My Cat Is Still Alive

I had a very dilute solution of potassium ferricyanide
sitting in a shallow container upon the counter. While
my back was turned my cat had jumped upon the
counter and had begun to lap it up.

Two days now and no signs of illness. Just how
dangerous is that stuff if ingested? Dan

A quick look at a Postassium Ferricyanide MSDS (such as this one) doesn't raise any alarms:

Ingestion:
Large doses may cause gastrointestinal upset with nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, and possible cramping.

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Despite your cat being somewhat smaller than your average human, and a large dose being scaled accordingly, if you cat doesn't seem too upset by this stage, I'd say they'll be fine. Despite the "cyanide" in the name, it's not nearly as deadly as you might expect. Might get you on a watch list, but it most likely wont kill you.

Isn't it a little late and why would you be asking here?
Your vet's the person you should have asked! They could then have taken proactive action instead of possibly having to take reactive action. You should have taken the cat to them immediately instead of waiting to see if the cat got sick. By that time it could have been too late.

A vet should always be contacted if an animal ingests something it shouldn't. Animals' physiology is not identical to humans' and they can have problems with seemingly innocuous substances. The best known is probably the danger chocolate can present to dogs in sufficient quantity.
I was at the emergency animal hospital this week and saw a medium-sized dog in convulsions from walking through stinging nettle, something which gives me a mild rash at worst!

You should still contact them and tell them what happened, and find out the potential for damage. Lack of symptoms does not in itself mean lack of damage.
Animals are amazingly stoic. They will often put up with a lot of discomfort or pain without showing it. It's also possible that the cat is asymptomatic but still injured by the chemical.

Listen to yourself. You basically said "My cat ingested a cyanide-bearing substance, but I figure I'll wait to see if it's actually poisoned".
THE CAT'S POISONED! The only question is how badly. Maybe not enough to cause permanent harm, but you don't know that.

What if it was a child that ingested some? Would you wait around to see if the kid got sick?

EDIT:While I was writing this the prior post went up. Remember the MSDS is written for humans. While it's likely the cat suffered no harm, that doesn't change the fact that you waited two days to ask anybody. A vet would have checked the MSDS, then looked for specific pathology between this substance and cats. They might have induced vomiting or pumped as a precaution, or they might have sent you home and said keep an eye on it. Or something else. The point is not to wait around for symptoms before doing something, and always act on the side of caution.

Just as a point on curiosity, could any chemists in the house (I see you guys over there, with your coats), explain the difference between Potassium Ferricyanide and the cyanide pill I might pop if captured behind enemy lines? If you mention Potassium Ferricyanide amongst friends usually you have to follow it with "no, I'm not planning to kill anyone".

dancqu said:

I had a very dilute solution of potassium ferricyanide
sitting in a shallow container upon the counter. While
my back was turned my cat had jumped upon the
counter and had begun to lap it up.

Two days now and no signs of illness. Just how
dangerous is that stuff if ingested? Dan

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Did you notice any bleaching of the fur? If so, don't fix but redevelop! If the cat has disappeared already, it's too late.

RalphLambrecht said:

Did you notice any bleaching of the fur? If so, don't fix but redevelop! If the cat has disappeared already, it's too late.

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My animals are always fixed early in their development.

It's probably fine. The name sounds much worse than either the ferri or ferro really are in isolated and aq. form. I guess it could make cyanide gas in the gastric system, via reaction with the HCl. That being the case, you should make every effort not to inhale your cat's farts for a while

If the fur turns prussian blue, well then do be sure to post some pics on youtube.... No, wait, scratch that: PETA would probably sue you.

If you call potassium ferricyanide by its "official" IUPAC name, potassium hexacyanoferrate(III), it doesn't anymore sound like that dangerous ;-).

Well, I agree with lxdude, but good thing that potassium ferricyanide is not that dangerous, especially if the dose was very small. Remember that NaCl is also quite dangerous, unless the dose is small.

If it WAS cyanide, a proper first-aid antidote would have been sodium thiosulfate --- fixer.

hrst said:

Remember that NaCl is also quite dangerous, unless the dose is small.

