Maybe a meter in my future

HiHoSilver · Dec 18, 2015

I've used an embarassingly humble meter for the last yr - about a 1" square x 1/2" polaroid selenium cell. It reads w/in 1/2 stop or less from the meter in my Nikons & does really well. I had read that they don't meter well at low light levels & tonight I experienced that at dusk & after. I had some fast shooting to do as the rain was coming in.

Now the other meters I've read about - Gossen six digisix, sbs, the seikonics that I've seen make a point to say how low they will meter. That's nice. But I haven't seen one that illuminates the display - when its too dark to see. (scratching head as to how that makes sense). Is this common? Does anyone take night shots & use a meter, or is it all experience & WAG/SWAG? Are there meters south of the nosebleed priced seikonics that do well at night?

I'd appreciate your thoughts. I had quite a bit of fun this eve., shooting in the dark (and the rain). 'Gently dabbed the Maxwell screen dry. They're a case of wax being more costly than gold by weight (but dang, its sweet).

frank · Dec 18, 2015

If it's really dark you'll need a light to set the camera as well as read a non-illuminated meter. But it's rarely so dark that you can't see anything. I can recommend the Sekonic L308s, and for a vintage meter, the Gossen Luna Pro SBC. As a bonus, both read flash output.

I had an SBC but left it on the roof of my car after loading the camera bag in the back seat and driving away. I saw it in the rear view mirror, bouncing.
I bought another via Kijiji/Craigslist, and the seller turned out to be a nephew of a famous hockey player, Frank Mahovlich.

Poisson Du Jour · Dec 18, 2015

HiHoSilver said:
I've used an embarassingly humble meter for the last yr - about a 1" square x 1/2" polaroid selenium cell. It reads w/in 1/2 stop or less from the meter in my Nikons & does really well. I had read that they don't meter well at low light levels & tonight I experienced that at dusk & after. I had some fast shooting to do as the rain was coming in.

Now the other meters I've read about - Gossen six digisix, sbs, the seikonics that I've seen make a point to say how low they will meter. That's nice. But I haven't seen one that illuminates the display - when its too dark to see. (scratching head as to how that makes sense). Is this common? Does anyone take night shots & use a meter, or is it all experience & WAG/SWAG? Are there meters south of the nosebleed priced seikonics that do well at night?

I'd appreciate your thoughts. I had quite a bit of fun this eve., shooting in the dark (and the rain). 'Gently dabbed the Maxwell screen dry. They're a case of wax being more costly than gold by weight (but dang, its sweet).

Que??
We all had "embarrassingly humble" meters at one time or another before moving along (though some stalwarts won't do that and stick with the cutest if most unfashionable dial-and-needle meters). Most Sekonic meters (even those without an eye-watering price tag) have an automatic backlight (pretty in blue...) to illuminate the display when the meter determines that such illumination is needed. Yes, there are expensive meters, and there are inexpensive meters. But...

...If it's too dark to see, what do you think the meter will do? If the feature is there, it will light up its display, but is will very likely to politely warn you of gross under-exposure. What are/were you shooting?? I do shoot at night too, but I use Bulb (as a long exposure). You'd need a bit of ambient illumination about in your scene to make a fist of what a meter suggests (as a starting point), as opposed to what you could do without the meter.

HiHoSilver · Dec 18, 2015

Frank Thank You!
(smacks head) - of course - a light for the camera settings (I struggled to see this - this eve.). I just looked at the vids for the Seikonic (didn't see a reading for EV so dear to the old gear user). The Luna Pro SBC does have a scale for EV.

On using a light to read the meter - is it the case that I have to shield the light from the area the sensor meters (w/ a 3rd hand) so as not to corrupt the reading? 'Sorry to have really basic questions - the blad is my first non-TTL metered camera. None of the articles/vids I've seen touch on the low light use.

I appreciate your kind help.

HiHoSilver · Dec 18, 2015

Poisson Du Jour. The scene was lights across the river, w/ massive steel bridge base in front of me. I was trying to meter the bridge base, which was visible, but dark & in the shadows. If the selenium meter registered at all, I couldn't tell. The faintest reading I could see was a 1s exposure at F11. I flopped the mirror up & held the shutter open for a 2 sec. count.

frank · Dec 18, 2015

Meters usually lock in the reading after you press and let go of the meter button, so a light to read the meter is not a problem.

The LunaPro SBC/LunaPro F is powered by the common squarish 9 volt battery.

http://www.jollinger.com/photo/meters/meters/gossen_lunaprosbc.html

http://www.butkus.org/chinon/flashes_meters/luna-pro_sbc/luna-pro-3.htm

The plain LunaPro/LunaSix 3 needs mercury cells. I soldered diodes inline with the battery power wire to use modern silver cells. Does not measure flash.

http://www.jollinger.com/photo/meters/meters/gossen_lunapro.html

http://www.butkus.org/chinon/flashes_meters/gossen_luna-pro/gossen_luna-pro.htm

I like these vintage meters, but the Sekonic is smaller and new.

