Massive Dev Times

[retina_restoration]

@sergio caetano
sorry for no direct answer have never used D-76 and do not know what EI means.
Happy St Saturninus Day!

Wow. Do not know what EI is?? Are you sure you meant to subscribe to an analog photography forum?

 

[runswithsizzers]

I have have feeling it breaks down into IDK, WTF and TS.
Development by inspection I've used for orthochromatic sheet film; I don't see it working very well for roll film. But IDK for sure so YMMV.

Yeah, I got the IDK and WTF, but I still don't know "TS"

 

[retina_restoration]

Yeah, I got the IDK and WTF, but I still don't know "TS"

I suspect this is simply "I don't know what the eff this is"

Yeah, I got the IDK and WTF, but I still don't know "TS"

To say?

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Most every time and temp on the MDC for a developer and film combo is submitted by ordinary everyday people. Everyone has a different way of doing things like agitation or different and not so accurate thermometers, etc.. The MDC is just a starting place. Of course the best place to start is with the manufacture and hone your technique from there.

good advise. However, the truly best way is a full-fledged development test for every film/dev combination.that takes some time and effort.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Every acronym is a PITA

 

[ezphotolessons]

the goggles IDKWTFTS the internet might be wrong

I have no idea what "IDKWTFTS" means.

I will translate "the (NIGHTVISION) goggles IDKWTFTS (I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE FU*K TO SAY) the internet might be wrong" 6-7

Wow. Do not know what EI is?? Are you sure you meant to subscribe to an analog photography forum?

no I do not know what EI is. I have heard the term for a long time mostly by zone system practicers who used to spend a lot of their time CAGATZSANTP (CHATTING ABOUT GEAR AND THE ZONE SYSTEM AND NOT TAKING PICTURES) and BS ( B*TCH SLAPPING) non believers. people like that have always been a turn off so I never really paid much attention or cared for the mean they proselytized. I do not think it will it be better than what I currently do. I use a normal ambient meter, over expose my film 1 stop from BS (BOX SPEED), develop and then make a print. It has worked fine for me for 50+ years. I'm not religious, for me it's just photography. please do not take my religion comments or disinterest as slander it's not, I jam econo am agnostic and just don't care, if you care about EI fine with me, people should do what works for them. maybe you are right, registering here might have been a mistake.

 

[runswithsizzers]

I do not know what EI is. [...] I use a normal ambient meter, over expose my film 1 stop from BS (BOX SPEED)

You may not know what EI is, but you are, in fact, using an EI (Exposure Index) which is one-stop less than box speed.

 

[ezphotolessons]

You may not know what EI is, but you are, in fact, using an EI (Exposure Index) which is one-stop less than box speed.

I guess? I don't call it that, I just call it 1 stop over exposed not under, and develop normally and print normally. too much BS (BULLSH*T) with LS ( LINGO SLINGERS ).

 

[koraks]

Okay, thanks for the elucidation in this particular form of acronym slang. From a moderator's perspective, I'd like to kindly ask to allow this thread to revert back to a more neutral style of conversation. Thanks in advance!

 

[bluechromis]

Re: Massive Dev Chart times: I have sometimes been confused by neglecting to notice the differences in developing temperature.

 

[djdister]

Re: Massive Dev Chart times: I have sometimes been confused by neglecting to notice the differences in developing temperature.

Another thing that can be missed in the table is the different rated film speeds (EI) used for a particular developing time.

 

[sergio caetano]

Mr Frog (D23 user as me)
I don't use D76 because it blocks highlights. AA said the hydroquinone is the culprit. Bill Toop said this can be solved using D76 diluted. Some people say D23 is too low in contrast, Bill Troop said they are underdeveloping; I agree with him.

 

[Pioneer]

I've found the Massive Dev Chart quite similar to my own tested and confirmed results numerous times. It's sorta like Wikipedia in that respect - depends on whom the input came from, and it's generally suitable as a starting point at least, but certainly not infallible. Many of us might have slightly different expectations than factory tech sheets provide, or with different developers in mind, so having more resources available is a good thing. I don't know the statistical frequency of simple typos on that site - have better things to do.

