Medium Format Workout with the RB67

dugrant153 · Oct 5, 2016

So after purchasing the RB67... well, it's definitely a heavy sucker. I have recently also learned that I'm the kind of person who can't really work with the flipped image when looking into a waist level finder. Therefore, I needed to put the RB67 prism finder, which weighs probably as much as one of my Sigma lenses.
Now that it's awkward to hold steady, I also added on a flash grip that I found......

Total weight: 8 pounds, 11 oz. Congrats to me. I'm photographing with a very large newborn

To compare: Canon 1NRS + Sigma 24mm F1.4 Art lens = 4 pounds.
To compare: Fuji XT10 + 35mm F1.4 lens = weightless.

Anyways, despite the weight, I'm thoroughly enjoying the challenge of this camera and slowly molding it to something that I would want to work with. Got back a few images and a number of them don't really work as well as I'd hoped (difficulty composing with the flipped image... just the way my mind works I guess) but the ones that did work out... oh wow.... 6x7.

Curious to know what everyone else is hucking around. I'm hearing the gym call me

Stephen Weston · Oct 5, 2016

Nothing like that thats for sure. I was last using my ETRSI with 75 and 40mm lens AE prism and spare back. Probably still lighter than your baby

Kirks518 · Oct 5, 2016

The weight and bulk of the RB has caused me to grab either my M645 1000S, or my C330. The RB comes out pretty infrequently, since I'm not one who packs light typically. When I do bring the RB, I think through everything I expect to encounter, and what I'll want/need, and pack as sparingly as I can. i try to keep it at body with lens, and 2 other lenses at the most. I also try to bring no more then 2 total backs (1 B&W, 1 color), I use the WLF over the Prism 2, but I do bring a grip. My goal is to keep the entire kit under 20lbs.

The right/left thing is something you get used to, just need to use it more, and it won't trip you out.

On one of my first outings with a WLF, my daughter and I went to the Sunshine Skyway bridge to shoot some photos, and for me to play with the camera. I was sitting on the railing, as was she, and as I'm looking through the WLF, she moved off the railing onto the walkway, which in the WLF, looked like she was going into the drink. My reaction had me almost going over in an attempt to save her, but as soon as I took my eye away from the WLF my brain realized what was happening. I seriously had one of those moments when all the blood drains from you and a wave of panic comes over you. Freaked me out. I think now, everytime as I'm putting my eye(s) to the WLF, that plays in my head, and my brain adjusts to the right/left inversion.

Theo Sulphate · Oct 5, 2016

The RB67 prism on your camera is like a small car. I think it's made from tank armor.

So, I walk around with my RB67 and just use the waist level finder. I'm usually photographing landscapes or city scenes that don't move.

flavio81 · Oct 5, 2016

dugrant153 said:
So after purchasing the RB67... well, it's definitely a heavy sucker.(...)

Kirks518 said:
The weight and bulk of the RB

Man up, people. It isn't THAT heavy.
I've walked around the city with the 90mm and the RB67 hanging on me. 3 hours walkaround time. No problem. I'm no bodybuilder.

dugrant153 said:
So after purchasing the RB67... well, it's definitely a heavy sucker. I have recently also learned that I'm the kind of person who can't really work with the flipped image when looking into a waist level finder.

Yes you can. It's really easy. You'll get to it.
You don't need the prism. You don't need the flash grip either. You can hold it steady without those accesories, just CRADLE the camera with both of your palms. The right palm towards the front of the camera, the left palm below the center of the camera, the left fingers grabbing the left focus wheel.

Note that there are two identical versions of the 90/3.8C lens, and one is significantly lighter than the other (i own both such creatures).

Alan Klein · Oct 5, 2016

I couldn't deal with the waist level finder (WLF). So I got the eyelevel viewfinder and didn't look back. I do carry the WLF in the camera bag when I need to be low to the ground and the eye level viewfinder just won't work.

film_man · Oct 5, 2016

I had an RB and in the end sold it because I thought the weight was a bit much. Replaced it with various things and now have a C330s. Well...in the end, the weight is nothing if you go back and look at the photos. I'm looking to buy another RB/RZ.

