My new Hasselblad, and questions

Dear all:

After at least 10 years of daydreaming about it I finally bought a Hasselblad, a 501CM with WLF, Acute-Matte D, 80MM CFE, A-12 and A-24 backs. It was an impulse buy, in person off of the local craigslist for a favorable price. I have run a few rolls of transparency film through a renter a few weeks ago, and have a copy of Wildi's book (4th Ed.) that I bought back in the mid-1990's (and was able to find in the basement after all these years!!) so I have a basic understanding of how to operate the camera, but I do have a few questions for the group:

1. All the gear is in what I would describe as LN- (KEH grading) but the lens has a UV/SKY filter just plain stuck to it. I've done quick research and understand that it is a bayonet filter and the way to unstick it is to press in and turn counterclockwise, but this doesn't work. Since I have always left a UV/SKY filter in place on my other cameras' lenses (except perhaps when using a polarizer or warming filter) should I care about this? Can I put a lens shade over the filter, for example?

2. I'm used to "upside down and backwards" on my 4x5, but the mere "backwards" WLF may be more than I can get used to. When I rented I took a PM45 and I liked it. I already have a Pentax digital spot meter from my 4x5 kit, so if I am going to consider buying a prism finder for the Hasselblad is there any reason to look for a PME45 or PME90 rather than the unmetered version? What's the consensus (if any) on the prism finders anyway?

3. The Acute-Matte D that came with the camera does not have a split image or any other aids that I can ascertain - just 4 hash marks around the center. What's more likely to help me come to focus, a prism finder, a screen with a split image, both, or neither?

4. What accessories can be mounted on the rail? The Wildi book is not helping me here.

5. RRS, Kirk, or Acratech plate for my A-S ball head and RRS clamp?

6. Did I forget anything?

Thanks.

Josh

I have been shooting a 503cw for years and love it.

So here are my answers:
1. the filter should come off easily with just a little bit of effort. if not, contact KEH. And the hood will slide over the filter.
2. Since you have the pentax digital meter, like I do, I would not buy the PME. It would be a waste of money
3. I am using the 42217 screen with my camera. super bright and has the split image
4. the only real accessory would be the bubble level, which I find very useful
5. I use Kirk and RRS plates for my Kirk BH3 head
6. have fun and enjoy the camera. Hasselblads are awesome

David:

1. I'm on my own for the stuck filter because I did not buy from KEH but in a private party transaction. Should I try removing it with the lens on or off the body?

3. The 42217 is the gridded one with the split?

4. As an alternative to the bubble level that mounts on the rail, I could get a RRS bubble level and mount it to the cold shoe of a PM45 or PME45, right?

Thanks,

Josh

Hi Josh

I would try to remove the filter with the lens off the body. A bayonet filter on your 80 should not need pushing/pressing in any direction, just turning.

I don't know about the relative cost of the various alternatives, but the Acratech plates are a nice fit on the bottom of a Blad.

Give yourself a little bit of time with the waist level finder - you may find you really like it, particularly if you end up with a screen that is easier to focus with (eg split image),

Ian

iandavid said:

Give yourself a little bit of time with the waist level finder - you may find you really like it, particularly if you end up with a screen that is easier to focus with (eg split image),

Ian

Click to expand...

That is what I would recommend too - its really crazy at first, but when you get used to the WLF, its way better to use than a prism. I've got a prism too, but use it hardly ever - its great if you want to shoot fast moving "objects" like a bunch of little kids - but otherwise its much more fun with the WLF after getting used to it. Now you get one of the best cameras - give the WLF a chance to make you happy. Lots of fun - Frank

I never take my PM45 off the camera. Too easy to use.

I think (costs aside) that getting a metered prism is a good idea.
Especially when it is the PME45, which offers every metering mode imaginable.

Why carry a separate meter if you do not have to?


The accessory shoe takes the already mentioned sprit level, or a cold shoe (somewhere to put your Pocket Wizard, or what have you).
It is also used to attach the SCA390 TTL flash adapter to.

On the prism, I have a NC-2, PM45, and a Kiev NC-2 copy. I like the looks of the PM45 better, but to be honest, I can't tell the difference between any of them when looking through the finder.

I paid $13 for the like new kiev. I tried using the waist level for awhile, but now I never use a body without a prism.

I use a analog Pentax V spotmeter, if you have a spot and like it, why change?

Screen, personal choice. I use split image. I have a Acute-Matte D in both C's (late models with removable screens) and a Brightscreen brand with split and a micro prism ring around the split (never use the micro ring part though).

The Brightscreen is easier to focus, but not much better than the Acutematte D's. I couldn't focus the original screen worth squat. Eyes getting old I guess, some on the forum say the old screens, although not as bright, are easier to focus than the new screens.

My first kit came with a spirit level and focusing handle, my tripod already has bubbles so I didn't really have a need for the hassy level, and I hate the focusing handle!

Burn a lot of film, these things are a blast to use.

Mike

WLF backwardsness:

You'll get used to it (fast) - I bought a video camera with a LCD a year ago that you could do 'top down' monitoring, the fact it was the right way round completely threw me ...

