New film (to me) to play with

shadesofgrey · Aug 5, 2005

Evening all. Been given a couple of 35mm rolls of Fomapan 400 to play with. Been told I'm in for a treat? Anyone out there tried it? If so; pray, do tell all. And for developer I should use...........

Thanks one and all

B.

Don Mills · Aug 5, 2005

I purchased some 120 from Freestyle a few weeks ago. Intend to use pyrocat [my favorite developer]. Would be nice to have developing times for not only the 400, but also for the 100 and 200 asa films.

jon · Aug 5, 2005

I got fairly decent results shooting it at 200 and going for 10 minutes in Microdol.

Supposedly Fortepan 400 has an extra iso 50 layer to help preserve details in the highlights, but I haven't shot enough of the stuff to really see if that helps much.

There are some development starting points at Eight Elm, the local Fortepan supplier here in Toronto.

Dave Miller · Aug 5, 2005

shadesofgrey said:
Evening all. Been given a couple of 35mm rolls of Fomapan 400 to play with. Been told I'm in for a treat? Anyone out there tried it? If so; pray, do tell all. And for developer I should use...........

Thanks one and all

B.

Rodinal if you want to feature the grain. Prescysol EF if you don't.

srs5694 · Aug 5, 2005

I've been shooting Fomapan 400 in 35mm and developing it in Gainer's PC-Glycol split-stock developer for 10:00 at 20C. This works well for me. I've also developed a couple of rolls in D-76 with good results, but I don't recall the times offhand (I probably got them off of the Massive Dev Chart and/or the film's box). Something about Fomapan's grain structure appeals to me, but I can't really describe it; it's a very subjective "feel" thing, and as such you might or might not feel the same way about it.

shadesofgrey · Aug 5, 2005

Something about Fomapan's grain structure appeals to me, but I can't really describe it; it's a very subjective "feel" thing.

Understand that: I feel the same way about my Volvo! Thanks for the input guys; some good food for thought. Question! Fomapan is akin to, reminds you of....Pan F.......FP4.....Tri X of old..... or??? Just trying to visualize something I've never seen.

All the best

B.

jon · Aug 5, 2005

OK, I'm a dumbass, I didn't realize you wrote Fomapan and not Fortepan. Must be this stomach flu I've got makin' my vision go all blurry. Sorry!

Mike-D · Aug 5, 2005

I've used quite a bit of Fomapan 400. Its decent film but grainier than films like Tri-X. If you are ok with that it makes nice pictures.

Usual soup here is D-76 straight for this film. Less grainy than 1:1. Expose generously and develop gently. Its a little gritty if you underexpose.

Mike D

hortense · Aug 5, 2005

I've found it to be a good every-day film. I dunk it in HC110 dil. H (1:62) for 13-minutes @ 68°. At first didn't understand how to handle the curl. Now I use a weighted bottom clip (lead).

srs5694 · Aug 6, 2005

Mike-D said:
I've used quite a bit of Fomapan 400. Its decent film but grainier than films like Tri-X.

My subjective impression is that Fomapan 400 is slightly less grainy (in terms of grain size) than Tri-X, but the Fomapan grain tends to be more distinct (as in sharply-defined grains). I don't have any quantitative measures on this, though; it's just from me "eyballing" prints and scans.

shadesofgrey · Aug 6, 2005

srs5694 said:
My subjective impression is that Fomapan 400 is slightly less grainy (in terms of grain size) than Tri-X, but the Fomapan grain tends to be more distinct (as in sharply-defined grains). I don't have any quantitative measures on this, though; it's just from me "eyballing" prints and scans.

Interesting point, about the grain size I mean. I used Orwo years ago, some said it was I****D under a different badge yet the grain looked wrong, sort of lumpy? Then again, maybe my developing skills were real crap back then compared to being just crap today! Still; forty years of pure enjoyment cant be bad.
No problemo Jon, I make the same mistake with whisky and tea; cant remember now which one makes my eyes go blurrythink its the tea!
Hi Mike. What dev time/agitation do you give it in D76. Is it as sharp a Tri x? The guy who gave me the film said it was Creamy sharp Great for portraits. Hope so, took a portrait of the wife.need all the help I can get!
Hi Mac; yeah Im looking to try HC110 with Neopan 400, normally use ID 11 or Rodinal but that seems to be getting a little thin on the ground of late, I wonder why? I dont think we get the real (HC110) thing over here, think its a watered down version (Pepsi anyone) which is a real pity, guess Ill have to order some from across the pond before Kodak pulls the plug!. Is the curl that intrusive?

Thanks guys; for the info and your time.

B.

srs5694 · Aug 6, 2005

shadesofgrey said:
Is the curl that intrusive?

I've not noticed particularly objectionable curl from Fomapan 400 in 35mm. I normally dry it by taking it off the spool, hanging it from a hangar with a clip on it, and putting a clip (similar to a clothespin, but it came with a kit of developing hardware) on the bottom of the long strip as a weight. I then let it dry for at least two hours. Perhaps the curl would be worse with some other drying regimen, or in another format.

