Nikon F2 question on metering?

Ricardo Miranda · May 22, 2012

All AI lenses had the meter coupling shoe that all F2 metering prisms require, so all AI lenses would work with all F2 metering prisms.

That is correct if the lens is in factory condition. In reality many photographers took out the "rabbit ears", rendering them unusable for open-aperture metering on Non-Ai bodies.

The OP stated that his Nikkor has the inscription "Nikkor-H". That can only be a Non-Ai lens, albeit it could be Ai'd, which means converted to Ai standard.
Nikon changed the lens designation before changing the mount. The Nikkor-H 50mm became simply the Nikkor 50mm with a rubberised focusing ring and still as a Non-Ai lens.
The Nikon F2A and subsequent models had an Ai prism. If the lens isn't an Ai, it can only meter at working aperture.

Leigh B · May 22, 2012

Ricardo Miranda said:
In reality many photographers took out the "rabbit ears", rendering them unusable for open-aperture metering on Non-Ai bodies.

That would be easy to do... just remove two screws and the shoe falls off.
When I was repairing Nikons, back in the hey-day of the F3, I never saw a lens that had undergone such a transformation, but it's certainly possible.

Ricardo Miranda said:
The OP stated that his Nikkor has the inscription "Nikkor-H". That can only be a Non-Ai lens, albeit it could be Ai'd, which means converted to Ai standard.
Nikon changed the lens designation before changing the mount.

Yes, the H was a non-AI lens. These were commonly converted using the factory kits. I did quite a few of them; only took a couple of minutes.

Certainly if the OP's lens has not been converted, the meter would never sense changes in the setting of the aperture ring. It would still see shutter speed changes.

- Leigh

CGW · May 22, 2012

"In reality many photographers took out the "rabbit ears", rendering them unusable for open-aperture metering on Non-Ai bodies."

Really? I've seen a couple Nikon MF lenses and very few were missing the rabbit ears. What possible reason is there for removing them? Ever wonder why Nikon still puts them on their MF lenses??? Answer???

LJSLATER · May 22, 2012

CGW said:
Really? I've seen a couple Nikon MF lenses and very few were missing the rabbit ears. What possible reason is there for removing them?

It makes the ADR much easier to see on AI bodies. The coupling prongs are redundant on said bodies anyway.

In response to the OP, I concur with the others; the meter most likely needs attention. Take the batteries out to avoid distraction and either guess the exposure or use the meter in your Pentax.

CGW · May 22, 2012

It makes the ADR much easier to see on AI bodies.

At all apertures, right? Not enough to make a difference.

Leigh B · May 22, 2012

LJSLATER said:
It makes the ADR much easier to see on AI bodies.

??? Sorry, I don't understand that.

The coupling shoe sits in front of the ADR scale on lenses so equipped. ADR uses a separate set of tiny numbers at the rear of the aperture ring, not the ones the user looks at,
so the ADR view is straight down from the prism, not obliquely to the larger numbers on the ring.

The only degradation of the ADR would be some minor shadowing of ambient light if it was coming predominantly from a single direction, but not at all if it was diffused.

- Leigh

lxdude · May 22, 2012

LJSLATER said:
It makes the ADR much easier to see on AI bodies. The coupling prongs are redundant on said bodies anyway.

They were also removed because they stick out and some people found them annoying. I did that with mine when I used F2's because I had the plain prisms. I liked handling them better without and it was easier to pull them out of the pockets in the bag. I put them back on when I sold them.
I've seen a fair number without the rabbit ears in use, but used lenses for sale always had them. I suppose if a shop got one without the ears they'd replace them before sale.

lxdude · May 22, 2012

Leigh B said:
The only degradation of the ADR would be some minor shadowing of ambient light if it was coming predominantly from a single direction, but not at all if it was diffused.

- Leigh

Yes, in dim, directional light I notice a difference on my F3 if I use a lens with the ears. Not extreme, and it wouldn't be an issue at all if the damn illuminator worked right!

Ricardo Miranda · May 22, 2012

Really? I've seen a couple Nikon MF lenses and very few were missing the rabbit ears. What possible reason is there for removing them? Ever wonder why Nikon still puts them on their MF lenses??? Answer???

It was a common practice among newspaper photographers in the UK, especially when they changed to the F3. As said above, it was redundant on Ai bodies and it made the lenses easier to get in and out of a bag.
There are many AIS lenses that don't have the "rabbit ears", which is a pity! Personally I have a 50mm F1.8 and a Vivitar 105mm F2.5 that never had them.

