New Metropolis film on kickstarter from Lomo!

cmacd123 · Dec 1, 2019

CMoore said:
Why would they start with 110..... is there a big demand for that.?

Lomography is the only retailer who is offering a 110 film. And to do that they have lined up a supplier who can manufacture and package 110 cartriges and load film into them. (one assumes that that deal would include a commitment to take delivery of so many Cartridges of packed film every year.

Lomography ALSO is a seller of some 110 size cameras. which is probably WHY they bothered to make 110 film. https://shop.lomography.com/en/cameras/110-camera-family?country=en

it is proably not a major commitment for them to have their 110 film converting supplier load a pancake or two of the Metropolis film into 110 cartridges.

pentaxuser · Dec 1, 2019

Thanks for the clarification, Henning. It is just that these days getting to the truth and plain unvarnished facts seems to be out of fashion. Reading the Lomography "blurb" on its new film did not really help me at all.

pentaxuser

CMoore · Dec 1, 2019

cmacd123 said:
Lomography is the only retailer who is offering a 110 film. And to do that they have lined up a supplier who can manufacture and package 110 cartriges and load film into them. (one assumes that that deal would include a commitment to take delivery of so many Cartridges of packed film every year.

Lomography ALSO is a seller of some 110 size cameras. which is probably WHY they bothered to make 110 film. https://shop.lomography.com/en/cameras/110-camera-family?country=en

it is proably not a major commitment for them to have their 110 film converting supplier load a pancake or two of the Metropolis film into 110 cartridges.

10-4..... Thank You

brbo · Dec 2, 2019

Henning Serger said:
Yes, of course they are. With lots of years of experience in making colour films. You need that experience to make such a film. It would be impossible for a young start-up to produce colour film (or any film at all, but colour film is of course much much more difficult to produce than BW film).
The factory is also very modern and equipped with state-of-the-art technology. This film is just one part of a silver-halide product portfolio of many different products.

Now, imagine all those clever people with state of the art technology at their disposal and all they choose (are "forced") to produce is... Metropolis, Purple, Redscale...

If only there was a market for proper C-41, E-6 film, righ?!

Henning Serger · Dec 2, 2019

brbo said:
Now, imagine all those clever people with state of the art technology at their disposal and all they choose (are "forced") to produce is... Metropolis, Purple, Redscale...

If only there was a market for proper C-41, E-6 film, righ?!

If you quote my posting, why don't you read it ?
I've written: "This film is just one part of a silver-halide product portfolio of many different products."
Most of their silver-halide products are "proper" products as you say / describe it. Often highest quality products.
And they even have more products in the R&D pipeline.

But in general: There is a market and demand for such "experimental" films. The kickstarter campaign was a success. It may not be your or my cup of tea, but some others like this look. As a tolerant person I have nothing against that . If other photographers are happy with the results, very good for them.
And this demand and resulting revenue helps this OEM manufacturer to increase their R&D efforts for more products and extending their product portfolio.

Best regards,
Henning

B&Wpositive · Dec 7, 2019

Henning Serger said:
If you quote my posting, why don't you read it ?
I've written: "This film is just one part of a silver-halide product portfolio of many different products."
Most of their silver-halide products are "proper" products as you say / describe it. Often highest quality products.
And they even have more products in the R&D pipeline.

But in general: There is a market and demand for such "experimental" films. The kickstarter campaign was a success. It may not be your or my cup of tea, but some others like this look.

I know you know who it is, Henning, but for everyone else: It's not that hard to figure out which company it could be, if you keep up with all the discussions here and on websites like Kosmo. There are only a few contenders. It may be someone who currently only makes mainstream ("proper") black and white film, but is hoping to make good quality color film (again?) in the future...they need to start somewhere with color film testing. And it makes sense that Lomography would want to be involved in the sales of the experimental stuff...it's being treated like the craft beer industry, even down to the unique labeling for each experimental film type.

I haven't kept up with all the film company startups and restarts the past few years, but I'm sure if I went back through discussions here and really tried, I could figure out who it is...it's almost undoubtedly a company which has been discussed previously on this site. If not, it is one that will be discussed here in the future.

Arcadia4 · Dec 7, 2019

As stated up thread there are only 3 current manufacturers of silver halide colour film; Fuji, Kodak and Inoviscoat. Fuji and Kodak are the only source of 'standard' colour films but can be discounted for this given the scale of production they are designed around.

Inoviscoat in Germany are optimised around smaller scale production of mutlilayer product with an ex Agfa coater and staff with the neccessary colour know how (ex Agfa leverkusen). Although they have actively diversified into other markets they still undertake contract coating for silver hallide product. Given the small volumes for this and the 'Lomochrome' (CN) films this makes them the most likely origin of this product.
To quote from their website (which isn't very upto date so refers to earlier product) 'We also have developed something for enthusiasts and the ones who want their shots to be unique: tin-type and special colour-negative films, which turn the known world of colour photography upside down. Each shot will be a surprise!'

Whilst these are 'niche' colour films they are something different from the standard offer and are original coatings rather than 'effect' films made by post exposure of standard CN.

flavio81 · Dec 9, 2019

brbo said:
Now, imagine all those clever people with state of the art technology at their disposal and all they choose (are "forced") to produce is... Metropolis, Purple, Redscale...

If only there was a market for proper C-41, E-6 film, righ?!