Mike-D · Aug 6, 2005

shadesofgrey said:
Hi Mike. What dev time/agitation do you give it in D76. Is it as sharp a Tri x? The guy who gave me the film said it was Creamy sharp Great for portraits. Hope so, took a portrait of the wife.need all the help I can get!

It seems that I was using 5.5 minutes at 75f in straight D-76. Probably 8 minutes at 68f, 20c. My usual agitation is ten seconds/minute, but for short development times I agitate every thirty seconds. I tried a few other developers but they were mostly M/Q variants that I mixed up myself and none were much improvement over D-76.

srs5694 said:
My subjective impression is that Fomapan 400 is slightly less grainy (in terms of grain size) than Tri-X, but the Fomapan grain tends to be more distinct (as in sharply-defined grains). I don't have any quantitative measures on this, though; it's just from me "eyballing" prints and scans.

I can't quite disagree with this. I never did get the Foma to be as smooth as the Tri-X.

Mike D

eagleowl · Aug 7, 2005

I like Foma 400.
When I first got my c33,I bought a pack of tri-x and a few rolls Foma,to see which I preferred.
There was just something about the tri-x which didn't appeal to me-but then,I simply don't like ANY Kodak film.
I develop the Foma in Fomadon(basically Calbe under a different name)R09,and the grain looks fine to me.

gchpaco · Aug 7, 2005

The 400 layer is not totally opaque, so if it has that extra layer it will show up. Which is not to say that said highlights will necessarily be easily accessible, and they will be dense.

gchpaco · Aug 8, 2005

outofoptions said:
I don't buy it. The 400 layer would block up well before you would get anything useful out of some 'lower' layer, especially if it was at speed 50. If it was there, I think the manufacturer would probably advertise it as a double layer film. Sounds like an 'urban legend layer' to me. ;-)

Disclaimer: I do not have any idea whether Foma 400 has this extra layer. However, I maintain that it would still be useful if it existed. The idea being that if the 400 layer blocks up, then it represents a constant density that the 50 layer adds to. Even "bulletproof" negatives are still transparent, after all.

Mathematically: if the 400 layer blocks up at, say, a density of 0.6, the 50 layer is only three stops slower than that and is already into the midrange of its curve; additional exposure will push the 50 layer up its curve but not alter the 400 layer's density at all. Conversely if there isn't enough light to expose the 50 layer but is for the 400 layer, the 400 layer will be a little thin but retain shadow detail.

Of course there are unsharpness problems involved in doing this with actual physical layers and there are a bunch of technical tricks to get around them but as I understand it the pictorial value is similar to what it would be if they were distinct layers.

This is not a new technique. Ilford, for one, has been known to use layers differing by two stops in its Delta films.

Paul Howell · Aug 8, 2005

I don't have any information about an extra layer for the highlights, but I shot at a Rodeo with Forma 400, TriX, and Tmax 3200 rated at 1600 and developed in HC110. It was midday and very bright, the cowboy hats cause deep shadows, Forma 400 developed in Microdol X stock gave the best tonal range with good hat shadow detail, while the Tri X gave the best grain, the Tmax had good grain and sharpness but poor details in the hat shadow. I am experimenting with Edwal 12 and Defender 777 and I plan to shoot a few rolls of Forma 400 in the fall.

shadesofgrey · Aug 9, 2005

Supposedly Fortepan 400 has an extra iso 50 layer to help preserve details in the highlights, but I haven't shot enough of the stuff to really see if that helps much.

Fortepan again? Must be good? Must try some! Okay gurus, thinking caps on! Jessops Econodev Universal 2 is, I think........Ilford _________? Please fill in the blanks. Dilution on bottle reads is 1-24 or 1-49. Shelf life not stated? Anyone played/playing with it? Thought I'd give it a try as they didn't have any Rodinal in stock? Think they're running down the Dev/print side of things: been to 2 stores today and both had very little in the way of chemicals. Their "Own brand" filters look okay for the price: yellow 52mm £11.99 (made in Japan) 1/2 the cost of a Hoya MC. Any of you glass experts know/suspect who the manufacture is. Oh; before I go. Ran out of distilled water last night (wife decided to do some ironing; TV must have broken down!) gave the sainsbury's Caledonian mineral water a glance; decided to wait til this morning and buy some more distilled. Nearly tried it though: only a test roll so nothing important. Can't be any worse that tap water, can it?
Take care guys.

B.

gchpaco · Aug 10, 2005

Oh, make no mistake, these layers look plenty weird on their own. It's not like the film suddenly shifts over from being ISO 400 to being ISO 50; even before the 400 hits its shoulder the 50 is being exposed, and if you make the 400 layer so it shoulders off gradually it's not like hitting a brick wall. You have to tweak the curves of the two layers so you get a straight line, of course.

New film (to me) to play with

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