multigrade 4 RC paper contrast guidelines

[tballphoto]

opened my first package of ilford multi grade 4 rc deluxe today. Was surprised at the fold out chart that fell out of the paper envelope. have some issues with it.

I made some prints, wasted paper really, trying to figure out what settings to use for magenta on my dual dichro head.

the beseler manual says one thing, the ilford handout says something else that makes you use alot more higher magenta value.

The two tests i did with magenta at 40 per beseler came out ok but still dark.. the one i did at 80 per ilford paper came out crappy and darker.. i couldnt remember which one and just used the ilford guidelines for contrast 4, 100 magenta.

images came out really really dark. Anything NOT white or silver in the negative came out solid black. I even experimented by leaving them in developer longer to the point that the non image area of the paper was turning black as if i had accidentally tossed an undeveloped sheet of paper into developer.

SO what guidelines should i really be using here, or should i start out with lower contrast grade? like a 2

 

[MattKing]

Which Beseler light source are you using?

 

[tballphoto]

dual dichro S color and black and white head.

the manual gives settings numbers, and is based upon kodak filter system.

ilford lumps the beseler filters under the kodak system as well in the paper that came tucked in the printing paper, but use completely higher numbers. nearly DOUBLE what beseler gives.

 

[MattKing]

Are you using the speed matched numbers (magenta and yellow pairs) or the single setting number (either a magenta setting, or a yellow setting)?
And what "grade" are you aiming for? Something between 2 and 3 is generally a good target.
One final question: are you sure you don't have the (designed for focusing) white light engaged, rather than the contrast filters.
I haven't used a Dual Dichro S head in years, but I think I recall a white light lever.
By the way, the Beseler instructions could be for older versions of the Ilford papers.

 

[tballphoto]

I was thinking the beseler manual, printed before i was born COULD be intended for ilford paper circa 1980s or before, so i assumed i should use the ilford handout in their paper envelope.

I was using the single number setting for magenta in all attempts.

And i actually discovered by accident that you CAN use the enlarger head in white lever focusing mode IF you select that mode when the unit has no power to it.

but i verified each time as I actually noticed the image was somewhat easier for my eyes to see when the filtration was turned on.

 

[tballphoto]

At a buck a sheet i dont want to keep wasting it,

 

[MattKing]

Use the two filter setting numbers. And practice with small sheets - you can cut 8" x 10" paper into four 4"x5" or two 5"x8" sheets.

 

[tballphoto]

i have two packages of a different multigrade paper SOMEWHERE around here, but i had someone "help" me with cleaning and well, i can barely find my bathroom door they helped so well.

 

[ic-racer]

 

[tballphoto]

my prints came out looking like his very last time segment did.

however this is an interesting bit of usable video as i have film negatives that look like the first visible section, i think his 2 or 4 section in terms of density

 

[tballphoto]

one was done at magenta 40, one at magenta 80. the one with lighter bark looks alot like when i set the system to 0-0-0 for contrast grade 2.


all i know is that when i took the area, it was a sunny section bordering a nice darker "moody" section.

 

[Lachlan Young]

dual dichro head

Is this set up for diffusion or condenser mode?

what guidelines should i really be using here, or should i start out with lower contrast grade? like a 2

Start out with zero magenta and add as needed - the Ilford numbers are nominal for the main sets of filtration systems in use, but there can be (very) significant variation between manufacturers.

 

[tballphoto]

the ilford handout and the beseler dichro s head both use 0 -0 -0 for the color setting to make contrast grade 2. Then everything goes haywire like i got hit with a cattle prod.

And it is condenser set up now. i do have diffussion parts for the dichro head and the diffusion inserts for the enlarger,

 

[Lachlan Young]

And it is condenser set up now

That, I suspect, is why you are having issues with contrast - everything is running at least a grade or two harder with your current setup in terms of effective contrast.

 

[tezzasmall]

If the print is dark overall (is it?), then isn't it an over expsoure error, rather than a contrast one?

Terry S

 

[tballphoto]

That, I suspect, is why you are having issues with contrast - everything is running at least a grade or two harder with your current setup in terms of effective contrast.

SO then in theory i should assume i should reduce my filter settings to the next lower number? IE if i want to print at contrast two, to just use contrast grade 1 settings?

 

[pentaxuser]

If the print is dark overall (is it?), then isn't it an over expsoure error, rather than a contrast one?

OP, I don't think you have said what your exposure is in terms of time or aperture but Terry, whom I have quoted above makes a great point about exposure. Have you tried doing a test print at say f11 and exposing the negative (a) without any filtration at all ( this should give you about grade 2 with MGIV paper) and starting your exposure at say 1 second and increasing it 2 seconds each time so you get 1,3,5,7,9 seconds exposure

The shows us that test print

pentaxuser

 

[Lachlan Young]

SO then in theory i should assume i should reduce my filter settings to the next lower number? IE if i want to print at contrast two, to just use contrast grade 1 settings?

I'd start at G2 and try and get as good an exposure as possible, then dial contrast down a grade and see. Aim for good shadow gradient. You can worry about burning in highlights once you've sorted out shadows/ mids.