negs seem a bit pink

GeorgK · Aug 14, 2011

AFAIK, the thread-opener never stated that he had pre-warmed the developing tank. Using a cold tank would explain severe underdevelopment.
Anyways, pictures from single negative strips or scans on auto-mode do not tell much. A picture with both the commercially developed and the home-made Ektar negative in it side-by-side would make any evaluation easier.

Georg

jbl · Aug 14, 2011

I did pre-warm the developing tank by filling it with 100ºF water, inverting for 15 seconds and then submerging in my tempered water bath (also at 100ºF).

I've been going over in my head everything I could have done wrong:

- This was the second roll I ran through the Rollei C-41 developer since I mixed it a week ago. I had mixed 250ml for a single-roll, stainless steel tank. The Rollei instructions don't say to extend development beyond 3:15 for the second roll. Do people typically do it anyway?

- I used tap water for the chemicals. That's never been a problem with B&W, but I understand it's different. I did this more because I couldn't figure out a way to get distilled water to 49ºC to mix the developer as the instructions say. I wasn't sure if it was okay to just boil it in a pot on the stove and wait for it to cool to 49C. Do people typically mix at 49C?

- Maybe I didn't mix the developer well enough?

- Agitation technique: I inverted the tank back and forth for 15 seconds, put it in the water bath, 30 seconds later I inverted the tank and returned it to upright, then put it back in the water bath. I did this ever 30 seconds until development time ended.

I think you guys are right that I am seeing severe underdevelopment, I'm just not sure what I did wrong.

-jbl

Photo Engineer · Aug 14, 2011

If you develop 2 rolls together, use 3:15, but if you do them sequentially, you must increase the time according to the scale given by the kit manufacturer or by Kodak in their web page of C-41 tank instructions.

The reason is partly due to having 2 prewets dilute the developer, and another reason is that the first roll seasons the developer with antifoggants that retard the development of the second roll.

Compare the edge markings of your first and second roll.

PE

polyglot · Aug 14, 2011

jbl said:
I did pre-warm the developing tank by filling it with 100ºF water, inverting for 15 seconds and then submerging in my tempered water bath (also at 100ºF).

That's not nearly enough presoak. I think the usual advice is 5 minutes of presoak with process-temp water, obviously with the tank in the temp-controlled bath. I use two changes of presoak: 2+3 minutes and the first comes out notably cooler than the second.

If your reels and centre core are down at 20C or cooler, they are going to suck a huge amount of heat from your development process.

jbl · Aug 15, 2011

Photo Engineer said:
If you develop 2 rolls together, use 3:15, but if you do them sequentially, you must increase the time according to the scale given by the kit manufacturer or by Kodak in their web page of C-41 tank instructions.

Is this the 8 percent number I've read? Extending development to 3:30 with the second roll and to 3:45 with the third? That would indicate I was off by 15 seconds or so on the development. Is that enough to do it? I assume my agitation is okay?

Thanks again for all the help,

-jbl

jbl · Aug 15, 2011

polyglot said:
That's not nearly enough presoak. I think the usual advice is 5 minutes of presoak with process-temp water, obviously with the tank in the temp-controlled bath. I use two changes of presoak: 2+3 minutes and the first comes out notably cooler than the second.

I've been doing around 2 minutes, but without the water change you describe. That sounds worth trying.

Thanks!

-jbl

polyglot · Aug 15, 2011

jbl said:
I've been doing around 2 minutes, but without the water change you describe. That sounds worth trying.

Thanks!

-jbl

And with agitation! If you don't agitate, you just end up with cold water next to the reels, surrounded by hot water. It won't preheat if the water is sitting still. I assumed you were doing 15s but I now see that that's 15s of agitation and 1:45 of sitting there stagnant - you want about 5 minutes of agitation. Water change is probably less critical than the agitation - I've processed some rolls with a single 5:00 prewash and they seemed fine.

(I use a jobo; it will be more annoying with inversion)

Photo Engineer · Aug 15, 2011

You will need 2 or more changes of water in order to get the temperature of the tank and contents up to 100F.

As for the time extension, I've never heard of the 8% figure and I never figured out the exact intervals in percentages. I merely use the EK table if I need it. Too much math!

PE

yeknom02 · Aug 15, 2011

I'm also wondering if perhaps the edge markings on the submitted photo could also appear less dense due to some camera shake when the photo of the negative was taken (?) ...Just a thought.

jbl · Aug 15, 2011

These are all great suggestions, thanks for all the help. I'll try agitating more with the pre-soak.

PE, do you have a link for the Kodak document that documents the time extensions? I've seen it before, but I can't seem to find it anywhere.

Thanks!

-jbl

Ian C · Aug 15, 2011

In post #12 here I gave the Tetenal Kits time compensation increments to obtain full capacity.

See the table following Capacity of Solutions.

(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

I dont know if the time increments match the kit youre using. These might at least give you a starting point.

Photo Engineer · Aug 15, 2011

Here is generic information:

http://www.kodak.com/global/en/professional/support/techPubs/e4046/e4046.pdf

Here is information on rotary tube processing:

http://www.kodak.com/global/plugins/acrobat/en/service/Zmanuals/z131_03.pdf

In this latter case, they currently recommend that if you use a rotary tube, you discard the developer after use.

There are instructions for reusing, but I think this tells us enough right here.

PE

jbl · Aug 31, 2011

success!

I got it to work!

On another thread, it came up that one of the parts of the developer concentrates wasn't supposed to be purple (mine was) and there was a bad batch of chemicals from Rollei. I got a replacement set of chemicals and things are working now.

I did a test roll of Ektar at 3:15 and that came out great (the negatives looked a bit thick when they came out of the tank, but the scans looked great). I just did a roll of Portra 400 at 3:30 and that looks good too. I'll know for sure once it dries, but thanks again for all the help!

Jonathan

negs seem a bit pink

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