Medium format on a bike.

olleorama · Feb 24, 2010

I have competed in both road events and time trials. And toured a bit in europe (benelux, germany and france). Although my only input have been quite slim.

One thing about bamboo, there is a possibility to make good rigid frames with it, and that is to mix bamboo fibers with carbon fibers and make a composite frame. That very feature about bamboo being flexible will also be its largest caveat. It will lead away effect from your body, the engine, into flexing instead of getting it were you want it, into the hubs. You will loose unecessary amounts of energy, every turn of the pedals. It's the same with suspension. If your going on paved roads, steel will give just the right amount of flex, with minimum effect loss.

What will happen if you crash your bamboo frame? Is it repairable?

I wouldn't use a rohloff hub for several reasons, I have tried one, didn't like it at all. And they are not very efficient. A derailer system is efficient and very reliable too.

Andy K · Feb 24, 2010

Bamboo bikes have been around for a while. It is the durability on a trek like the OP's that comes into question.

http://www.calfeedesign.com/bamboo.htm#

KenR · Feb 24, 2010

I think you are better off operating under the KISS principle and sticking to self supporting equipment (two Leica bodies - one for color and one B&W or a similar setup). With this, if there is a problem with one, you can use the lenses etc. from the other and still have a record of your trip. Or (I know the APUG gods will strike me down) take 2 high end digital P&S cameras (G11 etc.) so that once again, you have a backup. I think you may be underestimating the need to keep the weight down, the rigors of the journey on your equipment and the ability to have any repairs done in the out of the way places that you'll be in. By taking backups you won't be left with nothing at the end.

Venchka · Feb 24, 2010

DF,

I didn't ride 1,000 in a month. Does 750 miles in under 2 weeks count? In a circle from SLC airport to West Yellowstone, MT and return count? Crossing the Continental Divide 3 times in less than 24 hours? Self contained. And the San Juan Skyway Loop, Durango-Ouray-Durago. I have also ridden in Centurys. All of this on pavement. The route in question boggles the mind. Prudhoe Bay to Fairbanks is daunting. Peru might as well be on the Dark Side of the Moon. But I'm just chicken.

For simplicity & price: 2-3 Minolta or Yashica TLRs would be good. One on the road and 1-2 in reserve to be mailed out if #1 breaks.

Cut the extension cord. Leave the DLSR at home. When the sensor gets filthy, "Who you gonna call? Dustbusters?"

Steel is the Third World bicycle material of choice for a reason: It takes a pounding and keeps on keeping on.

McRoo · Feb 24, 2010

Hey guys, always great to see new posts every time I log in!

The medium format cam I will be taking with me is the secondarily camera on my trip. Main machine will be the DSLR since I need/want to make blog posts regularly and because in the end, I am most at easy with the digital format. Taking solely analogue equipment is not really an option for me. I am really looking for a medium camera that can be used easily, is light weight and rigid. Really, it is all as new to me as it is for you guys. I don't rule out the possibility that I have to leave some stuff behind at some point.

That also goes for the bamboo bike. So far we had positive feedback from the people who have experience with bamboo bicycles. Andy_K mentioned Craig Calfee. This is actually the guy we are going to buy the bamboo frames from. He is quite positive on are changes to do this trip on bamboo bicycles. Also reassuring input from two guys who cycle bamboo bikes off road regularly.
It is the people who don't have experience with this material that keep pointing on the possibility of failure; "What, on bamboo bicycles!? You are never going to make it.''

Thing is, nobody really know what will happen. This is part of the excitement and part of the deal for me. Sure, there is a chance the bike will brake, sure there are doubts. But isn't this the same with any kind of new thing? I remember all the discussions around the emergence of the digital camera. Look now, it is more mainstream than the analogue format (Oh, did I say this on APUG!?) Back to bamboo bikes. They are definitely repairable. Plus, the frames come with a 5 year warranty. We should be fine. If the shit really hits the fan we can always purchase a 'conventional' frame and continue our journey like 'normal people' do.

Back to the camera's, of these four cam's which do you think is strongest and can handle 'abuse' the best?
Hasselblad 50* variant
Rolleiflex variant
Mamiya 6
Yashica TLR variant
I have a feeling the machine I am going to take with me is one of these four... Max funds available around $1000 (film not included).
The biggest advantage of the Hassy is ofc the possibility to bring an additional back with color or more light sensitive film..

Poisson Du Jour · Feb 24, 2010

df cardwell said:
However much I'd LOVE to drive this off topic,
we can invite McRoo to talk about this in the Cyclists social group.