DWThomas · Dec 18, 2015

I just discovered reading here that my Sekonic L-508 has backlighting on the display in low light -- never realized that -- apparently I've not done much low light shooting! I'm thinking I paid around $225 for it off ePrey maybe seven years ago. Dunno if that's eye watering or not (it was a whale of a lot less than a new L-758!) I probably use my Gossen Digisix as much or more, as it's way less bulk to stick in a pocket or hang around the neck. Works fine for incident reading, doesn't do spot (or flash).

These days, one can always use a smart phone to cast a glow upon the gear -- can even use a metering app! I do remember an outdoor family event some years back that ran late. My tired old eyes had severe difficulty reading the focus scale on my Perkeo, let alone worrying about exposure -- we are spoiled a bit by many techno toys today!

Theo Sulphate · Dec 18, 2015

The Sekonic L308s is accurate and will give repeatable results. There are only two issues I have with mine:

1. It's "shutter priority". You set the shutter speed you plan to use and it'll tell you the appropriate aperture and EV. Of course, you can then use the up/down buttons to see all the other equivalent shutter/aperture combinations. However, I would've liked to have the ability to set an aperture of, say, f/3.5 for my Minox and have it give me a shutter speed.

2. The sensor (both for reflected and incident light) is facing you as you look at the display! So, what you really have to do after making your settings is turn the bloody thing around, point it, take the reading, then turn it around and look at the reading. I can't remember how many times I've taken a reading of my face by accident and wondered why the readings looked off!

Poisson Du Jour · Dec 18, 2015

HiHoSilver said:
Frank Thank You!
(smacks head) - of course - a light for the camera settings (I struggled to see this - this eve.). I just looked at the vids for the Seikonic (didn't see a reading for EV so dear to the old gear user). The Luna Pro SBC does have a scale for EV.

On using a light to read the meter - is it the case that I have to shield the light from the area the sensor meters (w/ a 3rd hand) so as not to corrupt the reading? 'Sorry to have really basic questions - the blad is my first non-TTL metered camera. None of the articles/vids I've seen touch on the low light use.

I appreciate your kind help.

The Sekonics do have a mode selection (which doubles up to do other functions too) and by dint of that, an EV scale read-out option (I occasionally use this on my L758D). Low light photography takes experience and one should never be discouraged by mistakes or stuff-ups in the course of building that experience.
As for the non-metered Hassie. Good! Funny thing that my Pentax 67 has a fully-fledged and capable TTL meter. But I can always do better multispotting than what a rudimentary meter suggests. So the Sekonic does the lion's share of work.

Of meters will automatic backlit display illumination (which depending on the manufacturer, can be red, blue, green, white, yellow...), no, there is no risk of corrupting a reading with this.

Poisson Du Jour · Dec 18, 2015

Theo Sulphate said:
The Sekonic L308s is accurate and will give repeatable results. There are only two issues I have with mine:

1. It's "shutter priority". You set the shutter speed you plan to use and it'll tell you the appropriate aperture and EV. Of course, you can then use the up/down buttons to see all the other equivalent shutter/aperture combinations. However, I would've liked to have the ability to set an aperture of, say, f/3.5 for my Minox and have it give me a shutter speed.

2. The sensor (both for reflected and incident light) is facing you as you look at the display! So, what you really have to do after making your settings is turn the bloody thing around, point it, take the reading, then turn it around and look at the reading. I can't remember how many times I've taken a reading of my face by accident and wondered why the readings looked off!

A few meters allow you to set the meter steps in 1 stop, 0.5 stop or 0.3 stop (this is a boon for photographers using e.g. print film and chrome film where known variances should be registered subtly or with more clarity). The L308 is rudimentary. With quite a few meters, you can rotate the invercone away from you if you don't wish your pretty features to be included in the summary...

Bill Burk · Dec 18, 2015

The Pentax Spotmeter V analog meter has a light. Cleverly... it only illuminates the lower four or five numbers of the scale.

HiHoSilver · Dec 18, 2015

Theo - 'just watched the vids on the 308s - says it'll do shutter or aperture priority. Apparently you highlight the aperture value using the 'mode' button & it varies the needed shutter speed.

That need to point & spin sounds like a pain.

Thank You for your help. I appreciate it.

Poisson Du Jour · Dec 18, 2015

I'm reminded that on a seaside dusk shoot earlier last week a digitally-kitted photographer approached from beind and asked me, "what's that thing you have?", pointing to the L758D illuminating (I was under the impression he was casing me to copy the scene I was making!). I explained what it was ("a programmable multispot/incident/mean-weighted averaging meter" — he looked no more than about 18 or 19...20 at most, but taller than me, so I was ... cordial). Usually it is the camera that cops the query (because it's a film camera, shock! horror!). He then suggested, if I used what was dwarfing his hands, (a Nikon D...something that was very big and chunky) "...you wouldn't need a meter". <*stiffles a guffaw*> Knowledgeable, these kids, aren't they?

