of the bulk roll of HP5 I ordered, I spotted a pile of Rollei Retro 400 on the shelf.. And shortly afterwards was walking out with all 11 rolls. I figured there's no point buying 1 or 2, I need at least 10 rolls to get even half used to a film. I was going to standardise on HP5 but this stuff was such a good price I couldn't resist

Anyway, I've done some googling and I'm having trouble finding times above 400 for it - any clues?? Oh, and I use ID-11 (stock)

Thanks all!

Colin Corneau · Aug 10, 2009

Nothing in Massive Development Chart?

If no, I'd try it at a similar time to HP5 just for a test and go from there.

I'm currently travelling in China with about 20 rolls of the Rollei Retro 100 - I've liked this film in Rodinal and can't wait to see it back home.

Anon Ymous · Aug 10, 2009

Start with the suggested times for Agfa APX400. I don't know what exactly you have (there's also the Retro 400S), but both films are said to have the same emulsion (the one of APX400) on different bases.

DutchShooter · Aug 10, 2009

Rollei Retro 400 (make sure it is not 400S) is rebranded Agfa APX-400. You should be able to find details for the APX-400 film online quite easily...(e.g. in the Massive Development Chart). 400S is said to have the same emulsion...

http://www.digitaltruth.com/products/agfa_tech/FPD1e.pdf

P C Headland · Aug 10, 2009

Others have pointed to using the APX400 times - works well for me.

I've found it to be a nice film, especially for the NZ price. I generally shoot it at EI320 or 400 depending on camera, and develop in PC-TEA 1+50 for 10 minutes. That developer / dilution's times are very similar to ID-11 1+1. I've not tried pushing it.

Chris Nielsen · Aug 10, 2009

Thanks all.. I am aware of the connection to APX400 and I checked both films in the massive dev chart (first stop of course) and there are no times faster than 400 for either film in ID-11, except for 1600 in Microphen which I also have but am holding in reserve for a special occasion

ath · Aug 10, 2009

Retro 400 is Agfa APX400 material.
There was Agfa APX400S which is the emulsion of the 400 coated on a clear base.
Rollei Retro 400S is a completely different film and cut from an Agfa surveillance film (extended red sensitivity).

DutchShooter · Aug 10, 2009

I did find some info using google for 1 minute

(there was a url link here which no longer exists)
(there was a url link here which no longer exists)
http://photo.net/black-and-white-photo-film-processing-forum/009MkN
http://photo.net/black-and-white-photo-film-processing-forum/009PDu

Chris Nielsen · Aug 10, 2009

Hmmm, they didn't sound that impressed with it. I had the impression from previous reading that it was quite well respected. Seems 800 ain't an option. Oh well, I'll burn a couple rolls at 400 and see how I get on..

Anon Ymous · Aug 10, 2009

ath said:
Rollei Retro 400S is a completely different film and cut from an Agfa surveillance film (extended red sensitivity).

So, Retro 400S is Aviphot Pan 400S?

ath · Aug 10, 2009

Anon Ymous said:
So, Retro 400S is Aviphot Pan 400S?

That's what most people (including me) believe.
Maco states it is coated by Agfa and the spectral sensitivity curves from the data sheets fit.

mablo · Aug 10, 2009

Rollei Retro 400 (not S) is not very versatile in development. I've tried all common dilutions at box speed with Rodinal and I must say that results have not been very impressive. However, I've seen some very promising examples in Flickr shooting Retro 400@800 and developing in Rodinal 1+100 for 50min.

I also found out that D-76 works better diluted 1+1 (11min) than stock (9min) at box speed.

Chris Nielsen · Aug 10, 2009

I don't like the idea of using 1+1 as it seems a lot less economical than stock, but I will try a roll or two, I'm sure it can't be that bad surely. I've seen some nice examples on flickr of this film, allegedly in 35mm

Mark Antony · Aug 10, 2009

I like the film and process it in Rodinal but reduce the speed to EI200 and knock twenty per cent of of recommended dev times.
It has a more gritty grain pattern than Neopan 400 (my normal) and possibly HP5 but it does have a nice tonality and good impression of sharpness.
here is a snap with what I feel is typical result in bright light.

Mark

ajuk · Aug 10, 2009

/\ looks like an old skool film at that speed.

No wonder Agfa went bust if there old stock is still being sold off 3 1/2 years later!

P C Headland · Aug 11, 2009

Here's a 35mm frame of Rollei Retro 400 shot at 400 in a Braun Paxette and developed in PC-TEA 1+50:

and

Click the photos for a larger version.

I don't think there's too much wrong with this film.

