OK I'm terrified of C-41

dale116dot7 · Sep 17, 2016

I was very nervous about doing colour (though I usually do E6). I started out the same as most people do - black-and-white. At some point I thought 'what the heck, let's try this'. I processed a bunch of rolls of E6 in the Argentix kit (I think it is a Canadian repackaged version of one of the more commonly known kits). One time my temperatures were about 3C too low but I didn't notice and that ruined the film (magenta cast, high density), but as long as I kept the temperature within 1C, it worked pretty well. I got hooked on doing E6 - so much so that I bought a Jobo CPE2 + lift and a few of the Fuji-Hunt 6X E6 5L chemistry kits. I'd say just go for it, but do a few rolls of test shots to get used to it. If you have a colour test target I find that it can be useful to snap one of those as a cowboy test strip just to watch your processing consistency. One thing that I do is use propane (Tentenal Protectan is one convenient source) to help keep the chemicals from going bad - that works to prevent oxidation, but the chemicals still degrade with age.

But do wear that PPE. I usually work with a rubber apron, long gloves, a face shield, and a 3M VOC mask, and if I'm mixing powder developer I wear a combo P100/VOC mask instead of just the VOC one. That might be overkill.

lensworker · Oct 20, 2016

@Chadinko,

Don't be intimidated by C-41 developing - it's not hard at all. The key to color developing is adherence to the chemistry maker's instructions, especially temperature control during the developing stages.

I learned to develop film by developing E-6 film (Fuji Velvia) and had no trouble at all - the most important aspect is maintaining temperature control. Developing time and agitation are very important too. Good results are all about consistency.

Temperature control requires keeping a close watch but it is not hard. I have always developed my film in the kitchen sink, using warm and cold water in the sink as a temperature control bath for for my chemistry.

Just adhere to the instructions and the time and temperature table that comes with your chemistry and you'll do just fine.

Agulliver · Oct 20, 2016

I'm considering trying C41. I have been developing B&W on and off for around 30 years and have done E6 (135 and super 8). I was scared trying E6 because received wisdom is that colour is much more difficult than B&W but in the end it was pretty easy. I used the kitchen sink, and a good thermometer...got to the correct temperature by mixing hot & cold water and would typically add a bit more hot water part way through to keep the temperature within a degree centigrade of the recommendation. Never had any issues whatsoever. That worked with my Jobo 1520 tank and my ancient Lomo spiral tank for 8mm.

For better temperature control I like the idea of using a cool box, the type people take on picnics etc. That would be well insulated and once at the correct temperature it should keep within a degree for the time you need to get your films done.

I work with chemicals for a living, and some people are just susceptible to rashes or skin sensitisation and others are not. The only time I've ever had any issues was with a popular brand of laundry softener to be honest....and while I do not wear gloves for film/paper developing I would say it is good practice to wear disposable gloves when developing films/papers or mixing chemicals. Also have something to wipe your fingers on, even if it's just rag. I've stained a few pairs of trousers with B&W developer or fixer

When you've mouth pipetted cyanide, ID-11 or even C41 chemicals seem a bit tame. But everyone is different. Some people will find their skin is sensitive or develops sensitivity over time...others that it irritates the airways. It may also be a function of cumulative exposure...if you develop a few rolls once a month it might not do any harm to handle the chemicals. If it's a major hobby and you're getting your hands wet in chemicals a couple of times a week....better to wear gloves at least.

Halford · Oct 20, 2016

Agulliver said:
When you've mouth pipetted cyanide, ID-11 or even C41 chemicals seem a bit tame.

Ha ha, quite. I've never mouth pipetted that particular ion but my students hardly believe it when I tell them that we were taught to mouth pipette as undergrads. I consider having had a mouthful of hydrochloric acid to have been part of a robustly healthy upbringing :-D

Halford · Oct 20, 2016

Um, just to clarify I'm not actually promoting dangerous practices like mouth pipetting today -- just noting how things have changed in the relatively short space of time since I was an undergrad...

Agulliver · Oct 21, 2016

Halford said:
Um, just to clarify I'm not actually promoting dangerous practices like mouth pipetting today -- just noting how things have changed in the relatively short space of time since I was an undergrad...

Yes, I certainly wouldn't recommend it unless you know what you are doing. I learned in the 80s with a wonderful chemistry teacher at school. On our desks we each had a 25ml glass pipette, conical flask and pipette filler. "Now, I am going to teach you something that it is illegal for me to teach. You can use the plastic filler if you wish, but learning to mouth pipette will save you lots of time if you ever do chemistry for a living". Since I ended up working in school laboratories it has saved me countless hours. BUT....caveat....I am familiar with the toxicity etc. of most chemicals that I work with, and bright enough to look up something I am not familiar with. To my knowledge there's nothing in common photo chemicals that is likely to cause you harm if you splash a little on your hands or even ingest a small amount...but that doesn't mean I advocate being sloppy. Some of the bleaches in colour and reversal processing could contain moderately nasty stuff (my kitchen cupboard is stained with potassium dichromate...) Wearing gloves and perhaps protective eyewear is still good practice. Mind you....people are allergic to latex gloves while being fine on skin contact with benzene....so you never know!

