Newbie.....Help me buy a Large Format Camera.....

Sagelike · Oct 15, 2008

Ok so I'm looking to make the jump.

I started with my 35mm digital and moved on to medium format film.
I'm looking to move onto large format, 4X5.

I have used a 4x5 Toyo before and I like it very much.
The opportunity to move the front and the back plane is something that I would do more of (I do some architectural photography).

Now what I'm starting to come across is that are too many parts and factors to take into account.
For example:
- should I get one with the lens or without it?
- should I get one with the bellows or not?
- what type of lens is a good starter lens (brand)?
- used or new?

Much more choices than with a medium or a 35mm.
So help me out here.

I have about $1,500 to spend.
I'm going to need to need a whole outfit with tripod and with lens a little wider than standard (a little bigger than the equivalent of 50 on a 35mm?)

Should I go with a toyo, some other brand?
New or used?
Compile the parts?
Any retailers I should be looking at?

Help from the veterans would be great here.
Thanks in advance.

monkeykoder · Oct 15, 2008

All I can really say is I wish I had $1500 to spend on large format I'd have me a TON of lenses... As it is I bought myself a fairly worn out old calumet body and I'm working on the lenses. I figured $75 after shipping was too hard to pass up for the body... I would check out the classifieds here and see if there is something for a reasonable price.

Colin Corneau · Oct 15, 2008

The normal advice in a case like this is to suggest a Crown or Speed Graphic...however, if your interest is in architectural photography, you need more movements than a camera like that can offer.

Helpful information, that. A monorail camera is a good bet.

Sagelike · Oct 15, 2008

Colin Corneau said:
The normal advice in a case like this is to suggest a Crown or Speed Graphic...however, if your interest is in architectural photography, you need more movements than a camera like that can offer.

Helpful information, that. A monorail camera is a good bet.

Monorail!!!!!!

That's what's it's called.

I also don't need a monorail. I did like the movements however.

2F/2F · Oct 15, 2008

I would sign up at the local CC and try large format first. Learn how to use it. Then buy one when you are sure that's what you want. The best first step in something is rarely to buy #*%#.

Sagelike · Oct 15, 2008

2F/2F said:
I would sign up at the local CC and try large format first. Learn how to use it. Then buy one when you are sure that's what you want. The best first step in something is rarely to buy #*%#.

Well if that's the case then it's the Toyo 4x5 monorail that I used and what I am comfortable with.

I guess I wasn't sure if I should be buying lenses, body and bellows separately or buying the entire outfit.

monkeykoder · Oct 15, 2008

If you find an outfit for a reasonable price go for it. Most community colleges I know of expect you to have your own equipment and here in CA even the state college I go to requires you to be a photography major to take the large format class.

Sagelike · Oct 15, 2008

monkeykoder said:
If you find an outfit for a reasonable price go for it. Most community colleges I know of expect you to have your own equipment and here in CA even the state college I go to requires you to be a photography major to take the large format class.

What's a reasonable price?

monkeykoder · Oct 15, 2008

I wish I know I know what a reasonable price for a speed or crown graphic is but it all depends on what you want out of the system.

Sagelike · Oct 15, 2008

monkeykoder said:
I wish I know I know what a reasonable price for a speed or crown graphic is but it all depends on what you want out of the system.

Nothing special.

I have to reiterate, this will be my first large format camera that I will be purchasing. What I want is a good starter camera that I build on from there.

Hope I'm not being too vague.

2F/2F · Oct 15, 2008

monkeykoder said:
If you find an outfit for a reasonable price go for it. Most community colleges I know of expect you to have your own equipment and here in CA even the state college I go to requires you to be a photography major to take the large format class.

The CA CC at which I took classes has about 20 of their own large format cameras and introduces students to them in the first photo class, and then for your second class you have the option of taking the large format class. It really depends on the school, I think, and not the state.

2F/2F · Oct 15, 2008

Ok, well....What's a reasonable price? ...and you want one that will let you start building a system?

I would say Toyo is a great option! Reasonable price: CHEEP! Check completed ebay auctions to get a price range.

monkeykoder · Oct 15, 2008

Sadly I'm new at this myself I did a lot of research on ebay to get some idea of what prices should be then I bought my body off of a guy that posts on here and thephotoforum. I'm still working on lenses. If you read enough and search up on the completed auctions on ebay you should be able to figure out what prices should be like. I'd also check the classifieds on here as I saw what I believe to be a good deal on a Sinar F there.

monkeykoder · Oct 15, 2008

2F/2F said:
The CA CC at which I took classes has about 20 of their own large format cameras and introduces students to them in the first photo class, and then for your second class you have the option of taking the large format class. It really depends on the school, I think, and not the state.

Probably very true I do have a limited experience with CCs just 2 or three of them in my local area they would probably be more likely to have them in colleges with better photography programs.

Bob-D659 · Oct 15, 2008

Well you can get a good idea on prices by looking at keh.com they have quite a number at the moment.