Chris Nielsen · Aug 11, 2009

Well that's a bloody relief!!! I've got a roll about to go through my F5, will see how we get on! This makes 6 cameras I have loaded currently, all with a different film in each. Every time I say I'm standardising I go and buy something different. One day I might even take some photos!!

bpaties · Aug 11, 2009

Chris Nielsen said:
I don't like the idea of using 1+1 as it seems a lot less economical than stock ...

Ummmm ... I might have been doing lots of stuff wrong, but I thought that 1+1 was 1 part stock solution mixed with 1 part water ... which would make it twice as economical as using stock solution (1+0) ... :confused:

mablo · Aug 11, 2009

bpaties said:
Ummmm ... I might have been doing lots of stuff wrong, but I thought that 1+1 was 1 part stock solution mixed with 1 part water ... which would make it twice as economical as using stock solution (1+0) ... :confused:

Stock solution can be reused a few times while 1+1 solution is one time use. Sometimes I've used the stock solution a couple of times and then finished it using 1+1. No probs.

mablo · Aug 11, 2009

P C Headland said:
Here's a 35mm frame of Rollei Retro 400 shot at 400 in a Braun Paxette and developed in PC-TEA 1+50:

I don't think there's too much wrong with this film.

I agree! my only grievance is that it doesn't like Rodinal. Nice pics btw. Never heard of PC-TEA but it seems to go nicely with Retro 400.

P C Headland · Aug 12, 2009

mablo said:
I agree! my only grievance is that it doesn't like Rodinal. Nice pics btw. Never heard of PC-TEA but it seems to go nicely with Retro 400.

'

'Tis a mix at home developer. Have a search here on APUG, and you'll find quite a few threads on it. It's now my main developer.

Chris Nielsen · Aug 12, 2009

mablo said:
Stock solution can be reused a few times while 1+1 solution is one time use. Sometimes I've used the stock solution a couple of times and then finished it using 1+1. No probs.

I have used the stock solution up to 10 times and it looked just fine by the end. Increase time by 10% for each roll.

Thomas Bertilsson · Aug 12, 2009

For the record, I never found that APX 400 took underexposure very well. Just like Mark Antony I had to actually overexpose it one stop and shoot it at EI 200 to get acceptable tonality in the shadows. To me, shooting at EI 800 would represent a two stop underexposure.

I haven't used it for a while, though, but I do remember I liked the look of the film very much. With ID11 is should be just fine, you probably will want to bracket a test roll before you try to establish a normal processing time, just to see where you have enough shadow density to be acceptable to you.

Good luck,

- Thomas

RobertV · Aug 12, 2009

Rollei Retro 400 is from the last 2005 production batch of Agfa Photo APX 400. The films are running out of stock now worldwide.
Retro 400 in Rodinal: iso 200-250 it's nice and shows a large grey scale but some (regular) grain.

A more actual dev. table:
Dead Link Removed

and an example of Retro 400 in Rodinal 1+50 13:00 minutes from the marihuana shop in the Netherlands:

clayne · Aug 12, 2009

Chris Nielsen said:
I don't like the idea of using 1+1 as it seems a lot less economical than stock, but I will try a roll or two, I'm sure it can't be that bad surely. I've seen some nice examples on flickr of this film, allegedly in 35mm

1+1 is twice as economical as stock. Did you mean something else?

APX400 is fairly versatile. It's probably "best" at 200-250. But really, there is no best developer combo, etc. for it. I've shot this film at EIs all over the map, tested with it, inadvertently done crazy things with it, etc. You'll almost always get something at least halfway decent.

Sometimes I feel there is a bit too much planning and search for holy grail combos on here. Do what you want, deal with what you get. Perception is relative.

Canon 1V + 135mm f/2.0, Agfapan APX 400, Kodak XTOL 1+0

Canon 1V + 85mm f/1.2, Agfapan APX 400, Kodak XTOL 1+0

Nikon F3 + 50mm f/1.4, Agfapan APX 400, Kodak D-76 1+0, fixer haze

Leica M4 + 35mm f/2.0, Agfapan APX 400@800, Kodak XTOL 1+1

Canonet G-III + 40mm f/1.7, Agfapan APX 400, PMK Pyro 1+2+100

Nikon F3 + 20mm f/2.8, Agfapan APX 400@6400, Kodak XTOL 1+1

Canon 1V + 135mm f/2.0, Nikon F3 + 20mm f/2.8, Agfapan APX 400@200/1600, Kodak D-76 1+0

That last one is a result of accidental roll re-use between bodies and developed as if it were EI'd at 1600 resulting in hard over-development of the "original" exposures. Surely wasn't the end of the world though.

Larger versions attached.

Oops.. Bought some Rollei Retro...

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