Anyway, when I had the RB I tried various combinations, with the prism, with a grip, with both on, with nothing on... In the end various solutions would work depending what I wanted to do. One was to get the original Mamiya strap (better than the optech) and use the camera plain (no prism/grip). That was the best way for me if I wanted a WLF. With the prism it was more comfortable with the grip (I had the adjustable one) but in the end I ended up leaving the grip in favour of a nice big bag (thinktank retrospective 30). If I want to shoot, camera comes out, I shoot, then goes back in. This issue with the grip is that once you add the prism the weight is just too much given the pivot point for the wrist so you *will* want to put it in a bag. But with a grip and prism on, there ain't no bag to take it. Overall I'd say I used it mostly with the prism, I just find it a nicer way for shooting people (ie you don't look up their noses).

Man, I got to say, I've owned a Bronica ETRS, SQB, a few Hasselblads (including a H1), a Mamiya 6 and now a C330s but when I go back and look at the photos, the RB stands out. The 'blad has its own amazing look but never liked shooting it (yes it's lighter but...). So yeah I'm getting another RB and weight be damned. Maybe I'll try the RZ this time, it is about 10% lighter. Which I'm sure won't make any difference

cb1 · Oct 5, 2016

I have the earlier prism, and boy does it make it a large camera! But I carry it around no problem. I found that when using the prism, the hand grip comes off. I like using the grip with the WLF.
But whoa, that prism is huge, it looks like it came off a cold war era soviet tank. (the early one, not the lower streamlined one)

flavio81 · Oct 5, 2016

film_man said:
I had an RB and in the end sold it because I thought the weight was a bit much. Replaced it with various things and now have a C330s. Well...in the end, the weight is nothing if you go back and look at the photos. I'm looking to buy another RB/RZ.

Anyway, when I had the RB I tried various combinations, with the prism, with a grip, with both on, with nothing on... In the end various solutions would work depending what I wanted to do. One was to get the original Mamiya strap (better than the optech) and use the camera plain (no prism/grip). That was the best way for me if I wanted a WLF. With the prism it was more comfortable with the grip (I had the adjustable one) but in the end I ended up leaving the grip in favour of a nice big bag (thinktank retrospective 30). If I want to shoot, camera comes out, I shoot, then goes back in. This issue with the grip is that once you add the prism the weight is just too much given the pivot point for the wrist so you *will* want to put it in a bag. But with a grip and prism on, there ain't no bag to take it. Overall I'd say I used it mostly with the prism, I just find it a nicer way for shooting people (ie you don't look up their noses).

Man, I got to say, I've owned a Bronica ETRS, SQB, a few Hasselblads (including a H1), a Mamiya 6 and now a C330s but when I go back and look at the photos, the RB stands out. The 'blad has its own amazing look but never liked shooting it (yes it's lighter but...). So yeah I'm getting another RB and weight be damned. Maybe I'll try the RZ this time, it is about 10% lighter. Which I'm sure won't make any difference

Amen brother!! Keep on preaching!! Hallelujah!! We need more like you!

M Carter · Oct 5, 2016

I don't find the weight too ridiculous, but I don't go on 5-hour hikes with it. Shot a lot of catalog stuff handheld in the 90's with the 80mm and the waist-level. I used the prism often on a camera stand, but I found I needed a focusing light (600 watt open-faced theatrical with a foot switch to kick it on when I wanted to confirm focus). The prism seems about 2-stops darker to me.

Recently I tossed it in the car for a road trip in the Texas country, my Mrs. did a yoga workshop at a resort in the sticks. Spotted a ruined diner, realized I forgot my meter, so I guessed a bit. 65mm, handheld. Lith printed at 16x20 and damn, it's that RB look - almost 3D. Really love that camera, the steel & leather retro look and zero batteries is just icing on the cake.

Alan Gales · Oct 5, 2016

Without a lens my Wehman 8x10 weighs 8.7 pounds so the same as your RB. Of course I can't shoot my Wehman handheld.

I used to own an RZ with "L" grip and both finders. I hated the prism finder because it was so heavy. RB's and RZ's are great cameras if you don't mind the weight.

