New to Large Format - Can you use LF camera with Medium Format Backs?

Dan_123 · May 18, 2020

Hello, I want to get started with large format and have been told that it may be possible to use a LF camera (so that I can correct parallels) with a medium format back. Is that possible?

I don't know much about makes and kit so if there are any recommendations for good makes that are relatively portable for field work I would be grateful.

Many thanks,
Dan

esearing · May 18, 2020

In general, there are cameras with a graflock back which accept MF backs by removing the ground glass. these usually come in 6x7,6x9, or 6x12. You can not use a back off of a MF camera unless the ground glass and film plane on the back are the same and would have to have a receiving adapter (I have not seen one). But you can buy a 4x5 holder much cheaper and crop the negative for the same effect. You get the added benefit of individual sheet processing vs roll processing where all images are developed to the same density.

Kodachromeguy · May 18, 2020

Simple answer: yes. Many brands of large format cameras could use roll film (120) backs. You have several camera sizes to select:

1. A 2x3 camera like a Horseman VHR, which is made for roll film. There are many other brands that offered 2x3 cameras, both drop-bed or monorail design. Note the confusing name. It typically refers to 6x9 cm film size on 120 film.

2. A 4x5 with a roll film back. Bulkier than no. 1 above but you can also use 4x5" film if you want. You can even buy 6x12 backs for wide panoramas.

Dennis-B · May 18, 2020

One of the easiest roll film backs to use is the Calumet. It slides in like a 4x5 film holder, and comes in 6x6, 6x7, 6x9. I own a 6x7 version, and I used 1/8" chartpak tape to make a 6x7 outline on the ground glass. Years back, when I did portraits commercially, I could use a 150mm lens for head and shoulder portraits.

B.S.Kumar · May 18, 2020

esearing said:
In general, there are cameras with a graflock back which accept MF backs by removing the ground glass. these usually come in 6x7,6x9, or 6x12. You can not use a back off of a MF camera unless the ground glass and film plane on the back are the same and would have to have a receiving adapter (I have not seen one). .

Sinar made an adapter for Hasselblad V film backs. It had the winding crank as well as a dedicated focusing screen.

Dan_123 · May 18, 2020

Thanks so much for the help you've given, everyone. I will follow up on what you have advised.

Sirius Glass · May 18, 2020

Welcome and yes there are roll film and sheet film backs. I just found it easier to buy 4"x5" Ilford black & white film and shoot than fiddle with the extra equipment and guess what was in or out of the view. Also it is easier to work with the 4"x5" negative in the darkroom enlarger.

Ian Grant · May 18, 2020

Dan_123 said:
Thanks so much for the help you've given, everyone. I will follow up on what you have advised.

Your choice will depend on the intended camera. if it's 5x4 then 6x6, 6x7, 6x9 and 6x12 backs are available with a Graflok style back. fewer if not your choice is more limited.

Ian

Alan Gales · May 18, 2020

Sirius Glass said:
Welcome and yes there are roll film and sheet film backs. I just found it easier to buy 4"x5" Ilford black & white film and shoot than fiddle with the extra equipment and guess what was in or out of the view. Also it is easier to work with the 4"x5" negative in the darkroom enlarger.

+1

I completely agree! The larger the film format the easier it is to see the effects of camera movements too. I find 8x10 even more enjoyable than 4x5. I do own a Mamiya C220f for when I want to shoot medium format film.

Welcome to the forum, Dan!

Vaughn · May 18, 2020

Dennis-B said:
One of the easiest roll film backs to use is the Calumet. It slides in like a 4x5 film holder, and comes in 6x6, 6x7, 6x9. I own a 6x7 version, and I used 1/8" chartpak tape to make a 6x7 outline on the ground glass. Years back, when I did portraits commercially, I could use a 150mm lens for head and shoulder portraits.

I used a 6x7 version -- the only draw back is that the holders bend the film 180 degrees around a roller in the reverse of the normal film curvature. If the film is not advanced, over a length of time (overnight) the film would retain the distortion caused be being bent backwards -- making it difficult to unload the holder without fogging the film, as the film would not roll up tightly on the take-up reel. I sometimes would unload in a changing bag. Normally I would finish the roll before the end of the day and not reload until the next day.

But I enjoyed using color film with it and still have full use of camera movements. Gum tree, NSW, Australia, early morning before the flies became obnoxious. Kodak Portra, RA4 print

MattKing · May 18, 2020

A minor caution. A 6x7 image on a 4x5 ground glass is fairly small and therefore isn't nearly as easy to work with as a 6x7 image in the viewing system of a 6x7 SLR.

seall · May 18, 2020

There are adapters which you can use to enable something like an RB67 6x7 back to fit a 4x5 Graflok mechanism but they are extortionate. Do a search for "Mamiya RB67 Roll Film Back Magazine Adapter For All 4x5" on that auction site, it is listed at $163 which in my opinion is way over the top.

I occasionally use a Wista 6x9 120 back which very works well, it has given me no problems whatsoever. Paid £70 for it.

Donald Qualls · May 18, 2020

I have something called an "Adapt-a-Roll Six-20" -- it's a slide-in roll film holder, rather like the Calumet unit on a budget, in which (if you have the masks) you can make 6x6 and 6x9 images in any spring back 4x5 camera -- providing you have 620 spools to take up the 120 film on. It accepts a 120 supply (trimmed, as I recall -- haven't opened mine in a while). Compose and focus on the ground glass, then slide the roll holder into place like a 4x5 film holder. Close shutter, pull dark slide (and optionally insert frame mask in its place), exposed, return dark slide, then advance the correct number of ratchet clicks. Like most that have both rolls on the same end of the adapter (which is almost all that slip under a spring back), it bends the film "backward" fairly tightly where it turns around at the inserted end, and mine required a single layer wrap of friction tape on the ratchet drive roller to increase frame spacing a little -- but it didn't cost what a Calumet roll holder did/does.

Dan Fromm · May 18, 2020

Um, Donald, IIRC the AAR 620 came with a mask for 6x7 and none for 6x6. Also, the 4x5 size AAR 620 -- it was made in sizes to fit 2x3, 3x4 and 4x5 cameras, so if you get one, OP, make sure it is the right size -- has its gate offset ~ 7 mm towards the camera's insertion side from the center of the camera's gate. I have one, have measured.

Vaughn · May 18, 2020

MattKing said:
A minor caution A 6x7 image on a 4x5 ground glass is fairly small and therefore isn't nearly as easy to work with as a 6x7 image in the viewing system of a 6x7 SLR.

Cool, I did not realize that the SLR magnified/enlarged the image...or is it because you can put your eye right up to the SLR viewer? My TLR's GG is the same size as the negative, viewing it really no different than seeing the same size image on a 4x5 GG...except upside down and not backwards.

I have a Gowland PocketView 4x5, marketed by Calumet, and the GG was already marked for Calumet's 6x7 rollfilm adapter. Pretty nice and easy to compose. Perhaps a good loupe would help to get close to what one sees in a SLR.

MattKing · May 18, 2020

There is no magnification on the ground glass. But the prism or the magnifier in the folding waist level finder do, as you say, permit you to bring your eye up to the viewer and also exclude extraneous light.

grat · May 18, 2020

But to be fair, that's not much different than putting a magnifying glass up to the ground glass on a 4x5, which most people do to check focus anyway.

I got a 120 adapter because I want to do 6x17, but also, shooting 120 is a bit less expensive than shooting 4x5, especially in color. Having one camera that can do 4x5, 6x9, 6x12 and 6x17, with movements, is kind of nice, although there's a significant weight penalty for the roll film back.

Vaughn · May 19, 2020

grat said:
... Having one camera that can do 4x5, 6x9, 6x12 and 6x17, with movements, is kind of nice, although there's a significant weight penalty for the roll film back.

You can also modify a darkslide to get two 2.5"x5"images on a sheet of 4x5...actually, the image area is probably closer to 6cm x 12cm which is covered!

grat · May 19, 2020

Vaughn said:
You can also modify a darkslide to get two 2.5"x5"images on a sheet of 4x5...actually, the image area is probably closer to 6cm x 12cm which is covered!

I could. Seems like a lot of work to do something I can already do easier.

Vaughn · May 19, 2020

Yeah...The only advantage is if you are out with only 4x5 holders (the modified darkslide weighs little) or rarely make a 6x12 image. Or liked working with a thicker film base, perhaps. It makes more sense when I do it with 8x10 and 11x14.

Donald Qualls · May 19, 2020

Dan Fromm said:
Um, Donald, IIRC the AAR 620 came with a mask for 6x7 and none for 6x6. Also, the 4x5 size AAR 620 -- it was made in sizes to fit 2x3, 3x4 and 4x5 cameras, so if you get one, OP, make sure it is the right size -- has its gate offset ~ 7 mm towards the camera's insertion side from the center of the camera's gate. I have one, have measured.

I'll have to take your word for what masks the unit included. Mine came with the original box and template for penciling the ground glass for framing (and yes, it's offset, 7mm looks about right), but no mask. I do recall reading or figuring out that with the ratchet setup, you can easily advance 6x6, 6x7, and 6x9 by counting clicks. I've meant to get a couple spare dark slides and make masks for mine...

Dan Fromm · May 19, 2020

Donald, 2x3 = 4 clicks, a very short 6x7 = 3 clicks, 645 = 2 clicks.

The smaller formats were shot using a short dark slide that exposed the far end of the gate. A normal full-length dark slide had to be inserted before removing the AAR from the camera. And the part of the film that got exposed was well offset in the camera's gate.

Don't get me wrong, I've used AAR 620s for going on 30 years, but they're somewhat Rube Goldberg.

Dennis-B · May 19, 2020

MattKing said:
A minor caution. A 6x7 image on a 4x5 ground glass is fairly small and therefore isn't nearly as easy to work with as a 6x7 image in the viewing system of a 6x7 SLR.

I always use a 4x or 8x loupe for the ground glass, regardless the format.

New to Large Format - Can you use LF camera with Medium Format Backs?

Dan_123

esearing

Kodachromeguy

Dennis-B

B.S.Kumar

Dan_123

Sirius Glass

Ian Grant

Alan Gales

Vaughn

Attachments

MattKing

Moderator

seall

Donald Qualls

Dan Fromm

Vaughn

MattKing

Moderator

grat

Vaughn

grat

Vaughn

Donald Qualls

Dan Fromm

Dennis-B

New to Large Format - Can you use LF camera with Medium Format Backs?

Attachments

Moderator

Moderator

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency