MF 6x9 folding RF Rodenstock Clarovid I -- anything else I should be looking at?

henryvk · Mar 1, 2021

Hi everyone,

I picked up this RF folding camera last year. I confirmed that the bellows didn't have light leaks, no moving parts were stuck and the shutter fired at all speeds, also took the lens apart, which had a lot of haze on the center element, cleaned all the elements and put them back together.

I ran out of time to work on the camera so I gave it to a reputable local repair shop that offers service for folders. They sat on it forever but eventually called telling me to pick the camera up. The guy there told me it was "beyond repair" and I should put it on display and forget about shooting it. When I asked what exactly was wrong he mumbled something about the shutter and there being no replacement parts for such an old camera and how I should get a later one from the 50s... it was a bit odd because he didn't answer my questions and I got the impression he didn't care to discuss it any further. So I left, puzzled.

Anyway. I tried to adjust this camera to the best of my humble abilities:

checked lens collimation using an SLR + hair across film plane => infinity focus is spot on
calibrated the rangefinder = accurate at all distances. The RF image is pretty faint, so I put a piece of black tape in the other RF window for contrast. Now it shows up fine.
checked if lens is parallel to film plane; same as collimation but with hair in each corner => everything is in focus at infinity across the film plane. I just very carefully adjusted the lens standard. (Might repeat this to make sure it doesn't get bent out of shape again)
checked focus vs. rangefinder at 1m with ground glass => this one's iffy since I don't have a proper lupe... it looks okay but hard to say, honestly.
cleaned viewfinder/rangefinder lenses + mirror + tiny bit of lubrication on RF cam, moving parts with Ballistol (gun oil).
cleaned and lubricated the stud for the rangefinder adjustment (threaded rod underneath the distance scale).
cleaned the film compartment (the camera has a big old pressure plate.. on my Voigtländer Bessa I carefully sealed this off with strips light seal sticky foam; considering doing that here too).

I didn't do anything with the shutter. It fires at all speeds and even the slow speeds seem okay, but I have no way of testing for accuracy. Aperture blades move smoothly and are free of oil or dust

In essence: Is there anything else I should do before trying a test roll? There's other places that could service the shutter (or the whole camera) or, worst case, there's other shutters that could be used for replacement.

Donald Qualls · Mar 1, 2021

In my experience, if the slow speeds seem okay, it's worth shooting a test roll. Negative film has enough latitude that even if the shutter is off by a whole stop, it'll usually produce usable negatives.

cramej · Mar 1, 2021

henryvk said:
I gave it to a reputable local repair shop that offers service for folders. They sat on it forever but eventually called telling me to pick the camera up. The guy there told me it was "beyond repair" and I should put it on display and forget about shooting it. When I asked what exactly was wrong he mumbled something about the shutter and there being no replacement parts for such an old camera and how I should get a later one from the 50s... it was a bit odd because he didn't answer my questions and I got the impression he didn't care to discuss it any further.

And your reputable repair shop is now a not-so-reputable shop. You already know it works and he straight up lied to you. They didn't do squat with it while they had it and were just trying to give you a story to cover the fact they really just didn't want to (or couldn't) work on it. Every single instance I've had with businesses who throw some BS at me is really covering up that they don't want to do whatever it is I'm asking. They don't get my business again. I go back to places that will work with me and give their expertise on the matter.

A lot of shutters don't have parts available any longer. If we did what the shop suggested, we may as well throw away 99.9% of the cameras in existence.

ic-racer · Mar 1, 2021

I gave it to a reputable local repair shop

What did you want them to do to it? If there is nothing wrong with it, nice that he gave it back without charging you money.

hsandler · Mar 1, 2021

I owned one of these. Ysar lens is really good, but it’s worth getting a lens hood.

henryvk · Mar 2, 2021

Donald Qualls said:
In my experience, if the slow speeds seem okay, it's worth shooting a test roll. Negative film has enough latitude that even if the shutter is off by a whole stop, it'll usually produce usable negatives.

Thanks, I'll keep that in mind. Maybe doing some exposures at 1 sec with a tripod will also give me a better idea of whether the slow speeds are accurate at all.

cramej said:
And your reputable repair shop is now a not-so-reputable shop. You already know it works and he straight up lied to you. They didn't do squat with it while they had it and were just trying to give you a story to cover the fact they really just didn't want to (or couldn't) work on it. Every single instance I've had with businesses who throw some BS at me is really covering up that they don't want to do whatever it is I'm asking. They don't get my business again. I go back to places that will work with me and give their expertise on the matter.

A lot of shutters don't have parts available any longer. If we did what the shop suggested, we may as well throw away 99.9% of the cameras in existence.

I guess I was just really surprised that a shop that's been doing repairs for 60 years would be so unprofessional. To be truthful: they are very snooty and I wasn't really motivated to go back there on that alone.

ic-racer said:
What did you want them to do to it? If there is nothing wrong with it, nice that he gave it back without charging you money.