Kirks518 · Oct 5, 2016

flavio81 said:
Man up, people. It isn't THAT heavy.
I've walked around the city with the 90mm and the RB67 hanging on me. 3 hours walkaround time. No problem. I'm no bodybuilder.

Lugging around an RB kit in Florida summers (summer is 11 months of the year here) is what kills. In 90°F and 80%+ humidity it's tough to carry a Minox!

pthornto · Oct 5, 2016

Yep it's heavy. But I agree with Flavio above...the WLF takes some getting used to but it is worth it! I started out in medium format with a rolleiflex and shot probably 20 rolls or so before it started to feel somewhat intuitive to move the camera to frame up a photo. The RB is great because it allows you to see a bit outside the 6x7 frame (someone said it really is a 8x8 camera that you rotate the back to make the appropriate crop) and the focusing screen is big and comparatively bright. I also like the WLF because it somehow makes what I'm viewing a bit more abstract and somewhat disconnected from reality. So I would say, don't be discouraged and give the WLF a bit more of a try.

Now I'm learning how to grab pictures of my kids (5 and 1 years old) and I'm basically taking it out in pretty good light, stopping down, and maintaining focus as best as possible by moving forward and backward with my subject...not easy but really great when it works out. Definitely makes beautiful negatives that flatter my abilities to print......

chromacomaphoto · Oct 5, 2016

Kirks518 said:
Lugging around an RB kit in Florida summers (summer is 11 months of the year here) is what kills. In 90°F and 80%+ humidity it's tough to carry a Minox!

+1, this. In hot sticky Thailand, it's reasonable size and weight Rolleiflexes all the way for me. I do love the RB/RZ's though. Was offered one NOS brand new in box at a dealer here in Bangkok about five or six years ago for a steal. I sometimes think about whether or not I should have snapped it up. Honestly can't imagine being happier with anything in MF film more than my TLR's though to be honest.

paul ron · Oct 5, 2016

when you grow up n get stronger... get that prism. you'll enjoy it that much more.

MattKing · Oct 5, 2016

One of the things that a waist level finder does for you is teach you to do more of your composing with your eyes on the subject and less with your eyes on the finder .

It is a learnable skill though.

For me, the Mamiya left hand trigger grips are essential when I want to use the camera hand held.

markbarendt · Oct 5, 2016

dugrant153 said:
but the ones that did work out... oh wow....

Yep.

Time and practice takes care of the rest.

I find a monopod helps.

mshchem · Oct 6, 2016

dugrant153 said:
So after purchasing the RB67... well, it's definitely a heavy sucker. I have recently also learned that I'm the kind of person who can't really work with the flipped image when looking into a waist level finder. Therefore, I needed to put the RB67 prism finder, which weighs probably as much as one of my Sigma lenses.
Now that it's awkward to hold steady, I also added on a flash grip that I found......

Total weight: 8 pounds, 11 oz. Congrats to me. I'm photographing with a very large newborn

To compare: Canon 1NRS + Sigma 24mm F1.4 Art lens = 4 pounds.
To compare: Fuji XT10 + 35mm F1.4 lens = weightless.

Anyways, despite the weight, I'm thoroughly enjoying the challenge of this camera and slowly molding it to something that I would want to work with. Got back a few images and a number of them don't really work as well as I'd hoped (difficulty composing with the flipped image... just the way my mind works I guess) but the ones that did work out... oh wow.... 6x7.

Curious to know what everyone else is hucking around. I'm hearing the gym call me

Try the plastic "chimney " finder it's very light and is easier to use than the waist level in bright light. I have an RZ with the grip, waist level works great for me. When I use the prism it has to be on a tripod just to heavy.
Best Regards Mike

MattKing · Oct 6, 2016

I have a PD Magnifying Hood that is what I think Mike is describing above as the "plastic chimney finder". It is a more recent version of the chimney finder which includes a silicon cell 3 degree spot meter and a variable diopter. It is great for bright conditions. The only problem with it is that because it doesn't collapse, it is quite bulky in the bag.

flavio81 · Oct 6, 2016

mshchem said:
Try the plastic "chimney " finder it's very light and is easier to use than the waist level in bright light. I have an RZ with the grip, waist level works great for me. When I use the prism it has to be on a tripod just to heavy.
Best Regards Mike

I have the chimney finder with CdS spot meter and find it too bulky compared to the WLF, so at the end i've settled with the WLF.

