MF Folders Worth Having

Stephanie Brim · Sep 25, 2006

I have only one folder as of now: An Agfa Billy that's about three times my age. The lens is sharp enough when stopped down and I haven't tried it wide open because it's not rangefinder-focused. I'll try it one of these days when I'm feeling brave. A folder I'm looking at getting, though, is the Mamiya 6 IV. 6x6 coupled rangefinder camera with a 75/3.5 lens. Coated, I believe.

Arelia99 · Sep 25, 2006

I love folders...

I recently picked up a Billy Record II (6x9) from Certo6 and I love it! I have had no flatness issues either. If your pocket is a tad wide it will fit and the one I got from Jurgen is in perfect working order, new bellows, CLA'd ect. I love it so much that I am also getting a Russian folder from Fedka...the Iskara in 6x4,5 format! This path have been a mistake...I see less use of my Bessa L in my future!

Nancy

buze · Sep 25, 2006

I think the Rolls Royce of 6x6 folder is the Agfa Super Isolette/Ansco Super Speedex. Just one notch above everything else. The Iskra is a nice second, a bit heavier, a bit more "russian" but the lens is every bit as good, and the rangefinder is a bit bigger (and has longer base too). Both are quick to shoot with their coupled rangefinder, are unit focussing, and have an automatic film advance (fragile, in the xase of the Iskra)

On 6x9 I use Super Ikonta C 530/2 and Moskva 5. Once again the Zeiss is superbly built, and even it's uncoated Tessar is incredibly sharp. The Moskva is more of an acquired taste, the "lefty" feeling when using it is a bit wierd, but it still makes fantastic 6x9 slides !

Dan Fromm · Sep 25, 2006

richard littlewood said:
Ensign Selfix 820. 6x9, 105mm lens, solid build, compact and goes for round about £40 for a good one. I got one off e-bay, have a look at the equipment page at http://www.richard-littlewood.com to see what I went through so I could use this camera with Delta 3200.

Richard, I'm glad your Selfix 820 is a good 'un. Mine's 105/3.8 Xpres produces images that are, at the same aperture, distinctly less sharp than my humble 101/4.5 Ektar does on a 2x3 Graphic. I've checked as best I can and the Ensign's lens seems to be in collimation.

Since the Graphic has other advantages and the Selfix won't go in a normal pocket, the Selfix stays home.

Cheers,

Dan

David A. Goldfarb · Sep 25, 2006

A coupled rangefinder is a nice thing, but it's not that hard to get used to a shoe mount rangefinder, if you use it regularly. The Perkeo II does have a reliable frame counter that will always get you 13 exposures on a roll, if you want--not too useful for negative film, because the extra frame won't fit on a contact sheet, but it's handy for slide film.

I suppose we all have different uses for folders. I like them as handheld cameras, usually with fast film so I can shoot at 1/200 sec. or faster outdoors, and ideally around f:8-16. If I need a tripod, I might as well use a bigger camera.

Film flatness issues are the kind of thing most people don't notice without comparing results with a camera or back that has really good flatness, like a Linhof Super-Rollex back, which weighs more (just the back) than most 6x9 folders (the entire camera). Even the best folders are ultimately designed as tourist cameras, and this is where it shows up, in my opinion. That said, they are a lot of fun, can go anywhere, and can still give great results compared to 35mm.

Alex Hawley · Sep 25, 2006

Sanders McNew said:
It was fine enough to win her second place in Ilford's just-concluded postcard competition here on APUG.
Sanders

That did not go unoticed by me Sanders. Another piece of my puzzle came from going through my parent's negatives. All taken in the 1950s, many with an unknown folder that I just dimly remember. Thanks you for your information.

After reading all this good info, methinks I will perhaps wind up with more than one camera, playing the pool a bit.

My useage philosophy is nearly the same as David's. These (note plural) cameras are for the family stuff and places where I can't lug the field artillery around. I still have the 35mm for such use but the larger negative from the 120 film is well worth the difference in equipment limitations. Plus, the folders are much easier to carry than a TLR is, or even a high-end SLR.

Rolleiflexible · Sep 25, 2006

Alex Hawley said:
These (note plural) cameras are for the family stuff and places where I can't lug the field artillery around. I still have the 35mm for such use but the larger negative from the 120 film is well worth the difference in equipment limitations. Plus, the folders are much easier to carry than a TLR is, or even a high-end SLR.

We can all rationalize. I think a lot of their appeal (and I think this is true of many classic cameras) is emotional. They are just sweet cameras. They tug at us, and we find reasons after the fact to explain their value to us.