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Or hydrogen hydroxide, aka dihydrogen monoxide, sometimes called hydroxylic acid. Normally tolerable, deadly if inhaled in sufficient quantity.

Also from MSDS, the LD50 rate for a mouse is "Oral mouse LD50: 2970 mg/kg." LD50 = Lethal Dose 50%, 2.97g/kilo, cat is around 4-5kg (small cat) = 11.88g-14.85g ingestion needed for a 50/50 chance of cat dying. Unless the cat was lapping up the dried crystals for a while...
Be a bit more careful next time, cat hair's awful on damp photographic prints.

Fleath said:

Just as a point on curiosity, could any chemists in the house (I see you guys over there, with your coats), explain the difference between Potassium Ferricyanide and the cyanide pill I might pop if captured behind enemy lines? If you mention Potassium Ferricyanide amongst friends usually you have to follow it with "no, I'm not planning to kill anyone".

Click to expand...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyanide_poisoning

The "cyanide" is tightly complexed with the Ferric ion in Ferricyanide. It will not be very harmful except in strong acid where it can liberate cyanide gas. The gas can be absorbed into the blood causing poisoning, but this would take place rather rapidly as say within hours. Since the cat is ok, there is probably no severe damage except nausea. If the cat throws up, there may be breathing difficulties. Get the advice of a good vet.

PE

keithwms said:

If the fur turns prussian blue, well then do be sure to post some pics on youtube.... No, wait, scratch that: PETA would probably sue you.

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PETA => People Eating Tasty Animals ?

A cat has nine lives. At most yours is down by one.

Steve

hello

there are more fun ways to bleach a cat! and go on and tell us the truth, you did it on purpose!

Always make sure your cat has plenty of fresh water available at all times.

Always make certain your cat has plenty of fresh water available at all times.

I was working in a lab and a couple Intel engineers came by to see if I could test some potassium ferricyanide that they were thinking of buying to see if they met the ACS specifications. As we were talking, the subject of toxicity came up. One Intel guy said that he had read about someone that tried to kill themselves by ingesting potassium ferricyanide.

Thinking that it was going to drop him dead immediately after eating it as would happen with a regular simple cyanide salt, the guy swallowed several grams of it. Nothing appearantly happened. So the guy took a larger amount - still not dead. So the guy eventually ate a couple hundred grams of it, and the potassium ferricyanide had still not killed him.

The story goes that even though the guy did not drop dead immediately - or even shortly after eating such large amounts of potassium ferricyanide, he did eventually die from it. His kidneys failed over the next day or so from trying to process such a large amount of the salt. Note the MSDS linked to above states, "Large doses may cause gastrointestinal upset with nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, and possible cramping." It ended up being a much slower and more painful way to go than he had originally planned.

At least that's how I remember the story going.

keithwms said:

I guess it could make cyanide gas in the gastric system, via reaction with the HCl.

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This does not happen. Stomach acid is far too weak to break the ferricyanide complex and liberate free cyanide.

The stuff is not all that dangerous, as Heather indicated by the LD50 figures. I do not know the dilution, but assuming a 10% solution and 12grams for that 50/50 chance, the cat would have to drink about 100ml to reach that 50/50 level -- that's a lot of lapping up! But keep the cat away from your selenium toner and chromium intensifier!

Kirk Keyes said:

This does not happen. Stomach acid is far too weak to break the ferricyanide complex and liberate free cyanide.

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Ah good, well then he needn't fret the toxicity of the cat farts.

" it was the cat ... "

sounds like a cross between the freak brothers and james bond

keep on truckin' !

keithwms said:

Ah good, well then he needn't fret the toxicity of the cat farts.

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That is true, at least from a cyanide piont of view. Depending on your cat, there may be other reasons to worry about it...

keeping open containers with chemical solutions inside is an idiotic habit, cat or child or whatever.

jnanian said:

" it was the cat ... "

sounds like a cross between the freak brothers and james bond

keep on truckin' !

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Now that's a blast from the past... A past that was very colorful, even in black and white.

Ray Rogers said:

Now that's a blast from the past... A past that was very colorful, even in black and white.

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Ah, yes...Fat Freddy's cat...