Basically everything that I ended up doing myself plus check the shutter speeds. What puzzled me is just that they specifically said "this camera is beyond repair and it's never gonna work." Either they never even bothered to look at it or they know even less than I do.

hsandler said:
I owned one of these. Ysar lens is really good, but it’s worth getting a lens hood.

Thanks, that's good to hear. I just bought a lens hood

Alex Varas · Mar 2, 2021

I had this camera with a Trinar lens, what I didn’t like much was the pressure plate and how the film laid, to my opinion I have seen better designs.

Everything you have done seems you have a camera ready for the test roll, I would watch the rollers where the film goes that they roll freely and they are smooth so they don’t scratch the emulsion.

Regarding your camera repair shop... no words...

I hope you like your camera more than I liked mine, if everything is ok you have a killer 6x9!

henryvk · Mar 2, 2021

alexvaras said:
I had this camera with a Trinar lens, what I didn’t like much was the pressure plate and how the film laid, to my opinion I have seen better designs.

Everything you have done seems you have a camera ready for the test roll, I would watch the rollers where the film goes that they roll freely and they are smooth so they don’t scratch the emulsion.

Regarding your camera repair shop... no words...

I hope you like your camera more than I liked mine, if everything is ok you have a killer 6x9!

I hadn't thought of the rollers until now but I cleaned them and it turns out one has a slight kink. Probably negligible, though I wonder how it got bent out of shape.

The design is definitely not perfect. I have a pre-war Bessa 1 that has a better pressure plate and overall nicer finish. Oh well, that's why I have ten cameras instead of just one: none of them are perfect.

Thanks for the pointers, everybody!

Bill Burk · Mar 2, 2021

You can test the shutter speeds to a fair degree with a phone app. Real good for the slow speeds. Just write down the speeds that you do get and keep those notes handy (I would put a discreet sticker on the bed near the front.) There’s lots of ways to test shutter speed. The best way to test high speeds involve film, sensitometry and densitometry.

Then when you know some of your real shutter speeds use them instead of the nominal speeds

Donald Qualls · Mar 2, 2021

henryvk said:
Maybe doing some exposures at 1 sec with a tripod will also give me a better idea of whether the slow speeds are accurate at all.

The beauty of a shutter that has speeds down to 1/2 or 1 seconds is that you don't need to expose film to check if it's accurate. You can compare by ear against a known good shutter (one in an SLR, perhaps) and know to far better than a stop -- 1/3 stop is about the worst a 1 second shutter can be without you noticing it -- where it takes half a stop or more on negative film to see a difference, even in the negative. And generally, if the 1, 1/2, and 1/5 are good, the rest will be fine. The highest speed (especially if faster than 1/250) will almost always be a little slow, but even then, usually still within a half stop (for 1/250, a half stop would still be around 1/200).

Put another way, with leaf shutters, you'll have trouble with the slow speeds long before you'll see a problem with the middle speeds, and the top speeds will always be slow.

henryvk · Mar 3, 2021

Bill Burk said:
You can test the shutter speeds to a fair degree with a phone app.

Thanks, I went ahead and did just that!

Donald Qualls said:
The beauty of a shutter that has speeds down to 1/2 or 1 seconds is that you don't need to expose film to check if it's accurate. You can compare by ear against a known good shutter (one in an SLR, perhaps) and know to far better than a stop -- 1/3 stop is about the worst a 1 second shutter can be without you noticing it -- where it takes half a stop or more on negative film to see a difference, even in the negative.

Best I can tell, 1 sec, 1/2 sec and 1/5 sec are off by just under 1/3 of a stop. I think I'll live with that.

I really appreciate the input on shutter speeds and the relative effect on exposure.

Donald Qualls · Mar 3, 2021

Now, of course, you need to expose some film and post the results here.

JPD · Mar 3, 2021

From your description there seems to be nothing to worry about, and the camera is ready for use. At least ready for a test roll.

If the longer shutter speeds are a little bit too long it's more of a bonus than a problem with negative film anyway, since you'll get little better shadow detail. These Rodenstock cameras were made by Welta, with small differencies from Welta's own line of cameras, and of course with Rodenstock's own lenses.

henryvk · Jun 14, 2021

Alrighty, here's some pictures finally.

This last one was taken on a sunny spring day without yellow filter and lens hood. Definitely shows.

Donald Qualls · Jun 14, 2021

You might also have a pinhole in the bellows, based on that last image...

henryvk · Jun 15, 2021

Ah. That does look very fuzzy for a flare. I will find somewhere darker than my bathroom to check the bellows again.

I'm extremely happy with this test roll. Embarrassingly, this was my first time using either a filter or a lens hood and they really helped the camera make the grade.
Oh, and I forgot to mention another thing: the Clarovid only has a shutter release right on the shutter and it's a weird downward tilting one, so I wanted somewhere to "hang" the cable release. My friend has a lathe and made a mount for me and also cut the threaded holes to attach it:

MF 6x9 folding RF Rodenstock Clarovid I -- anything else I should be looking at?

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