mandel-ette tintype camera instructions

[xya]

just bought a mandel-ette postcard camera on ebay in working condition (it has not arrived yet). for those who haven't heard of it: it's a tintype camera for street photography, sold between 1909 and 1929, with a developing tank attached to the camera. it could produce a small tintype (2.5 x 3.5 inch) within 60 seconds. I have a project to use it for real. I have looked into the old threads about the mandel-ette, but as there was only little information, I opened a new one.

in the old days, the chicago ferrotype co., manufacturer of this camera, sold the plates and the developer to the clients. there is nothing similar available as far as I know. I have to start from scratch.

I know the basics about tintype, I have a copy the book "the ferrotype and how to make it" by edward m. estabrook. the recipes would be difficult to make in europe because of the cadmium. so I have some questions:

does anybody have a copy of the manaual for the camera, called "directions for operating the mandel-ette"?

has anybody used the camera for real and would be willing to share his findings?

do you know of easy recipes to make the plates?

do you know anything about a monobath developer/fixer solution?

it must have worked well in the old days, there are still tens of thousands tintypes left which have been taken with these cameras. any hints are welcome. thanks for reading me.

 

[removed account4]

hi xya

i have always wanted one of those cameras !

often times they are sold without the chemistry tank, it is good that you were able to find one that is complete !
they weren't used to make wet plate tintypes but silver gelatin ferrotypes which were on paper as well as metal.
the tank held the developer, and there was probably a bucket of fixer nearby. the developer would have been something
like the developer rockland colloid sells with their ferrotype kits and they are/were proprietary. what they would have done
"back in the day" is pretty much what people who use a afghan camera ( (there was a url link here which no longer exists) ) are doing now
( or joe vancleave : (there was a url link here which no longer exists)) but instead of a paper negative they'd get a positive .
the mandelette has a sleeve you would put your arm into to get into the back of the camera after the exposure. you would drop the paper/postcard/tintype
into the developing tank ... and then into the fixer and it was done. i can't remember if the mandelette had 2 tanks ( one dev, one fix ) or 1 tank with 2 compartments ...
but that is pretty much the process.
have fun with your street photographer's dream !

john

 

[xya]

thank you for the additional info and for your encouragement. that's a big point, silver gelantine ferrotypes. I used to make silver gelantine canvas some time ago. but these had to be exposed by a negative via an enlarger. I will read the threads you mentioned.

the camera has only one tank and there was no fixer bucket. I have seen pictures of their chemistry boxes. the label says:

"wonder"
developing powder
combined developer and fixer
this is the best and most successful
single solution developer and fixer
in the world
to be used for the developing and fixing the
"mandel" positive postcard
and all ferrotype and tintype plates.
manufactured only by
chicago ferrotype co.

so there was a single and universal develloper/fixer bath.

as far as I know the photo was directly handed out to the customer, so there was no washing either. and still theses cards survived...

 

[xya]

hi john,

the links you posted don't work for me, I get an error message.

the mandel-ette pictures obviously were direct positve ferrotypes on a kind of cardboard. that's why they called it a postcard camera. the back side of the photo was printed as an ordinary sendable (small) postcard. so any hints on how they made it are welcome. perhaps I should not use the word "plate" for the mandelette pictures, as they were no tin plates, "cards" would be better.

 

[removed account4]

hi

sorry for the trouble !
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18-5xaVfhR8
(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

not sure what happened, both should work great now

 

[xya]

thanks again, I looked at the videos, very interesting. however these procedures are very long compared to a one minute monobath direct positive. so I would love to find out how they made it.

meanwhile I found a very helpful ebay-seller (jackflash) who promised to make me a copy of the mandel-ette directions. extremely kind of him. he sells an incomplete mandel-ette with some paperwork.

 

[removed account4]

it's the similar..
you take the exposure, drop it in the developer/ fixer
and it's done.
seems the original street photographers who used the mandelette must have changed chemistry often
seeing a monobath exhausts itself as it fixes simultaneously
so, the only difference between the mandelette and the afghan camera
is the afghan makes a negative and then a contact print or photocopy,
and the mandelette was direct positive ( like joe van cleave does with his, with regular developer, not a proprietary one )
so if you can get ilford direct positive paper or the other one being exported you can do a similar direct prositive process ...
if you do it together with the #55 mono bath developer being sold now you will only need 1 tank, and a bucket to pour spent developer into, and another
to rinse off the chemicals you developped in ...there ... aren't really current ferrotype papers and developers currently sold, except for the tintype parlor rockland colloid makes.

 

[xya]

I am waiting for my share from the galaxy hyper speed positive paper funding and I will use the first pack to try different devellopers. new55 monobath develloper is a good suggestion. I haven't thought of that. thank you. the ilford paper I had was terribly slow and the faster one was not available.

 

[removed account4]

the problem with the galaxy paper is if your camera is leaky
it might be terribly fogged and being a box camear with a chem tank
and arm-sock i have a feeling it might not be completely light tight ...
the galaxy developer isn't a mono bath, it is their simplified take on
develop-bleach-clear-fog-redevelop-fix ( or something like that )
from what i understand ...
which is a way you can make chromes in your camera now
again, not 1 bath but ... a handful
you can also mix your own monobath ( i think the darkroom cookbook has a handful of them )
and open your shutter and let the light bounce around a bit, and solarize the image as it is being developed/fixed
so it is partially reversed .. i've been meaning to do that myself ..

might not be "wonder" but it might be "wonderful"

good luck !
john

 

[xya]

today the "darkroom cookbook" arrived from an english seller. I will go through it, but it might take a month or so. anyway, I will tell you if I find any hints....

 

[xya]

the darkroom cookbook is nice, but I haven't found any receipes for direct positive processes. so I just ordered an old one, called "Photographic Amusements: Including Tricks and Unusual or Novel Effects Obtainable with the Camera". maybe I'll get some more information with this one.

the manual arrived and I found some more information about the Mandel-ette. the diluted monobath solution could be re-used for several days. the cards had to be watered outside the camera, but only for 15 seconds. so it would really be interesting to find out.

I have made a page about the Mandel-ette. it's here http://www.instantphoto.eu/other/mandelette.htm

 

[GHphoto]

Dear Xya,

Stumbled on this convo and replying years after this thread was made so I hope you're still active and will read this message. I'm somewhat of a newbie who got into shooting with a Mandel-ette a year ago and would love to get in touch to share experiences!

I have some basic info/recipes regarding the original tintype monobath solution for you although I use Harman direct positive paper in the Mandelette myself. I also have a digital copy of the original manual if you're still interested in that.

I've been using this camera on a weekly basis to make tiny portraits of tourists and I'm so curious how your tintype project turned out!