Out of sheer perversity,
how many posting advice here, on carrying a camera on a bike,
let alone on a trip of this magnitude, have ever ridden, say, a hundred miles in a week,
or - more to the point- a thousand miles in a month.

Who has tried taking a picture after riding 50 miles,
or who has even ridden a bike with 30 pounds of stuff on it
20 miles up the side of a big hill ?

This isn't a ride in the park, it is an expedition where the notion of "road" is amorphous,
and, I can't help it, the thing that would worry me isn't the bamboo, it's the carbon fiber and epoxy holding it together.

Not a particularly sane suggestion to think people can ride a 1000 miles in a month.
I'm no couch potato! I ride 200km a week at this time on a carbon fibre/alloy composite (8kg) running 180psi silca tyres, no luggage, just very high speed road cycling now. I often stop to chat with long-haul touring cyclists on Victoria's iconic Great Ocean Road (not particularly safe for any cyclist), the last recently from Korea. Other posts here mention New Zealand. NZ is the ultimate proving ground for any bicycle and rider (I circumnavigated North Island, South Island in 1986 in 2 months carrying a Nikon F3HP with motordrive, Olympus XA bouncing up and down in a huge handlebar bag. "That was then...".

I'm more at ease that McRoo intends to use a BOB trailer and relatively light-load the bamboo frame with the contingency of switching to a conventional frame if disaster strikes. This is much better than lumping everything on it and touch wood hope it holds. Not to say a BOB trailer fully laden is easy going!! [QUOTE McRoo] there is a chance the bike will brake [/QUOTE]. Yee-ha!! I should bloody well hope it does slow down, son!!

Andy K · Feb 24, 2010

Poisson Du Jour said:
Not a particularly sane suggestion to think people can ride a 1000 miles in a month.

Why? That's only 35 miles a day.

Poisson Du Jour · Feb 24, 2010

Every day Andy? I'd throw in a 3-4 days off the bike in a beautiful place (I have a weakness for beaches!). Maybe, too, a bushwalk (I think I saw recently ORTLIEB panniers that morph into a rucksack!!). I never rushed in my touring days; at it its most common, a 301km ride took me 12 days one day because I was prone to exploring lots of places as I went along — on foot! These guys are travelling through some of the world's most bewitchingly beautiful (and hellishly tough) places... seemingly with an itinerary to which they need to stick time-wise, but goodness, for the rest of us, keep it sane and simple and 'feet up' often and well.

PS: Don't you use km over there??

Andy K · Feb 24, 2010

Come on! 35 miles a day for a month. Anyone could do that. Even if they took seven hours a day to do it, they'd be strolling it at 5mph! I could easily ride 35 miles in a little over two hours without breaking a sweat!

olleorama · Feb 24, 2010

I agree with andy K. I used to do that commuting to my old job, and then ride in the evenings with my club.

2F/2F · Feb 24, 2010

I routinely ride 26 miles on a mountain bike, poorly geared for the street, on the sidewalks in L.A. city streets in two hours, give or take ten minutes. The street is even quicker, but I refuse to take it on a mountain bike in L.A. 35 miles a day on a road bike, even with long stops, is a piece of cake. Over the course of the trip, there will be days you ride very few miles, and days you ride very many miles...but to say that an average of 35 a day is not reasonable is crazy to me.

The thing I'd worry about most is having a seat that is the height of comfort.

Andy K · Feb 24, 2010

Poisson Du Jour said:
PS: Don't you use km over there??

No we do our distances in English, not that foreign French stuff.

Poisson Du Jour · Feb 24, 2010

Had to get the iPhone out to to the imperial conversion (wonders of iPhones....). That's 56km. In very hilly terrain? I couldn't do it several days in a row in 1986 with a front/rear touring load that's what I'm focusing on. It's slow, tedious going, like pushing a stubborn mule in the backside one centimetre at the time.

Yes, 56km or even 166km with long uphill climbs (and the screaming downers), is a piece of cake for me too, on the road bike with nothing carried but water, but not with a huge, heavy touring load in the BOB trailer McRoo is carting is going to be a real test (I think the standard BOB trailer has a load limit of 60kg unless the base is reinforced??). The old saying "take one day at a time" comes to mind. THere is more to tour cycling than spinning pedals.

I'm not one given to fancy saddles. The less saddle there is the better (I'm all padded up in lyrcra, remember! )

Poisson Du Jour · Feb 24, 2010

I'm not in France, Andy, I'm in Australia!

2F/2F · Feb 24, 2010

For every uphill, there is a downhill at some time on the trip. It all averages out. Of course it will be slower than normal...but 35 mpd is an easy average to make.