However, i think the sports finder should be wonderful, even better.

flavio81 · Oct 6, 2016

Kirks518 said:
Lugging around an RB kit in Florida summers (summer is 11 months of the year here) is what kills. In 90°F and 80%+ humidity it's tough to carry a Minox!

Yes, i understand. Similar to the worst days here in Lima (>95% relative humidity). But hooray for workout for photographers!!

flavio81 · Oct 6, 2016

pthornto said:
Now I'm learning how to grab pictures of my kids (5 and 1 years old) and I'm basically taking it out in pretty good light, stopping down, and maintaining focus as best as possible by moving forward and backward with my subject...not easy but really great when it works out. Definitely makes beautiful negatives that flatter my abilities to print......

Yes, i think this is the main problem with 6x7 medium format... DOF is very narrow.

Try using HP5 pushed to 1600. In 6x7 it looks really, really good (even in 6x6), especially if developed with Microphen.
Resulting grain is smaller than using a ISO 400 HP5 on 35mm camera, sharpness and definition better.
Shadow detail is still good enough, believe it or not.

HP5 @ 1600 with the Mamiya RB67 opens up a lot of possibilities.

I always use that camera handheld, by the way.

dugrant153 · Oct 6, 2016

I did try to use a Yashicatmat 124G and the square format was maybe just too unfamiliar with me to use the way I wanted (compositionally, it was a lot of effort to try to make it look the way I wanted... or I'd have to crop it in post). Even using the WLF for a while, I just found it a lot of extra mind work to try to re-orient the view as I'd compose in the finder but with the left/right reversed, the image looks "off" when the picture is taken... maybe it's from using all these cameras with TTL views. I guess I like WYSIWYG (what you see is what you get).

I saw the chimney hood and did consider. It's surprisingly brighter but again, the left-right thing.

Currently have it setup with prism finder (non-metered, the old chunky one) and an old flash grip. The grip really helps to stabilize it like a video rig so I can slam the prism finder into my face for further stabilization...

markbarendt · Oct 6, 2016

dugrant153 said:
The grip really helps to stabilize it like a video rig so I can slam the prism finder into my face for further stabilization...

Oh yeah,

Surprisingly I found that removing the hard rubber/plastic eye cup reduced the pain considerably.

flavio81 · Oct 6, 2016

dugrant153 said:
I did try to use a Yashicatmat 124G and the square format was maybe just too unfamiliar with me to use the way I wanted (compositionally, it was a lot of effort to try to make it look the way I wanted... or I'd have to crop it in post). Even using the WLF for a while, I just found it a lot of extra mind work to try to re-orient the view as I'd compose in the finder but with the left/right reversed, the image looks "off" when the picture is taken... maybe it's from using all these cameras with TTL views. I guess I like WYSIWYG (what you see is what you get).

My suggestion is to mark the cropping for vertical 6x4.5 and horizontal 6x4.5 on the ground glass of your TLR. In this way you can know what the end framing would be.

On the RB67 i have the 6x4.5 film back which comes with a 6x4.5 mask on the viewfinder that does the same. It is very useful.
And with 6x6, unlike a 6x4.5 camera, you don't have to tilt anything to switch between landscape and portrait.

I like the square (1:1) aspect ratio, so my 6x6 TLRs are used at square formats most often.

markbarendt said:
Oh yeah,

Surprisingly I found that removing the hard rubber/plastic eye cup reduced the pain considerably.

Thanks for this. Mine came without the eyecup and i was kind of dissapointed not to have the cup.

Medium Format Workout with the RB67

dugrant153

Stephen Weston

Kirks518

Theo Sulphate

flavio81

Alan Klein

film_man

cb1

flavio81

M Carter

Alan Gales

Kirks518

pthornto

chromacomaphoto

paul ron

MattKing

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markbarendt

mshchem

MattKing

Moderator

flavio81

flavio81

flavio81

dugrant153

markbarendt

flavio81

Medium Format Workout with the RB67

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