HiHoSilver · Dec 18, 2015

Knowledgeable, these kids, aren't they?

I remember being omniscient once.

I'm not sure if buying used through amazon is a good idea, but a Luna Pro SBC looks like about $80. The newe

frank · Dec 18, 2015

I have a thing for meters. Here are the 3 we've talked about. I also have the venerable sekonic L398, and the small sekonic twin mate. Neither of these 2 meters read very low light. I also have the CV Meter ll which is small enough to mount on a camera accessory shoe.

6 light meters, that's not crazy, is it?

HiHoSilver · Dec 19, 2015

'Just noticed a member selling one & shot a pm his way.

Thank You, Gents for your kind help. I very much appreciate it.

frank · Dec 19, 2015

Several interesting meter choices currently in the classifieds. Hmmm.

No. Im not crazy.

Theo Sulphate · Dec 19, 2015

HiHoSilver said:
Theo - 'just watched the vids on the 308s - says it'll do shutter or aperture priority. Apparently you highlight the aperture value using the 'mode' button & it varies the needed shutter speed.

Could you post a link to the video? I've watched all the Sekonic videos and they don't show that. The instruction manual doesn't mention it either.

On Sekonic's website they have this in their FAQ:

Sekonic L-308S

Q: I am attempting to get my L-308S into aperture priority mode, but cannot. Is aperture priority possible with this meter?

A: The L-308B II and L-308S will operate only in shutter priority mode.

Had I to do it over again, I'd get a Gossen Digisix. Just turn the dial and glance at it. I'd like to know what the difference is between it and the Digisix 2. I actually prefer the first version with contrasting white and black dials rather than them both being black. The other improvement is that they should've marked seconds with an "s". They have 2 meaning 2 seconds and '2 meaning 1/2 second. I think it should be 2s being 2 seconds and 2 being 1/2 second, since that's the way it is on shutter speed dials.

I should be in charge of designing these things.

frank · Dec 19, 2015

Theo Sulphate said:
I should be in charge of designing these things.

Would you include the thermometer?

Theo Sulphate · Dec 19, 2015

Poisson Du Jour said:
"...you wouldn't need a meter"

Smug little smartasses, aren't they?

"...and when you learn more about photography, you'll know when not to use the in-camera meter."

My bet is that the firmware in his D-whatever deserves the credit for all the exposure and focusing decisions.

Poisson Du Jour · Dec 19, 2015

Theo Sulphate said:
Smug little smartasses, aren't they?

"...and when you learn more about photography, you'll know when not to use the in-camera meter."

My bet is that the firmware in his D-whatever deserves the credit for all the exposure and focusing decisions.

Well, I've had worse encounters.
I've Googled for likeness to what I recall and reasonably sure it is a D800E (I recalled the red Nike-like swish around the handgrip). I can't stand those all-electronic things that seem to "make" a photographer. I think I'm going to cry. Oh, quick! Where is my beloved pinhole!!? Tonight, I'm heading back to the beach (it is fecking hot here) after the thunderstorms clear. I love the rendition of a dynamic sky recorded on a pinhole.

Theo Sulphate · Dec 19, 2015

frank said:
Would you include the thermometer?

I would say no. No thermometer, no alarm clock, just a meter.

Temperature and temperature logging functions would be in a different product.

Like Unix, I believe in small simple functions that are designed to do just one thing and only one thing very well.

Bill Burk · Dec 19, 2015

Poisson Du Jour said:
I'm reminded that on a seaside dusk shoot earlier last week a digitally-kitted photographer

Read this wrong and kept trying to imagine a digital kilt

DWThomas · Dec 19, 2015

I'd like to know what the difference is between it and the Digisix 2. I actually prefer the first version with contrasting white and black dials rather than them both being black.

Have not been anywhere near the newer one to even offer a guess. What I might hope is that it is a bit more frugal on battery consumption. I still haven't figured out whether the original is just a power hog or if maybe the rather tight soft case holds the button in. If the problem is the latter, a bit of a rim around the button (or a bit roomier case) might help. Looking at a picture of the -2, it's possible the button is better protected.

I was pretty amused by the thermometer, but then it was pointed out to me that it could be useful developing Polaroid films in the great outdoors (of course I never do that). And like all the current generation of techno-toy products, options and features are just "a few more lines of code."

I do like the concentric dials for instant view of all combinations. Someone on these very fora showed one with some extra markings they had engraved to deal with pinholery.

Nuff · Dec 19, 2015

I used to own L308s, I didn't like it since it was shutter priority and I think in aperture priority.

Now I have gossen digiflash, same as digisix, but with flash support. I really like it. It's very fast to use and with a glance I know if light has changed. Also I can check contrast difference.

I also have L758, but I don't use it as much as I used to. Mostly because the digisix does most of the things I need.

Maybe a meter in my future

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