My seat is literally a PITA, which is why I made that comment! ...and I am so given to NOTHING that I never buy an expensive bike, and never modify anything from stock. I just ride for fun and transportation. I am in no way an aficionado...but I do probably ride 100 miles a week, easily (meaning without really trying, or actually setting out to "go riding").

Andy K · Feb 24, 2010

Poisson Du Jour said:
I'm not in France, Andy, I'm in Australia!

Cents, kilometres, wine What's the difference?

Andy K · Feb 24, 2010

2F/2F said:
For every uphill, there is a downhill at some time on the trip. It all averages out. Of course it will be slower than normal...but 35 mpd is an easy average to make.

My seat is literally a PITA, which is why I made that comment! ...and I am so into NOTHING that I never buy an expensive bike, and never modify anything from stock. I just ride for fun and transportation. I am in no way an aficionado...but I do probably ride 100 miles a week, easily.

I ride Brooks. Unbeatable comfort.

Poisson Du Jour · Feb 24, 2010

Oh yes, the Brookes B52 saddle was on all of my (5) touring bikes, on all other bikes in my touring club of the day. As I went from one to the next, I took the saddle with me.
The road bike has a Fitz'ick Apero Blade, but still very comfy. McRoo is going to need a super comfy saddle for those loooong hours in the ... er, saddle...

olleorama · Feb 24, 2010

I ride brooks on my commuter. Small, hard and light weight ones on the faster bikes.

I think it is essential to prepare for a journey like this. Ride a few brevets and start riding a lot, daily. Just to get used to the position if nothing else. And toughen up the scrotum..

Poisson Du Jour · Feb 24, 2010

Andy K said:
Cents, kilometres, wine What's the difference?

The more wine, the bigger the difference!

Poisson Du Jour · Feb 24, 2010

Yes, agree with olleorama, get involved with something like AUDAX long to ultra-long distance touring (randoneés); it's presence is most prominent in Paris; we have AUDAX AUSTRALIA here running 150, 200, 300, 400, 800km then 1,000km+ rides. Long rides in hilly terrain carrying similar weight loads will highlight where any weaknesses exist (possibly the bamboo frame rear-triangle...). As I say, "ride, ride, ride 'til your rawhide shines!"

olleorama · Feb 24, 2010

Poisson Du Jour said:
Yes, agree with olleorama, get involved with something like AUDAX long to ultra-long distance touring (randoneés); it's presence is most prominent in Paris; we have AUDAX AUSTRALIA here running 150, 200, 300, 400, 800km then 1,000km+ rides. Long rides in hilly terrain carrying similar weight loads will highlight where any weaknesses exist (possibly the bamboo frame rear-triangle...). As I say, "ride, ride, ride 'til your rawhide shines!"

Unfortunately for me, everything here is flat. I think both randonné and audax riding is good preparation for a journey. Randonné in the event of something going pear shaped and someone will continue on their own.

Although, anyone can pedal along at leisure speed. It all depends on how you wanna do it.

Poisson Du Jour · Feb 24, 2010

Looky...

We're on the wrong track,
We're in the wrong gear,
You better watch out, for the Mods are near
All off-topic, akimbo and spun,
What would we say if Mods cut our fun?

Keep going... This arvo I'm off on a ride. Just waiting for the clouds to clear, the sun to come out and my togs to dry...
Maybe it is about medium format cameras. It's also about bikes. Who cares? The two are complimentary. Always have been, always will be.

olleorama · Feb 24, 2010

Poisson Du Jour said:
Looky...

We're on the wrong track,
We're in the wrong gear,
You better watch out, for the Mods are near
All off-topic, akimbo and spun,
What would we say if Mods cut our fun?

Keep going... This arvo I'm off on a ride. Just waiting for the clouds to clear, the sun to come out and my togs to dry...
Maybe it is about medium format cameras. It's also about bikes. Who cares? The two are complimentary. Always have been, always will be.

Has andys talk on wine gotten you thirsty? ...

Venchka · Feb 24, 2010

Andy K said:
Why? That's only 35 miles a day.

Even I managed to average over 150% of that figure through Utah, Wyoming & Idaho. Every day above All Category. I think my trip started above the summit of Alp d'Huez and went straight up from there. On pavement.

All bets are off on unpaved, unsurveyed, non-existent tracks.

The bamboo bikes are part of a sponsorship deal? Why else would they be included? I still have a problem with so much high tech stuff in what is supposed to be an eco-friendly, eco-awareness, Save the World endeavor.

Like I said: Get 2-3 Yashicas. 1 will probably outlive all the computer stuff. Who needs blogging anyway? And if you wish to file progress reports, say so. Blog is a made up word.

End of Rant. Venchka has left the building.

Medium format on a bike.

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