Need advice on bleach for selenium toning

[dj_judas21]

I recently bought some Agfa Viradon with the intention of toning my prints. After the first use, I realised I need some bleach. I've had a quick look around the usual places where other darkroom chemicals are readily available, but I haven't been able to find any bleach.

Can anyone recommend the name of a bleach which should work for toning with Viradon, and will play nicely with my usual assortment of Ilford chemistry?

 

[cowanw]

I don't think you use a bleach with this. It is a direct toner and will work more stongly with lesser dilutions and continue toning in the wash water. A lack of effect may be your choice of paper.

 

[dj_judas21]

Thanks Bill. I'm new at toning, so I'm still trying to figure out how to get good results. I read that direct toning (without bleach) hardly affects the tone of the print, and is done mainly to improve the shelf-life of the print. Indirect toning apparently changes the colour to red-yellow a lot more strongly. I'm after the traditional red-brown look.

The paper I'm using is Ilford Multigrade RC. Is this OK?

 

[CBG]

You can use it both ways. Use it by itself and it gradually tones. Bleach with a rehalogenating toner and you can get a near instantaneous transformation. Partially bleach and you can get a split tone very quickly. Versatile stuff. I love it.

 

[dj_judas21]

Thanks CBG - good to know. I'll persevere without bleach and see what I can achieve

 

[cowanw]

Just to make the point that Multigrade RC will be among the least resposive papers and that Viradon is not selenium.
Other than that go for it. Here is a good PDF.
http://www.kodak.com/global/en/professional/support/techPubs/g23/g23.pdf
The bleach in the sepia toner will work fine.

 

[dj_judas21]

Yes, I had heard (after purchasing) that Multigrade RC isn't the best for toning. I'll see if I can get my hands on some warmtone paper next time I buy.

Thanks for your link - that's useful.

 

[Barrie B.]

Brown Toning of prints :

[. I'm new at toning, so I'm still trying to figure out how to get good results. I read that direct toning (without bleach) hardly affects the tone of the print, and is done mainly to improve the shelf-life of the print. Indirect toning apparently changes the colour to red-yellow a lot more strongly. I'm after the traditional red-brown look.

The paper I'm using is Ilford Multigrade RC. Is this OK?[/QUOTE]
There are many things that effect print toning : -
The main ones are (i) paper type , (ii) Developer used.
(i)most WARM-TONE Papers will tone more easily and better than regular ( cold-tone papers ) ;
(ii) Warm-Tone developers prepare papers for easier toning ;
If you can give Ilford Mg IV -warm-tone papers a try , the Fibre base is better, and process using Harman ( Ilford ) Warm-tone developer . Toning with Viradon , or selenium will get you the red-browns you are looking for . Toning solution 'dilution strengths' and time will have to be obtained with trial and error. ( there are, however , many good brands of papers , developers and toners , all of which may give you the results you are looking for )
If you can get a hold of Tim Rudman`s 'Toning Book ' it is well worth the read.
Do a search on Apug , there have been many threads on toning.
.... Cheers Barrie B.

 

[brian steinberger]

Viradon is a beautiful toner and you can use it both direct and indirect. I recommend direct at 1:25 and using it on Ilfords warmtone paper produces wonderful results! 4-10 minutes. I never tried it on MGIV but I imagine its much cooler and more purplish-brown. I have found that paper developer does produce different results. I prefer LPD with MGWT when toning in Viradon. This produces the most brownish red image possible, Ansco 130, more purplish and not as strong. Indirect toning with MGWT just produces a rather ugly orange color that I don't care for.

 

[dj_judas21]

Yes, I tried it on MGIV and the toning is very subtle and purplish, as you predicted. It looks OK, but not what I was hoping for.

I'll buy some warmtone paper when I've used up this lot. Thanks for your advice, everyone

 

[Ronald Moravec]

Use non hardening fix if you intend to tone. Wash well or you get stains.

With selenium,, rinse 30 sec after fix, then tone, & fix. Or Fix, wash well , tone, and wash again. Two complete a thorough washes. There is no intermediate possibility.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Yes, I tried it on MGIV and the toning is very subtle and purplish, as you predicted. It looks OK, but not what I was hoping for.

I'll buy some warmtone paper when I've used up this lot. Thanks for your advice, everyone

One way to intensify the action of direct toning is to increase the time and/or raise the temperature to, let's say, 28C.