D76 is a cagey animal because the result varies between freshly mixed and after the brew has allowed itself to ph stabilize and plateau in active strength several days or a week later.
You need to standardize on one mode or the other. Then some people replenish it (more often than less popular developers), so there's that potential factor too.

I agree. The MDC is a great starting place and it often agrees with my own results. I go there frequently. I guess that means that my own thermometers are off as well. Just like everything else on the internet. Always, always, always verify what you read. Look for a second and third source to confirm what you see and then it is ALWAYS a good idea to confirm with your own testing.

And finally, don't rag on someone elses hard work until you have tried to do the same. I can make a dozen mistakes all on my own; I can only imagine what can happen if a hundred other people are trying to help.

 

[VinceInMT]

Regarding asking local officials what to do with spent chemicals, photographic or otherwise. their response is, well, questionable. They, along with the FBI, have been using the incinerator at the local animal shelter to dispose of illegal drugs seized around the state. Th incinerator was designed to dispose of animal carcasses and that is what it is licensed for. There is a state facility a few miles away for drug disposal but for some reason they’ve been using the animal shelter’s. They supposedly got clearance from the county health department.

Anyway, a couple months ago, due to improper operation, they flooded the shelter building with fumes from meth and fentanyl burning and sent the staff to the hospital. It’s created quite the problem as all agencies involved are pointing fingers. County health said they didn’t know what was being burned. In the meantime, the shelter building has been abandoned while cleanup is underway. The animals were sent out to foster homes (after they were detoxed). A local marijuana business stepped forward and they are now using their warehouse as an interim animal shelter. Neighbors to the burn facility are now asking how long they’ve been downwind of this stuff and it appears to be quite a few years.

 

[koraks]

Imagine you take your spent dichromate or permanganate bleach to such a facility.

 

[DREW WILEY]

Very high temp Biohazmat incineration is done here near an animal shelter too, but certainly no chemical or illicit drug burning! - that's nuts.

But it's a "no-kill" shelter unless an animal is either too sick or too dangerous to be adopted.

 

[PicklesFrog]

Mr Frog (D23 user as me)
I don't use D76 because it blocks highlights. AA said the hydroquinone is the culprit. Bill Toop said this can be solved using D76 diluted. Some people say D23 is too low in contrast, Bill Troop said they are underdeveloping; I agree with him.

ive seen that d23 with d76 times (like people say all the time) its lower contrast (and just in general underdeveloped) - but like i said i do it for 10% extra time of d76. i also use d23 and d76 1:1 for most of my work. i think it looks fine, and i dont want to waste a few rolls to see whats the best time for my printing.

 

[ezphotolessons]

And finally, don't rag on someone elses hard work until you have tried to do the same. I can make a dozen mistakes all on my own; I can only imagine what can happen if a hundred other people are trying to help.

I have deep respect for others' work because nothing is ever easy even when they make it look like it was. Only a dozen? Every photograph I make is filled with mistakes, maybe dozens.

 

[ezphotolessons]

IIRCC there are published essays on the late Michael Smith's website about Edwardo Weston and DBI

DEVELOPING FILM BY INSPECTION

This site spotlights the photography talents of renowned artists, Michael A. Smith and Paula Chamlee.

michaelandpaula.com

 

[Prest_400]

XT-3 is what I use, a variant of X-tol. The two don't differ in result, but I like XT-3 because there's no dust coming up when preparing the stock solution.

That is not only personal, although X-tol has many followers, but has also to do with your own equipment and habits of processing, as @250swb pointed out above. My aversion against D76 is personal too and based on own experience and work from fellows.

Likewise. I've become quite a fan of XT3/XTOL. I began with HC110 which is very convenient, but then if I am bothering with powdered developers and keeping the bottle with stock around I might as go instead for the "modern" developer that also works fantastic with the tabular grain films.
Interestingly, today I noted that Kodak's and Ilford's datasheet have slight (30sec) differences in some dev times for HP5, but also each manufacturer notes a different gamma.

Back to topic and with the XTOL example, for some other films such as the budget Kentmeres, Agfaphoto and Foma there isn't any telling datasheet or info is missing. In those cases I resulted to consulting the Massive Dev chart as well as google around to find out what people wrote about their own experiences in forums and such which gives additional context.