My MF vs. LF Quandary

BruceN · Dec 1, 2006

With my new darkroom up and running, it's time to turn my attention to getting out there and shooting more. Right now I have tremendous amounts of 35mm gear, but since my Hassy rig went away long ago (due to a financial catastrophe) my only MF camera currently is a Yashica MAT124G. I also have my Meridian 45B 4x5, but my only lens (a 150mm) has an unreliable shutter.
The kind of shooting I do is primarily landscapes (ie. rocks, trees and waterfalls, and sometimes coal mines) in B&W, with some occasional Velvia thrown in for spice. My quandary is this: Do I invest in a new (to me) Hassy or RB-67 rig, or would my money be better spent on new lenses, etc. for my 4x5? I like the convenience and processing ease of roll film, but I like the versatility and bigger negs of the 4x5. Usually I'm not wishy-washy and indecisive, but in this instance I'm completely locked up. For those of you who shoot the same sorts of things I do - What would you do?

Thanks,
Bruce

Amund · Dec 1, 2006

$50 will give your shutter new life if you send it here.

Terence · Dec 1, 2006

I say go for the medium format. If it's easier to use and process, you're more likely to use it. I love my LF, but still reach for the MF much more often.

mark · Dec 1, 2006

You're the only one who can answer this question.

I got a shutter overhauled at Tempe Camera for 45 bucks. I would go with the 4x5 option myself. Initial outlay would be less than building a new MF system. But, it all depends on how you shoot. I am seldom happy with my MF landscape images because I usually need movement and the MF does not have it. If I am shooting straight on with no need for movement then the MF can't be beat for ease.

All depends on your personal needs.

Richard Wasserman · Dec 1, 2006

I would send your shutter to carol Flutot as Amund suggested and shoot 4x5. I assume that whatever format you choose you'll be using a tripod. My feeling is that if you are using a tripod you might as well use the largest format possible as the reulting print quality will make the additional hassle of sheet film well worth while. I find a great difference between 6x6 and 4x5 prints and I use both formats, but for very different subject matter.

Richard Wasserman

Travis Nunn · Dec 1, 2006

As a RB67 owner, I say go with the RB. There are some great lenses out there for it and they cost a fraction of what they used to.

DBP · Dec 1, 2006

Even though I have a MF SLR (Arax 88), I still use the Yashicamat (and other TLRs) a lot and could easily use it for most MF occasions. I would suggest starting by getting the shutter fixed, and maybe acquiring a roll film insert for the Meridian. Then look for something wider for 4x5, like 90mm.

kb244 · Dec 1, 2006

As an owner of a 35mm Rangefinder (Canon P), 35mm half frame (demi or Oly Pen), MF SLR (Rb67) , MF TLR (Yashica Mat124G, Mamiya C3, ...) and Crown Graphic 4x5.

I say.... help me.

LoL seriously though it's really up to you. I love all my cameras, but I'll shoot my 35mm or my MF TLR the most. I do enjoy the RB67 and the Mamiya 4x5 but both of them can take some time ( tho the RB67 has the advantage of the rotating roll back, and putting on the 65mm lens is SWEET for landscapes). But It's up to you. In my opinion what do you enjoy shooting more? On the other hand an RB67 outfit can be had for very inexpensive price (Tho I think that 65mm or 50mm still fetches for a fair bit of money).

kb244 · Dec 1, 2006

My co-worker says look at the Pentax 67 for what you are doing.

Stew Squires · Dec 1, 2006

I have both Mamiya 7II and RB67. I also have Toyo 45X with 6x9 and 6x12 backs. I would consider fixing your shutter and possibly getting some new lenses, and then going with roll film backs for your 4x5. Certainly not as convenient as your Hassy, but would probably give you much more flexibility in the long run for the type of photography you describe.

Stew

tom_micklin · Dec 1, 2006

disfromage said:
I assume that whatever format you choose you'll be using a tripod. My feeling is that if you are using a tripod you might as well use the largest format possible as the reulting print quality will make the additional hassle of sheet film well worth while.

Richard Wasserman

This has been my philosophy for quite a few years. Once I realized that I needed to be shooting MF on a tripod, I figured I may as well be shooting LF for the better negative quality.
While I am now in a position to choose between the Hassy and the 4x5, I almost always use the LF, assuming all other conditions are equal.
Tom

Will S · Dec 1, 2006

You can use a C2 rollfilm holder and polaroid holders on the Meridian 45B. It's a great camera given its weight. I've never tried a grafmatic, but I think it will fit. I like mine and don't want to sell it, but if the 8x10 thing starts working out I may have to. I've got several lightweight lenses (a Caltar 135 and a Kodak Ektar 90 and a Symmar-S 150) and an Imagon for portraits that all fold up inside it if I want to leave them mounted. And it's light enough that you don't need a huge honker tripod for it. I bet a Pentax 6x7 with a long lens weighs just as much.