Sanders

richard littlewood · Sep 25, 2006

Dan
I wouldnt say the Selfix 820 I've got is brilliant. Like a lot of old stuff it falls a bit short in a few areas, and with 6x6 the lens is dead good, but at 6x9 the corners can suffer a little wider than f11, I find the viewfinder a pain in certain light conditions, and I had to kill off a few internal reflections. But other than that, stick it on a monopod, always use a lens hood (push on, like the filters) load up with HP5, and at an exposure of say 1/25th at f16/22, and assuming I've focused well, the negs are incredibly good.
I would without a doubt encourage anyone to get hold of a decent old folder, it might force a different approach to taking pics - I got a monopod for the first time to go under my oldie, and there might be a bit of tinkering to do, but few objects these days have the style (and smell) of an old folder!

Alex Hawley · Sep 25, 2006

Sanders McNew said:
We can all rationalize. I think a lot of their appeal (and I think this is true of many classic cameras) is emotional. They are just sweet cameras. They tug at us, and we find reasons after the fact to explain their value to us.

Sanders

Good observation Sanders! As long as I devote some film footage to the family, I can get most anything I want.

elekm · Sep 27, 2006

Alex, you could start out with a simple camera without a rangefinder and then if you like using it move to something with a rangefinder.

I'm a big fan of the Zeiss Ikon line, so a nice 6x6 Ikonta with a Tessar or Novar could be a good place to start. Then if you like using it, try a Super Ikonta (which means it has a rangefinder).

Other possibilities include the Agfa line of Isolette cameras. The Isolette III with the uncoupled rangefinder is a nice piece of gear. The downside of the Agfa/Ansco cameras is that horrible lubrication in the helicals and holes in the bellows.

Voigtlander also made a series of medium format folders.

And if you don't find respooling too much of a pain in the neck, the Kodak/Nagel Duo 620 is a friendly little 6x4.5 camera. There also is a Kodak/Nagel Vollenda 620 that is 6x6, and it's another nice piece of gear.

Lucky for you -- plenty of choices. And all will be lots of fun to use.

Alex Hawley · Sep 27, 2006

Thanks for your suggestion elekm. That in fact is what I have decided to do. Starting off with a Bessa I. I can see where a person may need to establish a collection of these jewels. They are quite intriguing, and as you say, they seem quite fun.

pandino · Sep 27, 2006

buze said:
I think the Rolls Royce of 6x6 folder is the Agfa Super Isolette/Ansco Super Speedex...

Hi Alex! This is the camera you played with that day (Super Speedex), and it's the one pictured in my avatar. It was serviced by Jurgen as well and hums like it was new. It's a great folder if you like 6x6 and the images are razor sharp when you want them to be. I often wish it also shot 6x9.

The Isolette III/Speedex Special R as mentioned are nice, and have the advantage of being pocketable. I prefer using the coupled RF folders as I often forget to focus otherwise.

I don't think you can go wrong with the Bessa, but be careful because it's easy to get addicted! I've had about 8-10 folders, but the Super Speedex is the only one so far that I'd never sell.

I think you'd fall in love with any of the cameras on Tom H.'s list. They are in high demand, and for good reason.

I don't recall if it has been mentioned, but film flatness can sometimes be an issue because the bellows will suck the film in towards the lens when opened. As a matter of practice, I always open the camera slowly and wait to index the frame until I'm ready to shoot. I've never had an issue with poor focus due to film flatness.

Have fun with the Bessa!

Alex Hawley · Sep 27, 2006

Thanks Chris! See what you got me going on here? Just what I need, another camera, or cameras!

eddie gunks · Sep 28, 2006

i also shoot with the old russian folders. 6x9 is so nice. i got a very good model. must have been lots of vodka available cause it functions perfect with no light leaks yet.

eddie

David H. Bebbington · Sep 28, 2006

Since no one has mentioned the Kodak 66 Model III yet, I will! Takes 120 film, has nice 4.5 Anaston lens (I presume a triplet) and shutter speeded 1/10 to 1/200. I bought a mint one in a charity store for £25 - they go for this or less on e-bay.

Just a point on film flatness - this can be improved (if you REALLY want to) by first opening your folder and THEN winding this film. It's counter-intuitive and likely at least at first to lead to double exposures but it does stop the film being sucked (slightly) into the bellows as these open.

Regards,

David

cdholden · Sep 28, 2006

sanking said:
I would recommend a 6X9 folder for the big negative . The best ones in this size are without question the Super Ikonta C and Bessa II. Unfortunately, both are very expensive if you can find them in very good condition.