... already well covered by Fuji (CN200, Industrial 100, etc.) and Kodak (Portra 160/400, Ektar 100, Ektachrome 100).

scheimfluger_77 · Dec 10, 2019

Just received my Metropolis film yesterday.

abruzzi · Dec 10, 2019

scheimfluger_77 said:
Just received my Metropolis film yesterday.

in 35mm or 110?

scheimfluger_77 · Dec 11, 2019

Should be 120 but I haven’t looked yet.

It’s the 120.

winger · Dec 11, 2019

scheimfluger_77 said:
Just received my Metropolis film yesterday.

I got mine, too. I can't wait to try it, but I don't know when I'll be able to (and which camera).

scheimfluger_77 · Dec 12, 2019

winger said:
I got mine, too. I can't wait to try it, but I don't know when I'll be able to (and which camera).

Ah, the curse of too many choices.

winger · Dec 12, 2019

scheimfluger_77 said:
Ah, the curse of too many choices.

I blame this site!

My main options are a Holga or my P645N. I'll probably start with the P645N. I have 5 rolls, so both will likely get used.

scheimfluger_77 · Dec 13, 2019

winger said:
I blame this site!

My main options are a Holga or my P645N. I'll probably start with the P645N. I have 5 rolls, so both will likely get used.

Well let’s see; I have a Holga, a Vermeer 6x17, an Agfa 6x6 pinhole conversion a friend made, and a Mamiya C330... so I really can’t decide.

winger · Dec 13, 2019

scheimfluger_77 said:
Well let’s see; I have a Holga, a Vermeer 6x17, an Agfa 6x6 pinhole conversion a friend made, and a Mamiya C330... so I really can’t decide.

Good luck with that choice! I hope you got several rolls! I have a few others as well, but the Holga and P645N are the main ones 90% of the time.

Henning Serger · Dec 19, 2019

Arcadia4 said:
As stated up thread there are only 3 current manufacturers of silver halide colour film; Fuji, Kodak and Inoviscoat.

Well, that is correct if we focus on colour film in terms of emulsion making and coating. But I think it is right and make sense to also include general colour film technology. Therefore we should include Polaroid Originals, too. Because lots of their R&D and chemistry colour technology is done in their factory in Enschede (Netherlands; I have visited this factory in 2015 and talked also to R&D staff). The emulsion making and coating of the negative film bases is done by their daughter company Inovisproject, which is under the same "roof" as InovisCoat (legally both are separate, independent companies, but using the same machinery).

Arcadia4 said:
Inoviscoat in Germany are optimised around smaller scale production of mutlilayer product with an ex Agfa coater and staff with the neccessary colour know how (ex Agfa leverkusen). Although they have actively diversified into other markets they still undertake contract coating for silver hallide product.

Meanwhile the production of silver-halide photo products like films and papers is their main business. They see the film revival as well and therefore have set the focus on that business field again. Also because there is their main knowledge and capability. Non silver halide photo products are a niche for them.

Best regards,
Henning

Arcadia4 · Dec 19, 2019

Henning Serger said:
Meanwhile the production of silver-halide photo products like films and papers is their main business. They see the film revival as well and therefore have set the focus on that business field again. Also because there is their main knowledge and capability. Non silver halide photo products are a niche for them.

That's good to hear!

On a related point do Inoviscoat also have conversion/packaging capability as well or is that all outsourced? In particular who in the market still has machinery for 110 film?

cmacd123 · Dec 19, 2019

Arcadia4 said:
In particular who in the market still has machinery for 110 film?

Besides the Chinese folks who paclk it for Lomograhy, no one who is set up. FILM Ferania says thet they have saved machinery for all formats, but they may be a while before they want to even look at 110. Adox claims to have some of the 110 plastic molds out of the old Ferrania Plant. I suspect everyone else may have junked the 110 machinery when downsizing.

Henning Serger · Dec 19, 2019

Arcadia4 said:
That's good to hear!

On a related point do Inoviscoat also have conversion/packaging capability as well or is that all outsourced?

That's all outsourced. They do R&D, emulsion production and coating. The Jumbo rolls are then converted by other companies.

Best regards,
Henning

Agulliver · Dec 20, 2019

Lomography offer a great range of 110 films, the only problem being that they're not always in stock. That's an issue with their 135 and 120 films too. I've only used the Tiger 200 but it's good stuff. I might give Metropolis a try for fun...though the only working 110 camera I have is a 70s ITT fixed lens job....my Minolta 110 SLR has been out of order with a shutter problem for about 30 years

AgX · Dec 20, 2019

Arcadia4 said:
Do Inoviscoat also have conversion/packaging capability as well or is that all outsourced?

They only offer:
-) toll emulsion making
-) toll coating

Their founders once left Agfa just to get off the traditional film business...
Thus do not expect "little-Agfa" there.

As they do not make consumer products there is nothing to be outsourced.

Henning Serger · Dec 20, 2019

AgX said:
Their founders once left Agfa just to get off the traditional film business...
Thus do not expect "little-Agfa" there.

That was history. They have changed their main strategy and focus, which is meanwhile on silver-halide photo products again (see my posting above). I have talked to them directly. It is also clearly obvious by their current product portfolio, which is mainly traditional silver-halide photo products.

AgX said:
As they do not make consumer products there is nothing to be outsourced.

Wrong again. Most of their products are consumer products, with exactly that target market and designed for that purpose. They are just not offered to the end consumer by themselves, but by the companies who buy the material from IC and offer it under their own brand name to the end consumer (and have additional partners for converting).

Best regards,
Henning

New Metropolis film on kickstarter from Lomo!

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