Best,

Will

waynecrider · Dec 1, 2006

I have been, and still want to shoot my Yashica Mat more then my Hassy, in fact I just about finished building the Yashica kit, and my preference for 4x5 has now turned into a 3x4 Auto Graflex. Both are easier to use and cheaper. It's hard to shoot my 35mm's but I find them usefull for macro, and family stuff because of the incorporate flash. I think that instead of trying to decide where to put your attention maybe you should just let your subject matter or the wind decide for you. Don't get too caught up in concrete decisions.

Concerning a new for you Hassy or RB I'd pass on both. Not worth it nowadays to invest in either. Fix the shutter.

JBrunner · Dec 1, 2006

I'll vote for the LF. Great 4x5 lenses can be had for decent prices if you are patient. If you get a developing tank, (like an HP Combiplan) you can develop six sheets at once, much like roll film.

glennfromwy · Dec 1, 2006

Hey, Bruce --
Why not do like me and just get one of everything? No, seriously, if you want MF gear, I would consider Bronica. I have an ETRS and an SQA. The stuff goes for cheap right now and quality is very good. RB-67 is a nice setup, As long as you don't have to carry it.

BruceN · Dec 2, 2006

Thanks everyone, this has helped. I'm going to go ahead and firm up the 4x5 kit. I'll start by getting that shutter looked at and acquiring some more film holders. I'm currently processing 4 up in an 8x10 unidrum on the uniroller base, but I don't really care for that as I have to reduce developing times by quite a bit in order to keep the contrast under control due to the continuous agitation. I'll look into getting some old Kodak hangers & tanks for dip & dunk or something. I have a Yankee tank setup, but I already don't like it even though I've never used it.
Later on, if my coal mine project shapes up like I think it will, I'll probably look into getting a 6x7 MF camera that can be easily handheld. I think a Mamiya 7 II will probably be made to order for that.

Glenn - Yeah, that would be nice. Actually, that reminds me - I need to come down there and do some serious sucking up so that you'll put me in your will. On second thought, you'll probably outlive me.

naturephoto1 · Dec 2, 2006

Hi Bruce,

I know that I have come to the party a little late and gather you have made your decision based on what others have said in the thread. But, let me add a few thoughts. If you want speed of set up consider a medium format system. I like my Mamiya 7II for that. But, if you want more control over composition and to deal with depth of field and utilizing the view/field camera movements I would opt for the 4 X 5. I enjoy working with the 4 X 5. It slows me down and makes working with the landscape more intimate as I have to work the controls and the image is upside down and reversed. Additionally, because of the expense of the film it forces you to work more carefully and perhaps a bit more deliberately. Another few things to consider are that you can process the sheets individually in either B&W or color which can result in more accurate processing if the exposure is concern due to lighting conditions. Finally, with the 4 X 5 you can also use reducing backs for medium format sizes when needed or if the question of cost per shot comes into consideration.

Rich

ronlamarsh · Dec 3, 2006

MF? LF?

A late comer also: I have debated this with myself over the years and there is realy no good answer. It all boils down to personal preference. For I have a Nikon F3HP and a Moskva 4 6X9 and use them for those shots when there isn't time to set up my LF gear or they are the ones I carry the most. I find the immediacy of MF and 35mm refreshing. I have also noticed though that my composition isn't nearly as good.
Another point for me is: if I'm going to lug a tripod anyway because I am using very low spd film to get the quality I may as well drag along my linhof.

gchpaco · Dec 3, 2006

I have two reasonably complete medium format systems and a 4x5; I find that while I enjoy using the 4x5, I don't like lugging it from place to place. As 4x5 cameras go, I have a Bender, so it's hard for me to imagine that it would get substantially lighter with a different camera. So depending on how far you expect to walk, the Hassy rig may be worth exploring. The RB67 is not going to be lighter than the 4x5, and may in fact be substantially heavier. Operationally, on-site the 4x5 is of course slower to use, but you expect that; in practice I find that while I can get half a dozen or so shots with my Bronica SLR off in the time it takes me to get one 4x5 shot, the hit rate is better on the 4x5.

I carry the SLR system, the rangefinder system, or the 4x5 depending on my mood at the time and depending on how far I have to walk.

In total honesty, I should note that I injured my back at the beginning of the year (too small backpack with inadequate support carrying an off balance 3021 uphill) and have had to reexamine how willing I am to carry large weights as a result.

P C Headland · Dec 4, 2006

Another late chimer

Get the shutter fixed on the LF lens since it won't cost that much anyway. In the meantime, run some nice film through the Yashica. When you get the LF shutter back, you can shoot the two formats and see which gets used the most.

You never know, you may actually find it liberating being stuck with one focal length

My MF vs. LF Quandary

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