I read of people using masks and even respirators when home processing films and I think it's overkill...but then I remember that every person is different. I love peanuts...to another person they are lethal.

robert.raymer · Nov 16, 2016

How important is the type of agitation to the whole process? Im about to develop my first rolls of c41 later this week. I am very familiar and comfortable with BW processing and usually prefer using the agitation stick to inversions when I process BW, but everything I have read about c-41 specifies inversions. I wouldn't think this would matter much since i know it doesn't in BW. My patterson tanks both leak a bit more than they should when inverted, so I am trying to avoid inversion if I can get the same result with stick agitation. Suggestions?

bvy · Nov 17, 2016

When I was using Paterson tanks, I would use the stick for the first thirty seconds then two inversions at 15 second intervals. The idea is to start agitation is quickly as possible, and you could spend a good ten seconds fumbling with that lid.

robert.raymer · Nov 17, 2016

bvy said:
When I was using Paterson tanks, I would use the stick for the first thirty seconds then two inversions at 15 second intervals. The idea is to start agitation is quickly as possible, and you could spend a good ten seconds fumbling with that lid.

Yeah, I get that. I was just curious if I could replace the inversions with stick agitation so that I would not be inverting at all. I agitate with the stick only (no innversions) with BW and it turns out fine. Both tanks I have leak more than I would like during inversions and If I can get away with it I would like to avoid the hassle/mess or having to buy new tanks.

bvy · Nov 17, 2016

Inversion is considered most effective for even development. That said, you can do worse than stick agitate the entire development step. Look for signs of uneven development in dense featureless areas of the film (e.g. skies). If it works for you, then it works.

mjork · Nov 17, 2016

I have tried this once: only stick agitation for a 120 film in C-41 developer. I was thinking that would make it much easier to keep development at the right temperature because I can leave the Paterson tank in the tempering water bath the whole time. The result: some pretty uneven development in bright sky areas. So I'm not going to do this again.

spacecadet · Nov 27, 2016

I develop C-41 at home in a slop sink, a $14 britta filter is connected to the faucet. I just get the water to 120 warm the chems to 102 and shut everything off. I just run through the steps with my iphone timer. I'm pretty sloppy but get great results. I'm in the middle of building a DIY drum rotator so I can develop at room temp / longer times. My 2 coworkers shoot color for fun and love coming over to develop rolls while we drink wine.

RattyMouse · Dec 3, 2016

Halford said:
Um, just to clarify I'm not actually promoting dangerous practices like mouth pipetting today -- just noting how things have changed in the relatively short space of time since I was an undergrad...

I was an undergrad chem student in the late 80s and we were told NEVER to mouth pipette under any circumstances. I dont know how far back you go.

RattyMouse · Dec 3, 2016

Agulliver said:
Yes, I certainly wouldn't recommend it unless you know what you are doing. I learned in the 80s with a wonderful chemistry teacher at school. On our desks we each had a 25ml glass pipette, conical flask and pipette filler. "Now, I am going to teach you something that it is illegal for me to teach. You can use the plastic filler if you wish, but learning to mouth pipette will save you lots of time if you ever do chemistry for a living". Since I ended up working in school laboratories it has saved me countless hours. BUT....caveat....I am familiar with the toxicity etc. of most chemicals that I work with, and bright enough to look up something I am not familiar with. To my knowledge there's nothing in common photo chemicals that is likely to cause you harm if you splash a little on your hands or even ingest a small amount...but that doesn't mean I advocate being sloppy. Some of the bleaches in colour and reversal processing could contain moderately nasty stuff (my kitchen cupboard is stained with potassium dichromate...) Wearing gloves and perhaps protective eyewear is still good practice. Mind you....people are allergic to latex gloves while being fine on skin contact with benzene....so you never know!

I read of people using masks and even respirators when home processing films and I think it's overkill...but then I remember that every person is different. I love peanuts...to another person they are lethal.

I showed your post here to the toxicologist at my company, a Phd chemist & toxicologist with just about 48 years industrial experience.

Never have I seen a man laugh so long and loud.

Sirius Glass · Dec 3, 2016

I used pipettes in chemistry and biochemistry laboratories, but I have never needed a pipette in a photographic laboratory. Could you focus a light or perhaps a safe light on the subject?

Sirius Glass · Dec 3, 2016

I have had no major problems processing C41 film. In fact I found processing C41 film in Jobo processors as easy as falling off a motorcycle.

Halford · Dec 4, 2016

RattyMouse said:
I was an undergrad chem student in the late 80s and we were told NEVER to mouth pipette under any circumstances. I dont know how far back you go.

Same era, different country & lab culture. Needless to say it's changed considerably since then!

Mr Bill · Dec 4, 2016

Sirius Glass said:
I used pipettes in chemistry and biochemistry laboratories, but I have never needed a pipette in a photographic laboratory. Could you focus a light or perhaps a safe light on the subject?

In the large photo lab where I spent some years we regenerated certain chemicals, in particular bleach and bleach-fix. We did plenty of wet-lab procedures using pipettes and volumetric flasks. The methods were similar to many you'll find in Kodak's H-24 (I think this is correct) manuals. You just don't do enough processing for it to be worthwhile (wink). (We literally used 3,000 gallons per day of regenerated bleach-fix at certain times of the year.)

jsmithphoto1 · Dec 4, 2016

It's easier and quicker than black and white!

Sirius Glass · Dec 4, 2016

Sirius Glass said:
I used pipettes in chemistry and biochemistry laboratories, but I have never needed a pipette in a photographic laboratory. Could you focus a light or perhaps a safe light on the subject?

Mr Bill said:
In the large photo lab where I spent some years we regenerated certain chemicals, in particular bleach and bleach-fix. We did plenty of wet-lab procedures using pipettes and volumetric flasks. The methods were similar to many you'll find in Kodak's H-24 (I think this is correct) manuals. You just don't do enough processing for it to be worthwhile (wink). (We literally used 3,000 gallons per day of regenerated bleach-fix at certain times of the year.)

You are right. I would drown literally and figuratively in those volumes.

OK I'm terrified of C-41

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency