New Nikon F 50 Year Aniversary Edition!

isaacc7 · Aug 19, 2007

Huh?

I have never, and will never understand the appeal of those early F's. They are heavy and clunky, and if you have the metering prism on, the shutter speeds wheel feels really odd. If I had to chose a nikon to shoot with, it would probably be the F3 as long as I wasn't using flash. My favorite all round Nikon had to be the FM3a and/or the FM2. No, they weren't "tanks" like the early f's, but that's the real appeal. My vote for the worst of the F's would have to be the original, followed by the f4 and then the F2. Maybe my bias against heavy miniature formats cameras is showing

Isaac

snegron · Aug 19, 2007

isaacc7 said:
I have never, and will never understand the appeal of those early F's. They are heavy and clunky, and if you have the metering prism on, the shutter speeds wheel feels really odd. If I had to chose a nikon to shoot with, it would probably be the F3 as long as I wasn't using flash. My favorite all round Nikon had to be the FM3a and/or the FM2. No, they weren't "tanks" like the early f's, but that's the real appeal. My vote for the worst of the F's would have to be the original, followed by the f4 and then the F2. Maybe my bias against heavy miniature formats cameras is showing

Isaac

The appeal, at least for me, of the Nikon F is its rugged simplicity. It is not a large camera, but it is heavier than most other F models. It gives the impression of holding an instrument built to very high standards both in design and craftsmanship.

I have several other Nikons including the F2A, F3HP, FM2N, F100, and DSLR models as well. All these other cameras might be technologically superior to the old F, but they lack the feel of the F. I do enjoy using the other cameras (especially my F3HP with MD4 motordrive), and their in camera metering (except for the F2A) is very convenient.

Again, I think it is a matter of how the camera feels. In many cases taking photographs requires motivation. Besides the subject matter being photographed, some cameras provide motivation for shooting as well. My F puts me in a different mood than my other cameras and this "mood" is reflected in the final printed images. It's not just about "using the right tool for the right job". Photography is not TV repair or road paving, it is an art form. As with any art form, the instrument used must be an extension of the artist (I know, a bit cliche but true). My auto everything cameras have their place and I use them when I need fast results (like at weddings for example). When I have time to stop and smell the roses (or photograph them), I like doing it with a legendary camera that motivates me like the F.

I was not lucky enough to have been around to purchcase a first edition F in 1959, so I think that Nikon would be offering some of us later-born Nikon fans the opportunity to own a camera that revolutionized photography.

Dan Fromm · Aug 19, 2007

snegron said:
<snip> There are many of us in other parts of the world (not judging by the response on this thread) that would love to purchase their collector edition cameras. :rolleyes:

I wonder if Nikon is aware that there are people outside Japan that collect Nikon cameras?

Speak for yourself, snegron. For me cameras are tools. I wouldn't pay more for a "special edition" than for normal production.

Inquiring minds want to know whether you've lost enough weight to be able to buy that Leica you were carrying on about a while ago.

Inquiring minds also want to know why you launched this thread. Surely Nikon can do market research better and more thoroughly than you.

Richard Kelham · Aug 19, 2007

I have very fond feelings towards my first (well alright, not *that* fond after all it's only a camera) Nikon F which I bought second hand when I was a penniless student in the late '60s. It served me well for many years indeed it still gets used, though mostly only on the copystand. I have had a great many Nikons since then (currently 6 bodies and 11 lenses but that's another thread).

That said there is no way I would pay serious money for a special commemorative edition of that, or indeed of anything. That's a mugs' game.

Sorry Nikon!

Richard

snegron · Aug 19, 2007

Dan Fromm said:
Speak for yourself, snegron. For me cameras are tools. I wouldn't pay more for a "special edition" than for normal production.

Inquiring minds want to know whether you've lost enough weight to be able to buy that Leica you were carrying on about a while ago.

Inquiring minds also want to know why you launched this thread. Surely Nikon can do market research better and more thoroughly than you.

1. There are actually people out there who collect cameras. There is a market for it. Nikon, as well as Contax, Pentax, and others know this and have produced many collectors editions throughout the years. The FM2 had several collectors editions as did the FA, the F3, F2, and F5. I tried on several ocassions to purchase one of these models but they usually sold out before I had the chance to buy them. I have more than enough Nikon film bodies to last me a lifetime (or until Kodak and Fuji decide to stop making film), but I wouldn't think twice about getting a collector's edition F if Nikon made it.

2. I have lost 42 pounds so far since January! I need to drop 20 more and I will be ordering the Leica! All the weight lost so far has been simply by changing eating habits, no excercise. I have reached the point where the only way to loose the remaining pounds will be through excercise. I am considering though that I don't know if I like the Leica idea more than a 400mm 2.8 AF for my current Nikons! Who knows, I might be lucky and Nikon might have the 50 year anniversary limited edition F on the market when I'm ready to get my weight loss reward!

3. It is a "what if" type thread. Very common in these types of forums. :rolleyes: Don't get me started on Nikon marketing research! If they had any clue about what consumers wanted they would have never discontinued the FM3! And the idea that they discontinued it because it wasn't selling is not a valid consideration. Have you seen the prices of used FM3's on the market today? When available they are going for much more than when the bodies were new just 2 or 3 years ago!

IloveTLRs · Aug 19, 2007

I HATE camera collectors

I've never used an F, I've only played around with my dads. I don't see what's so wonderful about it, but I can see lots of Nikon fans in Japan eagerly plunking down plastic or yen to get one.

Dan Fromm · Aug 19, 2007

Snegron, good on you for the weight loss. Keep it up.

snegron · Aug 19, 2007

Dan Fromm said:
Snegron, good on you for the weight loss. Keep it up.

Thanks!

Roger Hicks · Aug 20, 2007

IloveTLRs said:
I HATE camera collectors

Why?

Most of the stuff they collect isn't usable anyway, and if it is usable, the price is forced up in proportion to its usability, e.g. the 90/2.2 Thambar is worth much the same to a user as to a collector.

isaacc7 · Aug 20, 2007

snegron said:
2. I have lost 42 pounds so far since January! I need to drop 20 more and I will be ordering the Leica! All the weight lost so far has been simply by changing eating habits, no excercise. I have reached the point where the only way to loose the remaining pounds will be through excercise. I am considering though that I don't know if I like the Leica idea more than a 400mm 2.8 AF for my current Nikons! Who knows, I might be lucky and Nikon might have the 50 year anniversary limited edition F on the market when I'm ready to get my weight loss reward!

3. It is a "what if" type thread. Very common in these types of forums. :rolleyes: Don't get me started on Nikon marketing research! If they had any clue about what consumers wanted they would have never discontinued the FM3! And the idea that they discontinued it because it wasn't selling is not a valid consideration. Have you seen the prices of used FM3's on the market today? When available they are going for much more than when the bodies were new just 2 or 3 years ago!

That's good news about the weight! I lost about 30 pounds without exercising and I thought that I'd have to really start to do strenuous exercise to take off more. Well, I moved to Yemen and promptly lost another 15 pounds. Welcome to the third world diet baby

As far them not selling enough FM3As, I think the answer is in the fact that they did stop producing them. If they were being sold at high enough numbers, you can be sure that they would have kept making them. The people that did buy them (and there aren't many) bought them to use primarily, so my guess is there aren't that many on the used market. Here's one data point, we sold more f6 cameras in a little under a year than we had sold FM3a cameras in 3 years! The Fm3a was not a popular camera, it did not sell enough to justify keeping it around, and Nikon needed to allocate it's resources to the FAR more popular (and hence lucrative) digital lines. You can be sure that if the demand were actually there when they were producing the camera, Nikon would have sold as many as it could...

Isaac

IloveTLRs · Aug 20, 2007

Roger Hicks said:
Why?

[rant]

In Japan M3s are $1500 and up, Nikon SPs $3000 and up, Rolleiflexes $1000 and up, black-body Canon Ps are so rare they're unavailable. The collectors I've met are snobs who pay a premium to then put their treasures in a glass case. They keep cameras out of the hands of people who deserve them - photographers. If the camera is some gold-plated limited edition then I can understand not wanting to use it, but otherwise cameras are meant to be used.

I met a collector over here who wanted to sell me an M3 for $650. When I tried to talk down the price a little he had a hissy-fit. All I said was "is that the final price?" :rolleyes:

[end rant]

lens_hacker · Aug 20, 2007

My three Nikon SP's have film in them right now.

I'm a collector, but shoot with all of them.

IloveTLRs · Aug 22, 2007

There's a difference between you and someone who just puts them in a case. I'm thinking of the guy who tried to sell me an M3, and this guy at work who has 50 cameras but never uses them. He knocked my Nikon FM because I had the plastic 1.8/50 and not the metal 1.4/50.

I'm a collector as well, but only cameras that I intend to use.

Uncle Bill · Aug 22, 2007

I have two Nikon F's one with a 641xxxx serial number that belonged to my dad and a later one with a Tn meter head I think made in '67 or early '68. Since I can get the real thing for cheap on Ebay, why buy a reproduction for close $3000 CAD? That's headed into Leica M territory.

snegron · Aug 23, 2007

Uncle Bill said:
I have two Nikon F's one with a 641xxxx serial number that belonged to my dad and a later one with a Tn meter head I think made in '67 or early '68. Since I can get the real thing for cheap on Ebay, why buy a reproduction for close $3000 CAD? That's headed into Leica M territory.

People paid a lot of money for the gold edition FA because it was a collector's item. If you consider the logic behind it, they werer in reality purchasing a 35mm camera with a 50mm 1.4 lens. Were the pictures going to be any better with the golden camera? My guess is no. Only collectors understand their reasons for buying things.

If I were to purchase the special edition F, I would use it on several ocassions. Not as a daily camera, but on special ocassions. It would not sit in a plastic wrap. I would take care though to keep it in pristine condition.

I use many of my cameras in this way as well. I will shoot with a Nikon F with FTN finder for a period of two weeks then put it away for several months. I rotate my cameras and lenses in this way and they appear to be in very good condition. This ensures that when I need a particular camera or lens I know it will be in near perfect condition and ready to use.

The only camera I have put away now because of a jumpy meter needle is my F2A. I have to send it to Sover Wong to get repaired, but I have not had the time to box it up, etc. Even my F100 that I planned to box after 10 rolls of film will be seeing action this weekend. I will shoot about 4 or 5 rolls then box it up again for another 3 or 4 months. Next week I will be using one of my F3HP's...

Photo Engineer · Aug 23, 2007

According to the Blue Book of rare cameras, and appraisal by an expert, my Nikon is worth more than any possible re-issue could be.

However, it is interesting to note that he said no one would pay the price as there was no demand. So basically, although valuable, my camera has no value as no one wants it.

PE

snegron · Aug 23, 2007

Photo Engineer said:
According to the Blue Book of rare cameras, and appraisal by an expert, my Nikon is worth more than any possible re-issue could be.

However, it is interesting to note that he said no one would pay the price as there was no demand. So basically, although valuable, my camera has no value as no one wants it.

PE

I'm sure that if you find the right channels you will get your price at auction. Just because there is no interest in the local market does not mean that there is no interest elsewhere.

Think about film cameras in general. Just about everyone has gone digital. There are still a few of us who still use film, but our numbers are dwindling (I know I will be publicly flogged for that comment here, whatever :rolleyes: ). The few of us who are left are buying up film equipment that was too expensive or unavailable several years ago. Instead of settling for an entry level 35mm, the prices have dropped to a point where you can now get more camera for your dollar. This, in turn, means that many of us look for rare or more exotic cameras and optics.

Photo Engineer · Aug 23, 2007

I don't disagree, but the price of my vintage Nikon is so inflated it is not in demand. This is an interesting conundrum but often is the case, when something is priced out of the existing market.

PE

snegron · Aug 24, 2007

Now I'm curious! Is this the elusive Nikon miniature that only two have been known to exist, yet no one has ever seen, or a first production F serial # 6400001 in mint condition in its original box? Maybe the first of the the black body series of 1960?

