New Metropolis film on kickstarter from Lomo!

Photo Engineer · Jul 31, 2019

Don't forget that Kodak sold or leased a number of older formulas to China for film production. Could it be that they are the source?

PE

Agulliver · Jul 31, 2019

Photo Engineer said:
Don't forget that Kodak sold or leased a number of older formulas to China for film production. Could it be that they are the source?

PE

Entirely feasible. Some of the Lomography 100 CN 120 films that I have are "made in China".

Additionally hasn't Kodak pretty much stated that it's current "Color Plus" product is in fact Kodacolor 200 VR as sold in the late 90s? It certainly performs as such.

From the grain structure and colour palette, there is absolutely no way that the Lomography branded films are Kodak Gold or closely related.

Lachlan Young · Jul 31, 2019

Agulliver said:
Entirely feasible. Some of the Lomography 100 CN 120 films that I have are "made in China".

Additionally hasn't Kodak pretty much stated that it's current "Color Plus" product is in fact Kodacolor 200 VR as sold in the late 90s? It certainly performs as such.

From the grain structure and colour palette, there is absolutely no way that the Lomography branded films are Kodak Gold or closely related.

Found out about the more recent 'VR' materials - specifically a quote from a Kodak representative in Germany who described the VR films as a Kodak Gold/ Farbwelt variant with the following characteristics: "... the VR films are balanced more moderately in regard to contrast and saturation. This has been done with regard to the universal fields of application."

Agulliver · Aug 1, 2019

Lachlan Young said:
Found out about the more recent 'VR' materials - specifically a quote from a Kodak representative in Germany who described the VR films as a Kodak Gold/ Farbwelt variant with the following characteristics: "... the VR films are balanced more moderately in regard to contrast and saturation. This has been done with regard to the universal fields of application."

That is certainly a good description of how Color Plus, and the Lomography 100 and 400 CN films work compared to Gold 200 and the discontinued Gold products of yore.

George Mann · Aug 1, 2019

Huss said:
Why couldnt they bring back Kodachrome 10? That was photography!

ASA 10 may be a hard sell these days, but ASA 25 and 64 would sell like hotcakes!

AgX · Aug 27, 2019

Photo Engineer said:
Don't forget that Kodak sold or leased a number of older formulas to China for film production. Could it be that they are the source?

Lucky Film cancelled production of their colour films some years ago. What of course does not exclude toll-production.

For the film in question basically two origins are likely
-) being a erroneous malproduction, marketed now by Lomography
-) purposely applying production deficiencies, as PE indicated

With any tollproduction one must have economics in mind. If production of film with deficiencies is as as costly as a regular prpduction, is it worth for Lomography to produce it for those who want something off? Only Lomography know.

Grim Tuesday · Aug 27, 2019

AgX said:
Lucky Film cancelled production of their colour films some years ago. What of course does not exclude toll-production.

For the film in question basically two origins are likely
-) being a erroneous malproduction, marketed now by Lomography
-) purposely applying production deficiencies, as PE indicated

With any tollproduction one must have economics in mind. If production of film with deficiencies is as as costly as a regular prpduction, is it worth for Lomography to produce it for those who want something off? Only Lomography know.

If even it was erroneous malproduction, who would have produced it? I wonder if the backing paper will tell us anything about it.

cmacd123 · Aug 27, 2019

Grim Tuesday said:
If even it was erroneous malproduction, who would have produced it? I wonder if the backing paper will tell us anything about it.

the few rolls of various Lomography film I have seen have had "custom" looking - apparently Chinese made - Backing paper, with the Lomography brand and slogans.

Agulliver · Aug 28, 2019

All the Lomo 120 film I've used has had identical backing paper to that described above....definitely custom printed at least for Lomography. It seems to work and the numbers are much more easy to read in the red window than those of Ilford and Kodak. Better even than Foma, who come second.

Henning Serger · Oct 17, 2019

AgX said:
As I tried to indicate in post #2 all speaks against a new film.

That is completely wrong.
It is a new film!
I've visited the factory and talked to the engineers who have designed it.

That is all I am allowed to say. No further details from me because of an NDA.

Best regards,
Henning

AgX · Oct 17, 2019

Henning Serger said:
That is completely wrong.
It is a new film!

For the 2nd time at the same day you are quoting me followed by inappropriate comment.

You quoted me saying "As I tried to indicate in post #2 all speaks against a new film."
There is nothing wrong at all with that statement.

Whether my assumptions turn out wrong or not, is something different.

I assume other fellows are getting tired of such bickering...

Henning Serger · Oct 17, 2019

AgX said:
I assume other fellows are getting tired of such bickering...

They are getting tired of your misinformations.

Best regards,
Henning

AgX · Oct 17, 2019

Still you are calling assumptions of mine misinformation.

Strange enough you do not do so towards PE who uttered similar assumption.

Henning Serger · Oct 17, 2019

AgX said:
Still you are calling assumptions of mine misinformation.

Strange enough you do not do so towards PE who uttered similar assumption.

Again wrong.
PE has described a possible technoligical way to produce colour films with such a kind of color. That is completely different.