I cast my vote for the prism finder as well. Near the end of a recent trip my Hassie fell over on the tripod and the old Kiev finder broke off. The rest of the trip I had to use the WLF and it was hard to get used to the backward viewing, and keeping the horizon straight with a ball head. I bought a very serviceable 45 degree finder (Hasselblad this time) from KEH for about $30. Money well spent.

Thanks everyone.

No surprise that there is not a great deal of consensus on the prism and meter issues. I will try using the WLF as suggested, and there doesn't seem to be many PM45's on the used market right now anyway. I'm torn between thinking that a PME45 may be more convenient (as QG says, one less thing to carry) but it is not cheap even used. I'm thinking about switching out the plain screen with the grid/split one since I am used to a gridded groundglass on the 4x5. Question: of the various focusing options, what has the longest eye relief?

I will try not to obsess too much about the stuck filter on the lens since I would likely keep it on anyway.

Another question: lens hood - part 40670? needed?

I'm really excited about this purchase as I'm just getting back into photography after a long hiatus and have always wanted a Hasselblad.

Josh

Lens hood needed?
Most definitely!

The eye relief on all the 45 degree prisms is about the same.
The early 90 degree prisms were bad, the newer (PM9 and PME90) are better, but you pay for that by having a reduced viewfinder image magnification.

It's hard to pick a best screen.
The Acute Matte (with or without D) screens are bright, but at least i do need that split image rangefinder when using an Acute Matte.
The PME45's spot meter mode doesn't like the split image rangefinder much though, and needs a plain Acute Matte (with or without D) instead.

I use the older PME metered prisms. Only center weighed, but precise enough. And they have no issue with the split image rangefinders.
I cheat, because i also carry a separate light meter: the Gossing Digisix. It's tiny, so not much to carry. And it only gets used as a back up.


A thing that should be mentioned about metered prisms on Hasselblads is that they are not linked to anything in the camera in any way.

That means that you have to transfer the reading they produce manually to the lens. That's done the quickest and easiest if they display EV-values, and the older metered prisms do just that.
The newer PME90 and PME45 also (!) offer other display modes, more familiar from other camera systems, i.e. shutterspeed and aperture in either aperture priority or shutterspeed priority mode. That way you can have eithe aperture or shutterspeed already set, and only need to transfer their counterpart to the lens.
I find just using the EV value much simpler, but that's just me.

It also means that you have to set the correct film speed on the meter when you change film.
And also that you need to set the maximum aperture of the lens each and every time you change to a different lens (with different maximum aperture than the one you had on before). The meter has to know what it is metering through.

So though very convenient (i think) and very good too, metered prisms are (a bit) more work than you would think at first.

Another thing to consider about metered prism is that they are calibrated to the brightness of the focussing screen. So if you use an older model, like the VCF-6, with the Acute Matte screen you will get a wrong reading. You can compensate this by selecting a lower film speed (from 1 to 1,3 stops in my experience)
Since some of the old meters might have been recalibrated, you would need to test it.

Francisco

I would advise you to take the lens into a camera repairer and ask him to remove it for you, for what it would cost It's not worth risking damaging it.

I once dropped mine from shoulder height straight down onto pavement with the 250mm Sonnar and metal B50 lens shade in place. The impact mangled the bayonet mount and the lens housing so badly that I could not remove the lens shade. I ended up taking it to an authorized Hasselblad repairman who had to cut it off. If it's really stuck I wouldn't try to remove it myself.

The end of the lens housing is still dented to this day. But the lens has always worked perfectly. Hasselblads can sure take a beating.

Regarding your questions -

1) Like the others have mentioned the filter should come right off, if not ..... even after applying a little force, then it should be sent to a repair center for removal. You don't want a jammed filter on the front of a lens, you always need access to the front element for periodic cleaning. You can definitely mount a shade onto a Hasselblad filter if that's what yours is, it also has to be undamaged for teh shade to bayonet properly.

2) If you are used to the 4x5 upside down and reversed imaging, it should be no issue dealing with a simple reversed image on a Hasselblad. I use a PME3 prism, but, I still use my waistlevel the most. I agree completely with QG about the EV settings, much easier and faster to use. I have not used the PME45 so can't comment on it objectively except I can easily say it is quite pricey. The older, but great prisms are quite a value. They work beautifully but you would have to decide if a metered version is important to you. Personally, when I use a prism I want it to be metered. I use my PME3 with a Accumatte D in my bodies. I also agree with QG about the split image, I always use it, no matter what finder I have installed. I actually love using the magnifying chimney finder for images that are stationary and when I'm working off a tripod. I was real careful when I was looking for my prism and I found the PME3 to be the best value available, bang for the buck.

3) In my opinion, there is no question the Accumatte D with split image is going to help with focusing more than anything else. I have used an Accumatte with the micro prism but I did not find it helped nearly as much as the split image. The caveat though, is you must keep your eye well in alignment, centered, over teh split image or half of the split image will black out. A little practice and it becomes second nature.