If it is indeed a very rare model you should have absolutely no problem selling it if you really want to. Again, the market in Japan is thriving with deep pocket collectors. I'm sure that if you contact a reputable camera broker in Japan you will get a substantial offer.

On a local level here in the U.S., I have noticed that the prices of F bodies has been going up, especially the ones with the logo stamped on top "Nippon Kogaku". I have also noticed that models that are a bit more rare (like their Apollo, red dot, or black body models) usually sell very quickly at a higher price.

Photo Engineer · Aug 24, 2007

SN 6426008. Standard Nikon F but this block of numbers occupies a separate paragraph in the Blue Book. I've read this and unless it has changed in the 2 years since I read it, it was a rare bird. The book listed the selling price in the $5000+ range depending on condition. This one is mint.

The SN is also out of sequence for Nikon numbering for some reason. You will see that in the Blue Book. It appears as if this sequence was never produced until you search and then find the #.

PE

snegron · Aug 24, 2007

Photo Engineer said:
SN 6426008. Standard Nikon F but this block of numbers occupies a separate paragraph in the Blue Book. I've read this and unless it has changed in the 2 years since I read it, it was a rare bird. The book listed the selling price in the $5000+ range depending on condition. This one is mint.

The SN is also out of sequence for Nikon numbering for some reason. You will see that in the Blue Book. It appears as if this sequence was never produced until you search and then find the #.

PE

Yes, you are correct, you have a very rare and valuable camera! Have you thought about contacting Nikon? They might be interested in this model for exhibition purposes. I believe it is a very desireable camera and you would have no problem getting its value if it went to auction especially in Japan.

Photo Engineer · Aug 24, 2007

Never gave it a thought, but thanks.

I also have a vintage first edition Nikon telezoom lens. It weighs a ton and looks like a bazooka.

PE

snegron · Aug 25, 2007

Photo Engineer said:
Never gave it a thought, but thanks.

I also have a vintage first edition Nikon telezoom lens. It weighs a ton and looks like a bazooka.

PE

Any chance it might be a 1959 model 8.5-25cm f/4-4.5 from the first series prior to the zoom and focus ring reconfigurations? Or a 3.5-8.5cm f2.8-4?

lens_hacker · Aug 25, 2007

The "66" block of Nikon's is known to be very rare. The Nikon S3 half frame was produced in very small numbers, but used the 66 block. The "65" block has a "hole" at the beginning of the block bacause of the Nikon S4, which occupies ~6,000 numbers in the 65 block.

I was not aware of holes in the 64 block. Does the blue book state anymore about it?

snegron · Aug 25, 2007

I have come up with an anology for collecting and using old Nikon F cameras. Consider writswatches for example. The main function of a watch is to display time, a camera to capture photographs.

-Both are complex mechanical devices.
-Both have older and newer technology (analog/digital, mechanical/digital).
-Some people collect old expensive watches, some collect old cameras.
-Why do people pay so much for a Rollex, Patek Philipe, Longines, Movado, etc., when they can get a much more accurate digital watch with atomic time accuracy for under $100.00 at the nearest Walmart store? Why do some people buy manual everything cameras when they can get state of the art auto everything cameras?
-many who collect watches also use those collectable watches, many who collect cameras also use their collectable cameras.

If you think about this for a minute you will see the similarities between watch collectors and camera collectors. Just because a person wants to buy a limited edition F does not mean that he would put it away in the vault for future resale.

I believe that there are different categories of collectors. There are those who collect for investment purposes and those who collect for personal/senitmental value reasons. In my case I would buy the special edition F as I have stated before because it would have a significant meaning for me. Yes, I would take extreme care of it and use it on very special ocassions, but I wouldn't buy it just to make money off of it. It would be a keeper.

p.s. I have the cheap atomic digital display watch I purchased at Walmart! It is extremely accurate, shock resistant, waterproof and can tell the time in several different countries I can't afford to travel to!

New Nikon F 50 Year Aniversary Edition!

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