New Daylight-Developing-Tank announced

Slixtiesix said:

I must admit I found the video funny as well. This guy at the end who is taking the dev tank in his backpack anywhere he goes together with all the chemicals... How far from reality is this? :-D
Seriously, as someone who can put a roll of 120 film on a JOBO reel in less than 2 minutes I´m not really interested in this thing either, but I think it could be great for people without a permanent darkroom. Students, people living in a single room flat etc. come to my mind. It can be frustrating to get a room completely light tight and even more so if you have to do it every time you want to develop film.

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TSA: Sir could you step out of line and tell me what all these chemicals are in your bag?

holggger said:

This seems to be directly directed and marketed at people who have never developed film before and have no idea of how easy it is even without a box like this.
If you don't mind spending that much money and if it works well, then there's nothing I have to say against it. Wouldn't get one myself, though.

Also, I had to cringe a little when seeing how the video is basically telling people to develop their film on a table at their favorite cafe and then take the still wet thing out and have a look with all your friends at what's on the film... What happened with washing that thing properly and drying it dust-free?

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I think that there is a whole new generation of E.g Lomo users who are not interested in your level of perfection. They'll buy all of the expired film that you probably look down on and will feel the excitement and anticipation that wore off for those who know what real photography is about. They may be crazy enough to enjoy imperfection, only God knows why anyone would marvel at imperfection, and they may even be silly enough to enjoy it with their friends!

Can you imagine how cringeworthy that would really be?

I wonder how enthusiastic Robert Cappa would have been about this, given that he had to develop his negatives in his helmet.

As far as I'm concerned, I'm enthused by anything that keeps photography alive and besides, I take my hat off to anyone who can take an idea to fruition like this. I cringe at those who find this kind of success, that can only come about through dedication and commitment cringeworthy.

Ghostman said:

I think that there is a whole new generation of E.g Lomo users who are not interested in your level of perfection. They'll buy all of the expired film that you probably look down on and will feel the excitement and anticipation that wore off for those who know what real photography is about. They may be crazy enough to enjoy imperfection, only God knows why anyone would marvel at imperfection, and they may even be silly enough to enjoy it with their friends!
(and so on...)

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hah, judge me much?

1) I’m not cringing at imperfectionism, nor at young people (like myself) playing around with film. I am cringing at the thought of someone taking out a freshly washed, wet negative out of that tank in a cafe, showing it around… and then what? Put the wet and dusty strip back in your backpack? That has nothing to do with imperfection. Did you ever see what happens when wet film sticks together?

2) Capa comment: completely missing the point.

3) As I wrote, if this tank works, that’s fantastic. I’d love to see it in action and play around with it. My point is I wouldn’t spend extra money for it when there are cheaper ways to develop your film.
This is not so much criticism, because I do believe the people who developed this tank are good people with good intentions, but it does sound a little like a great marketing idea to take money from the young for something 90% of them could do cheapter with a regular tank, with the same result.
In a way it is the same old gear story: Fancier gear that does practically the same job like a much more affordable alternative. Again, not saying it is bad per se, but personally I would not spend more money for this. Many people are made to think that they NEED this fancier thing. Well, no, you don’t.

holggger said:

Did you ever see what happens when wet film sticks together?

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Yeah, it picks up more "Flavour" and "patina" or something... Right? ... Right?


I think they're stepping out of reality a little with their promotional material, but I can kind of see how the style they're going with could still be useful in a more realistic world. I'm curious as to how safe and reliable the 120 loading is.

I currently am using a changing bag, as I have no space at home that is large enough to set things out to work with in the dark while also being easy to make light tight, and it can get annoyingly hot and difficult to use reliably for part of the year. - Hot humid days in general are annoying to work in, but sticking your hands in a sack of synthetic cloth and trying to carefully deal with fiddly things? That's just begging to get that 'just enough' bit of sweat on your hands to encourage film jams in my experience.

I can also see there being slightly fewer/easier to manage dust issues with such a daylight load setup as compared to a darkbag. - Check that the chambers are clean and free of dust, check that your film packaging doesn't have anything on it, load, seal, and go. No rubbing fibres or anything to get in there. No dry skin or hair from your hands/forearms able to work their way in, because your hands are firmly outside the device. Lesser feedback and direct feel to tell what is actually going on however is not all that nice of a thing in my mind.

