Okay, now I'm retarded

Perry Way · May 5, 2010

Really, I must be retarded. I went through the whole auction, could have asked any question I wanted to, but thought I knew just from looking at it, sure it's what I want. A 4x5 Speed Graphic. Yippeecayea! Wow, such a good price too. So it arrived this morning. Open the box.. I'm looking at a beautiful Speed Graphic but there's some awefully small looking film holders.. why, gollygeee isn't that quaint, they are for a 3.25 x 4.25 film. How interesting. Why did he send me film holders that don't go to this camera. ... Wwwwwait.. Oh my lord, don't tell me! It's a 3.25 x 4.25 Speed Graphic.

I am so retarded.

The drop bed leather fell off (I have it though and its in good condition on the black side). The rangefinder still works. The lens, a Zeiss Tessar 135 and the shutter works, its hard to switch speeds but everything works on this camera, the ground glass will have to come out and be thoroughly cleaned.. But it is in very good condition otherwise. No battle scars to speak of.

So now I'm faced with having three cameras that I own that I can't shoot right now due to lack of something. The Voigtlander Avus 9x12 camera (missing plate/film holders and film), A B&J 2.25 x 3.25 Press-field camera (missing film holders and film), and now this Speed Graphic (got film holders but they need to be gone over as I suspect one of them is a leaker, and I need to find some film) but I'm not any further ahead with my gotta have a lightweight field camera. In 4x5, not 3.25 x 4.25. I don't even have any neg carriers for this strange size. <grumble>

Anyone know where you can get any other film other than Efke in 3.25 x 4.25?

ntenny · May 5, 2010

Perry Way said:
Anyone know where you can get any other film other than Efke in 3.25 x 4.25?

As far as I've ever been able to determine, Efke is the only game in town unless you want to cut down a larger size.

I did once see someone (on APUG, I think) saying that they used 3.25x4" electron-microscopy film in 3.25x4.25" holders successfully.

If you want to donate the problematic camera to a good home, I've got some of that Efke film just waiting for it.

-NT

Anscojohn · May 5, 2010

Well, you can trim down 4x5 or split 5x7. I wonder, does a Fujiroid film back fit them?

Perry Way · May 5, 2010

ntenny said:
As far as I've ever been able to determine, Efke is the only game in town unless you want to cut down a larger size.

Cutting down a larger size is wasteful. I'm not prone to do that at all. I think for the moment I'm going to automagically limit myself to Efke on this camera. It's not like I don't have other 4x5 cameras. I have several really, just none as light and compact as a Speed Graphic. But thanks to this episode I think I just convinced myself I'm going to get a Toyo technical field camera, or a Linhoff. I really desire every movement possible for front standard and for rear it has to have swing and tilt. And I'll never get that with a Speed Graphic, so...

ntenny said:
I did once see someone (on APUG, I think) saying that they used 3.25x4" electron-microscopy film in 3.25x4.25" holders successfully.

I did some research on that just now. What I found is all blue sensitive film. Now that can be interesting, but not an every day menu item.

ntenny said:
If you want to donate the problematic camera to a good home, I've got some of that Efke film just waiting for it.
-NT

You know, that idea is sounding like a nice option. How about you reimburse postage of.. $120 (and I'll get it right out there to you)?

Mats_A · May 5, 2010

Perry Way said:
....The Voigtlander Avus 9x12 camera (missing plate/film holders and film) ...

If this is 9x12 cm film holders then these can be found on eBay. And both Ilford and Foma has 9x12 sheet films.

r

Mats

steven_e007 · May 5, 2010

3.25 X 4.24, quarter plate, is one of the sizes in Ilford's ULF run

So...get your order in for a few boxes of FP4+ or HP5+ and stack them in the fridge and you are set up until next year's ULF run...

Rick A · May 5, 2010

I have a pair of Graflex film pack adapters that will fit your camera. I was told they were for 4x5, so I bought them. Opened the package when they arrived, and waddaya know, 3-1/4x4-1/4 pack adapters. You can have them for postage($5 small flatrate).

Fotoguy20d · May 5, 2010

Does your Graphic have a Graflok back or a spring back? You can, with a little searching and patience, find a roll film holder for the 3x4 graflok (make sure it's a graphic not a graflex - the latter is for the RB cameras). 2x3 holders and film for the B&J shouldn't be hard to find at all (as long as you don't mind the Efke film).

Dan

mhcfires · May 5, 2010

Efke 3 1/4 x 4 1/4 film is available from Freestyle. I use it in my 3x4 Graflex SLR. I also have a 3x4 Speed with a graflex back, so I can use the graflex bag-mag with this camera too.

Thomas Bertilsson · May 5, 2010

Why not use a roll film back? Graflex made 6x7 (23) backs for these.

- Thomas

Anscojohn · May 5, 2010

Perry Way said:
Cutting down a larger size is wasteful. I'm not prone to do that at all.

************
Hmmmm. Splitting 5x7 into two useable sheets; plus shards for checking developer; 2x time to clear for hypo tests. I do not see it as that wasteful.