Regards,
Henning

GarageBoy · Oct 24, 2019

I really hate this "handmade/analog" = imperfections implication/mantra

Same thing with contemporary ceramics - It's supposed to be wobbly - it shows that it's handmade - no, it just means you suck

AgX · Oct 24, 2019

I even think that some young folks consider imperfections as native part of film photography. Those few enlargements by students I have come across lately are typically so covered with shadows of dust-fibers that I felt urged to tell them that such is no necessity. But then I always refrained, as I should be really happy that they have entered the darkroom at all.

flavio81 · Nov 25, 2019

Agulliver said:
Additionally hasn't Kodak pretty much stated that it's current "Color Plus" product is in fact Kodacolor 200 VR as sold in the late 90s? It certainly performs as such.

Thanks for this info. I wanted to know specifically which film was Color Plus based on.

On the other hand, Kodacolor VR was a consistent film (like all Kodak products used to be). As far as i've read on some forums, Color Plus seems to be an inconsistent emulsion: some people report wrong colors /strange shifts AFAIK.

I think I only tried ColorPlus once, can't remember the results. Perhaps i should try again.

Note that Lomo 100 CN (and 800 CN) was Ferrania film too, at some stage.

Anon Ymous · Nov 26, 2019

@flavio81 ColorPlus 200 is a consistent product, just like everything else from Kodak. It may not be anyone's cup of tea, but it has its characteristics. I wouldn't trust a random dude on the internet saying so. Besides, there are those who reuse C41 chemicals heavily and/or process at lower temperature, so colour shifts and crossovers are unavoidable.

pentaxuser · Nov 26, 2019

Henning Serger said:
That is completely wrong.
It is a new film!
I've visited the factory and talked to the engineers who have designed it.

That is all I am allowed to say. No further details from me because of an NDA.

Best regards,
Henning

Well more than a month has passed since you corrected all the speculation. So it is a new film and you have been to the factory and spoken to the engineers.

Can you now at least tell us where the factory is in terms of a continent i.e. Europe, US or America and is it a new factory or an existing one. Can we also assume that these engineers are highly experienced photo engineers? If you can add nothing to what you already said above can you indicate the likely schedule of production and what stage the whole project is at.

I might be wrong but my impression is that AgX was not the only one to express doubts about it being a new film. That previous sentence I freely confess to be a classic example of British understatement. It is this strange whimsical sense of humour that we possess.

As you can see from the posts since yours and despite your very clear statement that it is a new film etc, a deal of speculation is still raging. It perhaps indicates that either respondents missed your very clear statement or still retain scepticism which I am sure you regard as unfortunate both for Lomo and dare I say it your own standing as a source of information.

These NDAs certainly get in the way of telling us much. A great pity

pentaxuser

abruzzi · Nov 26, 2019

The latest update on Kickstarter suggests that the 110 film should be heading out to customers now, with the 35mm in the new term few weeks, and the 120 by mid December.

Henning Serger · Dec 1, 2019

pentaxuser said:
Can we also assume that these engineers are highly experienced photo engineers?

Yes, of course they are. With lots of years of experience in making colour films. You need that experience to make such a film. It would be impossible for a young start-up to produce colour film (or any film at all, but colour film is of course much much more difficult to produce than BW film).
The factory is also very modern and equipped with state-of-the-art technology. This film is just one part of a silver-halide product portfolio of many different products.

pentaxuser said:
If you can add nothing to what you already said above can you indicate the likely schedule of production and what stage the whole project is at.

???????
All you want to know is already online:
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/lomography/lomochrome-metropolis-film/posts/2683675
https://shop.lomography.com/de/films

Looking at the suppliers info channels is of course the first step one should do if further information is wanted. I cannot understand the laziness of some people expecting others to do all the work for them......

pentaxuser said:
These NDAs certainly get in the way of telling us much. A great pity

No, they are not a great pity. Not at all. They are absolutely essential for cooperations in the industry. Without them we would have much less products. Therefore we are all benefitting from them.

Best regards,
Henning

CMoore · Dec 1, 2019

Why would they start with 110..... is there a big demand for that.?

CMoore · Dec 1, 2019

Helios 1984 said:
+1
I thought someone was doing a remake of Metropolis (1927) or a live action of the 2001 anime.

pentaxuser · Dec 1, 2019

Henning Serger said:
Yes, of course they are. With lots of years of experience in making colour films. You need that experience to make such a film. It would be impossible for a young start-up to produce colour film (or any film at all, but colour film is of course much much more difficult to produce than BW film).
The factory is also very modern and equipped with state-of-the-art technology. This film is just one part of a silver-halide product portfolio of many different products.

Best regards,
Henning

Thanks so I take it that these experienced engineers and modern factory belong to a company other than Lomography. It is one from a group of factories that already exist for the production of film. The factory is not owned or financed by Lomography but Lomography has paid and commissioned the production of such a film to its own specifications?

pentaxuser

Henning Serger · Dec 1, 2019

pentaxuser said:
Thanks so I take it that these experienced engineers and modern factory belong to a company other than Lomography. It is one from a group of factories that already exist for the production of film. The factory is not owned or financed by Lomography but Lomography has paid and commissioned the production of such a film to its own specifications?
pentaxuser

Correct.
With one addition: Lomography has no own photo engineers which could create "own specifications" in a detailed way (from a technology perspective). They can suggest some ideas for a certain look of a film and discuss that with the OEM film manufacturer. And the OEM film manufacturer will reply what is possible. And also it can be the other way round: The film manufacturer has an idea and tell the potential customer what is possible and whether they are interested in such a product.

Best regards,
Henning

New Metropolis film on kickstarter from Lomo!

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