CGW · May 22, 2012

Ricardo Miranda said:
It was a common practice among newspaper photographers in the UK, especially when they changed to the F3. As said above, it was redundant on Ai bodies and it made the lenses easier to get in and out of a bag.
There are many AIS lenses that don't have the "rabbit ears", which is a pity! Personally I have a 50mm F1.8 and a Vivitar 105mm F2.5 that never had them.

Common Nikkor MF lenses had ears with the exception of the E series.

2bits · May 22, 2012

Ok, Here's what seems to be going on. I've now put the lens on and pulled it off a dozen times. When I go thru the proccess of proper mounting, and the lens clicks into place it is locking open to the largest aperture "2" and staying there. Ican rotate the ring all the way to f16 and it's still at full open aperture.
My soligor 80-200 has a red N/AI letters in the mounting ring. My standard Nikon 50mm does not say that. Any connection? It is the standard 50mm lens that locks up to the largest aperture, I noticed this happens when the lens release button pops up when the lens clicks into place.
This unit does not have the A" button on the meter, all you do is push up the coupling arm with a coin to release it
Anymore advice from you guys would be great on what to do at this point.

E. von Hoegh · May 22, 2012

You 50mm Nikkor H, when mounted on the camera, will remain wide open for viewing regardless of the aperture you select. The 50 will stop down for preview when you press the DoF preview button/lever on the camera body.
Yor camera will not couple to AI lenses without the coupling prong. If the 80-200 does not have the prong, you will have to use stopdown metering. This procedure will be explained in the manual, I'm not familiar with the meter prisms for F2s.

Ricardo Miranda · May 22, 2012

2bits
Can you provide photos of your F2 and of the Nikkor 50mm, please? Have you read the Mir site?
Look carefully to the following, paying attention to the elements within the circle:

Is it like your Nikkor-H 50mm?

Now, the meter:

Does it look like this one? Or this one?

Leigh B · May 22, 2012

2bits said:
When I go thru the proccess of proper mounting, and the lens clicks into place it is locking open to the largest aperture "2" and staying there. Ican rotate the ring all the way to f16 and it's still at full open aperture.

The diaphragm should stay open so you can view through the lens until you actually take a picture.

Set the aperture ring for smallest opening (largest number) and set a moderately slow shutter speed (1/4 second or so).
Observe the lens from the front when you press the shutter release. You should see the diaphragm close down during the exposure.

2bits said:
My soligor 80-200 has a red N/AI letters in the mounting ring. My standard Nikon 50mm does not say that. Any connection?

Soligor made lenses for many makes of cameras. The red N/AI notation identifies yours as being for Nikon cameras, and the lens has the AI feature.
The Nikon lens has no such identification because they only made lenses for their own cameras (there are a few exceptions).

You've not commented on the coupling shoe that many of us have mentioned.
Do both lenses have this shoe? If not, which have it and which do not?

- Leigh

2bits · May 22, 2012

I think I got it! Both lenses have the coupling shoe. I was not checking DOF when I set aperture. Mudman walked me thru it all a little while ago and everything functions as it should. The light meter works great also. So I'm good to go.
I sure appreciate everyone's input, when I piece together all of your comments, it started making sense.
Mudman, Thanks for your patience!
Ray

Leigh B · May 22, 2012

You should not need to use DoF preview (called "stop-down metering") to meter properly with that equipment. The prisms are designed to use full-aperture metering (wide open).

However, if it's working and you're satisfied with the operating method, go for it.

- Leigh

2bits · May 22, 2012

Leigh, I'm aware of that now,
Thanks Ray

Chan Tran · May 22, 2012

Since the OP said that the camera has a needle to indicate exposure then it's must be the DP1 or DP11 viewfinder (F2 Photomic or F2A Photomic). While there is no confirmation from the OP that whether it is the F2 Photomic or F2A but I think it's the F2A. I hope the OP can confirm this.

2bits · May 23, 2012

Chan,
I think it is the DP1 finder, F2 Photomic. Anyway its all been figured out, just operator error! Thanks for the help.
2bits

Ricardo Miranda · May 23, 2012

Great! Now, go out, buy a brick of film and have a good shooting!

2bits · May 23, 2012

Ricardo,
That is the plan! I sure appreciate all the input I've had on this. I was swamped in confusion, this was operator headspace at it's best (worst). Haha
2bits

Ricardo Miranda · May 23, 2012

All the best to you!

Nikon F2 question on metering?

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