Perry Way · May 5, 2010

Thomas Bertilsson said:
Why not use a roll film back?

Do you mean something like this? Auction Item (on that evil auction site)

Thank you very much, I just bought THAT!

Perry Way · May 5, 2010

Fotoguy20d said:
Does your Graphic have a Graflok back or a spring back? You can, with a little searching and patience, find a roll film holder for the 3x4 graflok (make sure it's a graphic not a graflex - the latter is for the RB cameras). 2x3 holders and film for the B&J shouldn't be hard to find at all (as long as you don't mind the Efke film).

Dan

It has a Graphic back, I believe is how that is called. I did some research today looking for accessories and whatnot. Happened upon some good reading material but even after reading that and now coming back to your post, I am kind of puzzled if I have a spring back or Graphic back, in my understanding the Graphic back is the one with the flip up cover over the ground glass and it is a spring back but it does not have a traditional spring lever to expand the back wide open.

Anyway, I just picked up a nifty Adapt-a-Roll for the 3.25 x 4.25 standard (Graphic) back, in 6x9 format which I love. This one began life as a 620 roll but has been modified to take 120 rolls. Also, with careful loading, you can get 9 shots out of a roll with this adapter whereas the normal 6x9 format only yields 8 shots even though there is a decent amount of room in there for another frame if you start like a quarter inch before the start lead you have excess room.

As for the B&J, I'm going to get holders for it but this is low priority for me because the camera needs a major cleaning in the lens, the dust is just enormous in certain areas, the rangefinder lost a piece of linkage from the end of the arm that is supposed to meet up with the front standard, and of course I'm too busy (with life) to clean and repair right now even though it's 6x9 which is what I love the most on 120 film. Course.. I could go for a 6x17 back for my Cambo....

Perry Way · May 5, 2010

Anscojohn said:
Well, you can trim down 4x5 or split 5x7. I wonder, does a Fujiroid film back fit them?

I think so! (the fuji..) I saw a 3.25 x 4.25 Crown Graphic last week at the local shop. I considered it for a moment.. but then saw it was not a Speed Graphic and decided no way Jose. Saw out the corner of my eye a stack of Fuji instant film in 3.25 x 4.25. My memory can't dig up whether I saw a back for it or not, but why would the film be packaged with the camera if it didn't have a back?

Perry Way · May 5, 2010

steven_e007 said:
3.25 X 4.24, quarter plate, is one of the sizes in Ilford's ULF run

So...get your order in for a few boxes of FP4+ or HP5+ and stack them in the fridge and you are set up until next year's ULF run...

Way cool! I love those both. Especially FP4+. Do you know when the next ULF run takes place?

Perry Way · May 5, 2010

ralnphot said:
I have a pair of Graflex film pack adapters that will fit your camera. I was told they were for 4x5, so I bought them. Opened the package when they arrived, and waddaya know, 3-1/4x4-1/4 pack adapters. You can have them for postage($5 small flatrate).

I'll take it! Private message on the way!

michaelbsc · May 6, 2010

Perry Way said:
Do you mean something like this? Auction Item (on that evil auction site)

Thank you very much, I just bought THAT!

I've got a couple of the Adapt-a-roll holders, and if they're clean and working they're fine. The only "weirdness" about them is that they reroll the film backwards from expected, so when you go to unroll it to put in the tank it's kind of awkward the first few times. The film is on the take up spool emulsion out when you unwind the backing paper.

If you practice with the thing you can also get 9 images instead of 8 on the roll.

Another "trick" I've tried that works, but may not be great for you depending on how much you're willing to monkey with it, is mark the dark slid so that the film gate is 6x7 or 645 with the slide partially reinserted to the mark. You can count the clicks on the dial to advance the film (unless yours is way different than mine). 4 clicks is 6x9 and marked on the dial. 3 clicks is 6x7.25, and 2 clicks is 645.

MB

mopar_guy · May 9, 2010

Perry,
Welcome to the accidental 3x4 Graphic club! I also have a 3-1/4x4-1/4 Speed Graphic. Actually I have both an Anniversary Speed Graphic and a Pacemaker Speed Graphic as well as a pair of Graflex RB Super D SLRs. I went to one of the office supply stores and bought one of those guillotine type paper cutters. I used a piece of 1x4 lumber and some 3/8 inch dowel and a couple of hours later I had an adjustable stop film cutter that I could use to cut sheet film down to 3-1/4x4-1/4 or 2-1/4 x 3-1/4. I can get 5 pieces of 3-1/4x4-1/4 out of one sheet of 8x10 with very little waste. Now I can use my Anniversary Speed Graphic with T-Max 100, T-Max 400 or Portra 160 NC and my sheet film holders.

As regards to the Graflex film pack holders; These holders take the now obsolete 518 Pack film. These film packs were actually roll film cut to sheet film sizes and they are no longer available. The film pack adapers make a nice Graflex collectable.

Enjoy a Great American made camera!