Sagelike · Oct 15, 2008

Bob-D659 said:
Well you can get a good idea on prices by looking at keh.com they have quite a number at the moment.

Yeah, I was looking at them also.

I guess at the end of the day I'll be going to them.

monkeykoder · Oct 15, 2008

Did you have a look at the setup in the classifieds or is that too much of a risk for you?

Sagelike · Oct 15, 2008

monkeykoder said:
Did you have a look at the setup in the classifieds or is that too much of a risk for you?

Yeah, if I'm not dealing locally or thru a retailer I'm not comfortable with giving a months rent to anyone.

I'll give a browse through for anyone local.

John Kasaian · Oct 16, 2008

Calumet made a 400 series (402?) architectural monorial camera. You can get them for $150-175. Its a good deal for what you want to do. Add a 90mm Super Angulon and you can do architecture 'til the cows come home. A good tripod and some film holders and you're in business. All this is used gear and I'd espect the bill of fare might come in at under $750 total. A more useful lens for general photography would be a symmar double convertible. Talk with Jim at Midwest Photo.

removed account4 · Oct 16, 2008

toyos are a very nice modular system.
that means you can buy a 4x5 toyo monorail
and ifyou want to expand it to be a 5x7 or 8x10 camera
you keep the front standard and buy a new back and bellows and maybe a
new rail for the camera ( not to forget lenses if the lenses you will already have
won't be suited for a larger format ).

i use a toyo45cx and it has suited me well for many years, but i started off with
a graphic view II, a camera i wish i never sold. the graphic view II is a solid/well built
camera that can take 90mm (wide) to more than 210mm ( long ) and it will afford you
as many movements that you can imagine you would need shooting architectural photographs.
often times they come in a fiber box that holds the camera, film holders, lenses dark cloth, light meter
and the camera. they are worth their weight in gold!

i am not sure if you have poked around http://www.graflex.org but they have a ton of information on graphic/graflex cameras.

good luck!
john

keithwms · Oct 16, 2008

Sagelike said:
I have used a 4x5 Toyo before and I like it very much. The opportunity to move the front and the back plane is something that I would do more of (I do some architectural photography).

If you want to do wide angle architecture with perspective correction then you may want a system that enables you to use bag bellows. Most field systems are wretched for wide architecture and don't permit you to swap out bellows or to get very short bellows extensions.

Think about focal lengths and field of view and what you want to be able to shoot with this camera; that will guide you to the lenses, which will then guide you to an informed decision about what sort of bellows options you need.

Nick Zentena · Oct 16, 2008

About building a long term system. Lens and filmholders are basically universal. You might need new lensboards to mount the lenses to a different body but that's not too hard or expensive.

New? I think Badger has a deal on new starter field cameras. Used will be much much cheaper.

When you say architecture what do you mean? Old barns aren't that demanding. I'm guessing the guys doing interiors need much more from the camera.

Sagelike · Oct 16, 2008

jnanian said:
toyos are a very nice modular system.
that means you can buy a 4x5 toyo monorail
and ifyou want to expand it to be a 5x7 or 8x10 camera
you keep the front standard and buy a new back and bellows and maybe a
new rail for the camera ( not to forget lenses if the lenses you will already have
won't be suited for a larger format ).

i use a toyo45cx and it has suited me well for many years, but i started off with
a graphic view II, a camera i wish i never sold. the graphic view II is a solid/well built
camera that can take 90mm (wide) to more than 210mm ( long ) and it will afford you
as many movements that you can imagine you would need shooting architectural photographs.
often times they come in a fiber box that holds the camera, film holders, lenses dark cloth, light meter
and the camera. they are worth their weight in gold!

i am not sure if you have poked around http://www.graflex.org but they have a ton of information on graphic/graflex cameras.

good luck!
john

This is great information.
'ppreciate it.

Nick Zentena said:
About building a long term system. Lens and filmholders are basically universal. You might need new lensboards to mount the lenses to a different body but that's not too hard or expensive.

New? I think Badger has a deal on new starter field cameras. Used will be much much cheaper.

When you say architecture what do you mean? Old barns aren't that demanding. I'm guessing the guys doing interiors need much more from the camera.

Well for now it's light exterior work but at some point I want to do more interior work.

So the main thing is to be able to add on once I start.

monkeykoder · Oct 16, 2008

Well from what I've read you'll probably want a camera with interchangeable bellows so you can have a bag bellows for wide angle and a standard bellows for your other lenses.

Bob-D659 · Oct 16, 2008

They all can be added onto until you run out of storage room Seeing as the camera body is almost the least expensive major part of a "starter system", you can get two for the price of one excellent lens if buying used, unless you set your sights on a Linhof 5x7. Depending on where you live, you may find a system locally for a real good price, or check the classifieds on this site, there is a nice looking Toyo hiding there, or order one from KEH.

Newbie.....Help me buy a Large Format Camera.....

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