That said, I still like being able to double-load a pair of 120 films onto a single reel for processing. Being able to get four rolls into a compact two reel tank is handy I've found, so I don't know if I'm all that likely to pick one of these up. Plus the price doesn't make it all that attractive as compared to adding more paterson tanks or similar to the collection. Might be nice if I'm just doing one roll that afternoon, but I tend to save the film for a bit and do it in batches. Much prefer to load up a few tanks loaded and ready to process all in one session rather than doing a bunch of sessions for one roll at a time. - One roll or four rolls is the same processing time after all, with only a bit of extra time up front for loading the reels up.

It's not likely I will buy this product as I am happy with my current system, but there is definitely a target group for this product, and if it is well-constructed product, it will likely sell well.
I developed a roll of film in junior high school, and it was another 35 years before I developed my second roll, so I essentially had to start from scratch and learned most of my techniques from YouTube. I had to decide between metal and plastic reels, which developer to use, which stop, which fixer, etc. Fortunately, I didn't visit APUG at that time or I would have become so confused that I might have given up in frustration .

With this product, a new user can buy the device and the monobath that they sell and develop a roll of film in daylight, no darkroom or changing bag required, and get "usable" results. Hopefully, these new users will migrate to more traditional methods and buy lots of film and chemicals and help keep film alive. The Achilles' heel of the device, however, is that to load 35mm film, the user has to be careful rewinding the film or use a film extractor, both of which complicate it's use.

OptiKen said:

Wow. too late already.
I was going to go for the unit and (2) modules @ 89 Euro but they are already sold out.

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They haven't sold out of what you want... you just have to pay a bit more now the early bird ones are gone.

One unit and two modules are available at 109 euros instead of 89.

Terry S

Luckless said:

I currently am using a changing bag, as I have no space at home that is large enough to set things out to work with in the dark while also being easy to make light tight, and it can get annoyingly hot and difficult to use reliably for part of the year. - Hot humid days in general are annoying to work in, but sticking your hands in a sack of synthetic cloth and trying to carefully deal with fiddly things? That's just begging to get that 'just enough' bit of sweat on your hands to encourage film jams in my experience.

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Good point. Thinking about it, it may be more of an issue to find a completely dark space than I assumed. I'm "lucky" enough to have a bathroom without windows (because who likes light in their bathroom? ). Never tried to do it at night in another room – guess it depends on where you live and whether you have shutters/curtains. Definitely wouldn't want to wind medium format film onto a reel in a changing bag, that's for sure!

The way they promote their product it's really the monobath that makes developing film easier. Maybe even more so than the tank itself.

Medium format reels in a changing bag is one of those things that works perfectly when everything goes fine, but it is rather easy for things to stop going fine in a hurry. Folding up a bag to sit on the top shelf in the cabinet is however a lot easier to deal with in my current space than trying to get a table or something that I could move in and out of the bathroom. (Any other room with a suitable working space in it already is just annoying for me to make light tight, as others would likely be walking in/out at random, or it just contains too many random bits of equipment with indicator lights. And I like those indicator lights any time I'm not working with film, which is most times, because they indicate things that are useful for me to know about.)

I'm waiting for the Kickstarter in support of a collapsible film tent that pops up to create a 60cm x 60cm x 60cm tent with light-tight arm holes and ventilation, but folds down to the size of a binder between uses.
To me, the best use for this newest idea would be for those of us who would like to be able to develop film while we are travelling.

tezzasmall said:

They haven't sold out of what you want... you just have to pay a bit more now the early bird ones are gone.

One unit and two modules are available at 109 euros instead of 89.

Terry S

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Thanks Terry. I saw that but had trouble justifying the $145.00 USD cost (pledge and shipping to USA) for this item for the type of photography that I do.

They really need to fit on a winding handle like those on Watson type film loaders, twisting the rotary knob through the whole process must be a pain not only in the head but in the fingers as well..