4) The Hasselblad bubble level accessory is essential in my book if you are shooting in the field. I love that little gizmo. It is compact enough to easily put away and it never gets in the way when shooting and it is easily viewable when working above the camera. It's a fantastic accessory for the camera. There is also a flash shoe mount but I never use that but perhaps a wedding or event shooter may. There is a external battery holder that can be used for different body and accessory versions. There is a side mount sports viewfinder that fits too. There may be some other gizmos that I am forgetting which fit also. You need the Compendium book by Nordin to get a full rundown on the Hasselblad System, it will help you immensely along with Wildi's book.

5) Okay, your question leaves many options, you have to decide what your needs will be. No one can really give you a specific what is best answer to the question you posed because of the great variety components available. I can tell you what I use with my Arca B1 head. For the Blad (500 C/M's and 553ELX) I use Wimberley plates. What I do is use two of them in combination with two Hasselblad tripod couplers, basically the Hasselblad factory version of a quick release. I use two Hasselblad #45129 tripod quick couplers. I like that particular coupler the best of all of the versions they have made because the release lever and safety lock lever are on the same side of the coupler. I have one of these couplers mounted to a Wimberley P10 plate. It facilitates two things, the coupler allows quick removal of the camera body from the coupler leaving the camera body without some stupid chunk of metal attached to it. The coupler itself has a permanently mounted P10 plate mounted to the bottom of it which quickly releases from the Arca B1 head. I can swap bodies back and forth to the ballhead in a heartbeat and I can remove all mounting plates from the bodies in a heartbeat too. Best of both worlds and it works perfectly. Now, I also have a longer Wimberley plate (P50 I believe- kind of like a simple long macro rail) which is mounted to another Hasselblad coupler (45129), I sometimes use this in situations where I need quick forward and backward adjustment of camera position without having to move the tripod, all I do is loosen the Arca B1 clamping knob and slide the Wimberley plate back and forth for a quick camera adjustment. This allows quick mount and dismount of bodies as well. Works like a charm. I also use a Wimberley P10 plate on a Zeiss 500mm telephoto which I then clamp into the B1 which balances the rig nicely. I love Wimberley plates, I have never had an issue with them and they mount perfectly to the Hasselblad couplers and lens foot. The safety stop screws in the Wimberley plates are a big plus too. This entire setup that I have described will leave your Hasselblad in a stock configuration, nothing permanently mounted and hanging off the bottom of the body. The camera simply mounts and dismounts in a split second onto any Arca style quick release bracket ballhead no matter the brand without leaving a plate permanently attached to the blad body.

6) Yeah, you probably forgot a lot. Welcome to the club .... we all do.

Wow. Thanks for such a wealth of information, everyone. This is my first posted thread at APUG (after lurking for about a year) and it's good to know that this is a civil place on the web as compared to other sites where things tend to degenerate rather quickly.

From what I can tell, there is more of a consensus about the split image screen then there is on the issues of "WLF vs. Prism" and meter

As to the stuck lens filter, can anyone recommend a good repair facility in Manhattan that could do this on a walk-in basis?

Thanks,

Josh

You can buy a bottle/jar top remover from any disability aid shop, these are just great for gripping round objects because the grip is applied with an even pressure all around the surface.

Try Nippon repair in NY, I don't know for sure if they are walk in or not, but I assume they may have a drop off counter of some kind. Nippon is a top rated repair facility.

I am relieved, and a tiny bit embarrassed, to report that I was able to remove the stuck bay 60 filter by using the lens cap as a wrench. The filter starts to stick when put back on the lens after a travel of about 5mm -- shouldn't it travel further to its stop without sticking? From what I can tell the bayonet fitting on the lens itself is in perfect condition, so perhaps this is just a problem with the filter itself, but I can now stop obsessing and just go out and have fun with my new camera.

Thanks,

Josh

jd101io said:

I am relieved, and a tiny bit embarrassed, to report that I was able to remove the stuck bay 60 filter by using the lens cap as a wrench. The filter starts to stick when put back on the lens after a travel of about 5mm -- shouldn't it travel further to its stop without sticking? From what I can tell the bayonet fitting on the lens itself is in perfect condition, so perhaps this is just a problem with the filter itself, but I can now stop obsessing and just go out and have fun with my new camera.

Click to expand...

You can adjust how tight the filter fits by bending the bayonet 'tongues' (i don't know what else to call them):
- Towards the rim of the filter (closing the gap) to make the fit tighter.
- Away from the rim (opening the gap) to make the fit less tight.

Be careful:
- Use the back end of a pencil, or other (soft) wooden implement to push on the tongues. And don't slip.
- Don't bend the thingies too much or too often or they will break.

Get the prism without a meter. The meter is not a good one. Call one of the larger camera stores and see if you can get a filter wrench.

Bruce A Cahn said:

Get the prism without a meter. The meter is not a good one.

Click to expand...

You must be joking!

The meters in all Hasselblad metered prisms is dead on accurate.

He may have been talking about the kiev.

Mike

Having considered the above, especially Q.G.'s post #12 and John R.'s post #16, a PME-51 in LN condition popped up on the web on Saturday morning for much less than I has been prepared to spend for an unmetered prism, so I bought it and am awaiting delivery.

Josh, the OP here.