Sandy King

These are both nice cameras to work with. For those on a smaller budget, there are similar models available without the coupled rangefinder. Bessa I and any Ikonta without the word "Super" in it's title are easy to find and are much more affordable. For those who have never used these, focusing is done by estimating distance from lens to subject. Adjustment of the distance scale on the lens gets the focus where you need it. Stopping down the lens will increase your depth of field. Usually you can find these cameras for a decent price.
As a rule, I avoid the Agfa cameras. All the older ones I've had without recent service have damaged/deteriorated bellows and/or a frozen front lens element... sticks so that it won't move.
Best of luck to those who find and enjoy folding cameras. I'll be taking my Bessa II off to northeast OK this weekend for a visit with family and friends and to snap a few more shots of a rural area before it falls prey to urban sprawl.
Chris

elekm · Sep 28, 2006

The Kodak 66 Model III doesn't get mentioned much because you rarely see it outside of the U.K.

I bought one of these a couple of years ago from a U.K. buyer. It was a nice little camera and seemed to be pretty well made. The top deck was that gray plastic that Kodak seemed to love.

The story of this camera is that it was developed and manufactured solely by Kodak's U.K. division. It also is one of the very few Kodak cameras from that period that used 120, rather than 620.

But I agree that the Kodak 66 Model III is a great choice for someone starting out in folding cameras.

sanking · Oct 5, 2006

cdholden said:
These are both nice cameras to work with. For those on a smaller budget, there are similar models available without the coupled rangefinder. Bessa I and any Ikonta without the word "Super" in it's title are easy to find and are much more affordable. For those who have never used these, focusing is done by estimating distance from lens to subject. Adjustment of the distance scale on the lens gets the focus where you need it. Chris

In the days when folding cameas were very popular one could buy stand-alone rangefinders that woud go into the accessory shoe on top of the camera. To make a negative you would first use the rangefinder to find the distance, then make the adjustment on the lens. Many years ago I used one of these stand-alone rangefinders on a Kodak Tourist II. It was a very practical system, and in some ways more reliable than coupled rangefinders.

The two Russian Moscow 4 and Moscow 5 folders that I own are all very good performers. I would probably use them more but for the little squinty viewfinder, a plague that seems to infect all of the older folders. I have a couple of Leitz type universal finders and have considered mounting them on the Moscow 5 folder, but to do so I would have to put an accessory shoe on top since this camera does not have one. Just curious if anyone else has ever modified one of their folders tio use a better bright line finder?

Sandy King

Alex Hawley · Oct 5, 2006

Sandy, I've noticed a couple accessory rangefingers on the auction site. Sounds like it would be worth having one.

Bromo33333 · Oct 5, 2006

cdholden said:
As a rule, I avoid the Agfa cameras. All the older ones I've had without recent service have damaged/deteriorated bellows and/or a frozen front lens element... sticks so that it won't move.
Best of luck to those who find and enjoy folding cameras. I'll be taking my Bessa II off to northeast OK this weekend for a visit with family and friends and to snap a few more shots of a rural area before it falls prey to urban sprawl.
Chris

There is a fellow that claims to restore old Agfas (amongst others), fix the bellows, clean and overhaul the shutter and lens, etc. I think his ebay name is certo6, and he has a website that more or less says the same thing, though he resores the things himself.

I have never done business with him so have no first hand experience, so YMMV.

Starcorps330 · Oct 27, 2023

Great conversation! Could draw lots from the camera recommendations.

Recently got a Bessa I and a Super Ikonta 531 A with 7cm 3.5.

I'll love to add the Franka Solidas, that I did not see mentioned here.

I absolutely adore its lens characteristics.
Can't wait to get mine in the mail. They don't have a lot of features, but there is some with uncoupled rangefinder.

Long time lurker
Finally got around to making an account.
Greets Jakob

bimmey · Oct 28, 2023

I bought an Iskra 2 from Oleg at OK Vintage camera. He serviced it before shipping and it's worked well for the past four years. Although I'm easy with it the camera seems a little delicate. But for what I payed for it it's a great performer.

GregY · Oct 28, 2023

I've become a fan of the Voigtlander Perkeo ll. It's small, light & the Color-Skopar lens is gem. It came with the lenshood. I've found a yellow filter & bought an auxilliary rangefinder. I've been very happy with the results.
(iphone photo of 11x14" print)

guangong · Oct 28, 2023

I use ZI Super Ikonta A, Super Ikonta B, Fuji GF 670 and Makina 67. The Zeiss cameras are no lightweights, reflecting their rugged construction. Built to outlast the pyramids. I tried 6x9 format, but just not for me.

DWThomas · Oct 28, 2023

Anyone just picking up this thread might want to check out two more recent and extensive threads on MF folders:

Sharpest 120 Folder?

Share what you shot with a pocket folding cameras 6x6,6x7 and 6x9!

I have a Perkeo II (6x6) and an Ercona II (6x9) in my collection of gear.

MF Folders Worth Having

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Sharpest 120 Folder?​

Share what you shot with a pocket folding cameras 6x6,6x7 and 6x9!​

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Sharpest 120 Folder?

Share what you shot with a pocket folding cameras 6x6,6x7 and 6x9!