Really impressed!
Two Rondinax in one for the price of six+ (as you may be lucky).
The real rookie, though, would rather use a RONDIX, the film tumbler 2nd to none. And the Rondix comes with a real crank, so you may crank up at will.
Technical aside, social interaction had been mentioned: The dude pulls out his (?) film and the girl admires in awe - at least since Mme. Curie that's way beyond, no, not monochome, but pre-yesteryear. Or is she perplexed that the dude didn't wash the film and use photoflo?
But then, she didn't get the real innovation: The one-step chemo-light wash-free develo-fixer... finally served as cappuccino for recycling (the add, too, forgot to mention this).
Impressive never-before, the mini-darkroom: The red cap should provide the perfect red light inside the box!
But I mustn't hide my genuine respect for the business idea. In deed: The business flies!
Really hope at least some users will be as happy as the sellers.
Cheers P.

Wallendo said:

At the bottom of the kickstarter page they mention that they are working on "Automated Knob Rotation" and "Temperature Control". If they can accomplish that then this could secure a niche as the poor man's Jobo.

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It looks like the tank with two modules would be less expensive than a new Jobo multitank + duoset reel, but not by a lot.

PittP said:

Impressive never-before, the mini-darkroom: The red cap should provide the perfect red light inside the box!

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Hahahahaha!!! This one sentence encapsulates the "hipster" mentality.

There was a small kit available recently where you developed the film in it's original canister, you dunked the whole thing straight out of the camera and twisted it round with a paterson like stick in the developer/wash/fixer.I think they did not recommend using 36 exposures.

I often wonderd if it worked.

I am delighted to see this and think it's a great idea. Love the modular design.

I hope it succeeds and gets more people developing their own films.

Some may say it's expensive but if it lights the spark to film photography as a hobby, then no. (hobbies are expensive, try golf or backing horses) Yes there are other less expensive ways to develop a film but this is a neat package, well presented. (think Lomography but good thoughts only

I did a quick google on dev kits and a dark bag and AG Photo in UK have one for £90 / €106 / $113 approx so not a big difference.

I like the idea of showing the use of a monobath, it keeps things simple. If the hobby bug bites then the world of film developers is your oyster.

Great to see thought, effort and practicality being put back into film processing.

MattKing said:

I'm waiting for the Kickstarter in support of a collapsible film tent that pops up to create a 60cm x 60cm x 60cm tent with light-tight arm holes and ventilation, but folds down to the size of a binder between uses.
To me, the best use for this newest idea would be for those of us who would like to be able to develop film while we are travelling.

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Matt,

these have already existed and I bought one cheaply some time back. Only the briefest of looks but here's a second hand one advertised:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Calumet-Fil...4-034-Double-Layered-/232235258492?rmvSB=true

Or maybe something like this which comes in various shapes and sizes with different purposes, but presuming it's light tight, it could do the job?

https://www.amazon.com/LimoStudio-P...941655&sr=8-4&keywords=portable+changing+tent

Terry S

Rondinax

https://rondinax.wordpress.com/category/rondinax-60/

locutus said:

This honestly seems like a lot of hassle for not having to use a darkbag....

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Yes, that is the basic question:
Does one need a daylight-loading tank?

And:
Does one accept the disadvantages to such tank compared with standard inverting/rotating tanks?


We discussed this at another thread in the past and such modular daylight-loading device maybe attractive to some beginners.

Just yesterday a Rondinax 60 went on German Ebay for no less than 186 Euro (=195 USD). From what I´ve heard so far, these prices seem just to be the norm now. I wonder whether these are collectors prices or people are really willing to pay almost 200 bucks for the convenience of not having to blind the windows... If the latter is true, it indicates that there may indeed be some kind of demand for these things.

There is an article today, in good evidence, on the electronic newspaper Repubblica.it, possibly the most important site for news in Italy.

http://www.repubblica.it/tecnologia...ani-160009449/?ref=RHPPRT-BS-I0-C4-P1-S1.4-T1

It says the sales, which were expected to reach 70.000 Euros, actually are above 500.000 Euros so far.

They point out especially the "novelty" of analogue photography: people come to analogue photography who never experienced it in the past, as they grew up in the digital photography environment.

That means IMO that the potential for growth is, well, huge