On printing out paper: making deep blacks and vibrant highlights

[koraks]

A paper essentially identical to Lupex is absolutely a do'able deed -- actually, among the easiest of alternative photographic printing processes.

Thanks for chiming in @dwross2; just to give a bit of a perspective to OP - when you say a 'doable deed' and 'among the easiest', the impression may arise that this can be done without prior experience on a Sunday afternoon. How much time did it take you to get from first hearing about self-made POP papers to producing a paper that would consistently perform at acceptable quality for exhibition purposes?

 

[dwross2]

Well, that's a bit disappointing and depressing. I haven't been on Photrio for a while, but when did the expectation begin that handcrafted photography could be assumed to be as easy as using a phone camera?

Regarding your question about P.O.P., I'm perhaps the wrong person to ask. First I had to design a recipe. That did take a bit of time. I made the P.O.P. for the photographic materials testing at the National Gallery in D.C., with their requirement for high consistency. Again, not an afternoon's task. I wouldn't be interested if it had been. Boring.

I'm not sure I'm reading things right, but you may be confused about the difference between printing-out paper (POP) and developing-out paper (essentially all the rest of the silver gelatin types). A chloride paper (Azo or Lupex types) can be made with water, gelatin, sodium or potassium chloride, and silver nitrate -- in a Pyrex kitchen bowl with a stainless steel kitchen whisk. I'm not sure how it gets easier. P.O.P. paper is more complicated, but still not as hard to learn as many other processes.

Thanks for chiming in @dwross2; just to give a bit of a perspective to OP - when you say a 'doable deed' and 'among the easiest', the impression may arise that this can be done without prior experience on a Sunday afternoon. How much time did it take you to get from first hearing about self-made POP papers to producing a paper that would consistently perform at acceptable quality for exhibition purposes?

 

[retina_restoration]

Well, that's a bit disappointing and depressing. I haven't been on Photrio for a while, but when did the expectation begin that handcrafted photography could be assumed to be as easy as using a phone camera?

Regarding your question about P.O.P., I'm perhaps the wrong person to ask. First I had to design a recipe. That did take a bit of time. I made the P.O.P. for the photographic materials testing at the National Gallery in D.C., with their requirement for high consistency. Again, not an afternoon's task. I wouldn't be interested if it had been. Boring.

I'm not sure I'm reading things right, but you may be confused about the difference between printing-out paper (POP) and developing-out paper (essentially all the rest of the silver gelatin types). A chloride paper (Azo or Lupex types) can be made with water, gelatin, sodium or potassium chloride, and silver nitrate -- in a Pyrex kitchen bowl with a stainless steel kitchen whisk. I'm not sure how it gets easier. P.O.P. paper is more complicated, but still not as hard to learn as many other processes.

Denise, I assume these techniques are described in great detail in your book, yes?

 

[koraks]

Well, that's a bit disappointing and depressing. I haven't been on Photrio for a while, but when did the expectation begin that handcrafted photography could be assumed to be as easy as using a phone camera?

Come on, that's not fair. I hope you understand what I mean and how it's relevant to someone focused on the finished work vs. someone whose interest leans more towards the artisanal part of the process, which includes production of materials. I asked my question as a means to create a clearer picture on what someone who's new to this might expect.

And no, I'm not confusing DOP and POP. I admit my experience with POP papers is limited to a few experiments. However, I do have extensive experience with carbon printing, which likewise involves coating gelatin layers of consistent thickness. The main difference is that a carbon 'emulsion' is much, much simpler to produce and coat than a silver halide emulsion.

A chloride paper (Azo or Lupex types) can be made with water, gelatin, sodium or potassium chloride, and silver nitrate -- in a Pyrex kitchen bowl with a stainless steel kitchen whisk.

Sure. Getting it right, consistently, and getting it onto the paper so that it yields a usable paper that rivals commercially produced materials in a technical sense does require some practice. Can we at least acknowledge that?

 

[dwross2]

Denise, I assume these techniques are described in great detail in your book, yes?

So many details! Way more than are required to get the general idea of emulsion making. I'm "remodeling" TLF and it's going slow 'cause I'm lazy, but the basic tutorials are still a good place to get started: http://thelightfarm.com/Map/TLFTutorials/tlftutorials-handmade-silver-gelatin-emulsions.htm

 

[mshchem]

I really would encourage people to try the Fomatone VC fiber paper. POP is amazing stuff absolutely no doubt!

Fomatone will produce all kinds of colors when used with various toners. I love gold toners, the Kodak Blue Toner formula thats available makes for brilliant blues, to cold blues. When Blue toner is combined in sequence with sepia toners intense reds and orange tones can be had. Really quite amazing.

I suspect any warmtone chloride rich paper will work.
Best Mike

 

[retina_restoration]

I really would encourage people to try the Fomatone VC fiber paper. POP is amazing stuff absolutely no doubt!

Fomatone will produce all kinds of colors when used with various toners. I love gold toners, the Kodak Blue Toner formula thats available makes for brilliant blues, to cold blues. When Blue toner is combined in sequence with sepia toners intense reds and orange tones can be had. Really quite amazing.

I suspect any warmtone chloride rich paper will work.
Best Mike

Fomatone Classic is my favorite DOP.

So many details! Way more than are required to get the general idea of emulsion making. I'm "remodeling" TLF and it's going slow 'cause I'm lazy, but the basic tutorials are still a good place to get started: http://thelightfarm.com/Map/TLFTutorials/tlftutorials-handmade-silver-gelatin-emulsions.htm

Thank you Denise!