Regards,
Dave

njelle · May 9, 2010

dude! 77 bucks ona 120 holder seriously?
i have two graflex 31/2x 4 6x9 roll film holders that do 120 and 220 i got them accidentally too becuase i was wnating 4x5 holders for less than 60 bucks if you want i could post them to you, only thing is am in europe...

Perry Way · May 10, 2010

michaelbsc said:
I've got a couple of the Adapt-a-roll holders, and if they're clean and working they're fine. The only "weirdness" about them is that they reroll the film backwards from expected, so when you go to unroll it to put in the tank it's kind of awkward the first few times. The film is on the take up spool emulsion out when you unwind the backing paper.

I just received my Adapt-a-roll holder. I sacrificed a roll of Adox CHS Art 50 to practice loading with and the dang roll just come unwound before I even got the dang thing on the spool holder, if you can imagine Adox is very very curly but man, it is impossible to load in this holder. So, I do not have instructions for this, I do not know where I'm supposed to line up the film to the start line, and where to make the setting on film counter so I know where frame 1 begins. Is it easy enough to describe? Could you tell me where the film is supposed to line up?

Perry Way · May 10, 2010

njelle said:
dude! 77 bucks ona 120 holder seriously?
i have two graflex 31/2x 4 6x9 roll film holders that do 120 and 220 i got them accidentally too becuase i was wnating 4x5 holders for less than 60 bucks if you want i could post them to you, only thing is am in europe...

Wow, that price sure sounds good to me right about now (now that I've had some bad luck loading my favorite film Adox CHS Art). But maybe the postage is so high it makes it too costly. Well, I'm going to try out some other films and give it some time before I speak up for your offer. Thanks!

2F/2F · May 10, 2010

Ask if you can return it. It is worth a shot. The worst the seller can say is no.

You can get certain films in that format, or trim down your own (a bit of a P.I.T.A. IMO). Ilford usually makes them when they do their yearly run of special sizes.

You can find medium format roll film holders for 3x4 Graflok backs. 6x6, 6x7, and 6x9. Hope you have a Graflok back, though! They are also pretty hard to track down, and you have to be patient.

Too bad film packs are no longer made. As you see above, you can get film pack holders for next to nothing.

You can, of course, sell it at a loss and consider it a lesson.

kraker · May 11, 2010

Perry Way said:
Way cool! I love those both. Especially FP4+. Do you know when the next ULF run takes place?

The *next* run? 2011, I suppose.

But the (there was a url link here which no longer exists) is still in progress, so you don't have to wait until 2011.

Akki14 · May 11, 2010

Perry Way said:
I just received my Adapt-a-roll holder. I sacrificed a roll of Adox CHS Art 50 to practice loading with and the dang roll just come unwound before I even got the dang thing on the spool holder, if you can imagine Adox is very very curly but man, it is impossible to load in this holder. So, I do not have instructions for this, I do not know where I'm supposed to line up the film to the start line, and where to make the setting on film counter so I know where frame 1 begins. Is it easy enough to describe? Could you tell me where the film is supposed to line up?

I have a Century Graphic with a "23" roll back... I originally read online how to load it but I can't seem to find it now, so I'll do my best to explain, though I'm not sure how different the Adapt-a-roll is.
There's a counter knob on top and it should be just past the 8 (or whatever is the last number on the roll if you have 6x7 format instead of 6x9)
Load up your film by opening the case, take out the inner guts.
Jab the loaded spool in the left spool section with the paper coming out the bottom. Wind it around the outside of the back, take your take-up spool and insert your paper backing tab in that then load it into the take-up spool area. This is the easiest way I've found for this.
Wind on only until the arrow on your backing paper matches up to the little arrow on the loading side (it's at about 2:30 if it was a clock hand).

At this point you can turn the counter knob on the top until it won't turn anymore, it'll be a little past the arrow for the S (start). Then load it all back into the back housing and wind wind wind until you get to 1. It'll seem like a lot! Take picture, press silver lever to the left, wind onto 2, etc.

I'm chronically bad at remembering to wind on after I take the picture so I get lots of double(sometimes triple) exposures.

Perry Way · May 11, 2010

Akki14 said:
I have a Century Graphic with a "23" roll back... <snip> I'm not sure how different the Adapt-a-roll is.

Actually it is quite different. The Adapt-a-roll is like that Calumet roll film holder with both spools on one side of the holder and a nice slim section that slides into your camera's back. Even a spring back will work because there's no thicker protrusions. The protrusion where the rolls are themselves overhang external to the actual dark slide/film gate area.

I sacrificed now two rolls of film. The last roll I busted the film backing, ripped it in half thanks to my Viking genes as I really tried to force the film to advance :rolleyes: But at this point I figured it out..

When loading the Adapt-a-roll, one gets the feeling immediately that they should have been born an Octopus with 8 arms. You have to learn new skills to keep the feeding roll from unwinding (gotta love that zzzzzzzzzzip sound!). I was putting the film in backwards through the film gate which is why I was having such a hard time. But like I said I fingered it out....

Okay, now I'm retarded

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