Mamiya RB67 Info

revdocjim · Jan 4, 2011

jodys said:
revdocjim, your pictures look great! Would it be possible for me to use them on my site? I'd also be very excited to see pictures of any other accessories, lens, etc.

My lens photos are only 1 angle but you are free to use them if they are helpful. I also just added a bunch more photos of the two finders, the 6x8 back and the RB dual cable release.

My site is completely not-for-profit, as I assume yours is. And none of my photos are copyrighted. So you are free to use whatever you like. If you can find a place to mention the source of the photos and maybe a link to my site that would be very cool!

Steve Smith · Jan 5, 2011

revdocjim said:
And none of my photos are copyrighted.

All of your pictures have copyright. They enjoy this protection as soon as they are created. Doesn't mean you can't let someone else use them though - as you did here.

Steve.

HelenOster · Jan 5, 2011

paul ron said:
As far as Adoroma's staement....

I will be delighted to investigate, and in order to do so would be seeking answers to the following questions:

What was the order number?
Did the customer request pictures of the unit before purchase?
How was the unit originally graded?
What response did the customer receive when he asked to return it? (copies of emails would be helpful)
Whether any of the issues you describe could possibly have arisen during the 2-year period since purchase?
Whether photographs of the unit in the state you describe could be sent to me for review?

I await your response with interest - if you prefer, you may contact me directly by email: HelenO@adorama.com

revdocjim · Jan 5, 2011

I have no beef with Adorama in particular at all and don't mean to fan any flames, but reading over Helen's grading descriptions I really find it hard to understand why something in this condition:
Appears to have been used very heavily with multiple dings, scrapes, scratches and heavy brassing. Glass may have fungus, excessive dust and/or scratches that can affect picture quality.
would be called "Good". I'd have to say that anything looking like that is decidedly "bad", even if it still works. Most significantly, any lens with fungus should not be called "Good" under any circumstance. A proper cleaning job will probably cost as much or more than the lens itself, and in most cases the coating is permanently marred. Essentially, lenses with fungus are nearly worthless. Here in Tokyo at reputable used camera stores all such lenses are thrown in the "Junk" bin and labeled as such.

HelenOster · Jan 5, 2011

revdocjim said:
I have no beef with Adorama in particular at all and don't mean to fan any flames, but reading over Helen's grading descriptions I really find it hard to understand why something in this condition:
Appears to have been used very heavily with multiple dings, scrapes, scratches and heavy brassing. Glass may have fungus, excessive dust and/or scratches that can affect picture quality.
would be called "Good".....

I rarely disagree with customers - after all, we are here for you! But would it make any difference if we called it 'sausages'?

We are completely open concerning the %age of new, and provide an in-depth description of what this grading means in terms of condition / functionality - and the price reflects that. Selling lower graded units enables customers who want to dispose of such items to do so for some cash back, and if we didn't have buyers who wanted them, we wouldn't be selling any.....

As I stated above, we give a full 90 day warranty, and have a no-questions asked 30-day returns policy.

mikebarger · Jan 5, 2011

I have had many dealings with Adorama. I always buy exc + or exc -. The equipment has always arrived as described and customer service has been excellent. Actually, pricing has been so good I've sold several items locally and pocketed the change.

hpulley · Jan 5, 2011

Unfortunately, like everything else the ratings systems are inflated. People want their stuff to sell. So we have Mint+++ but how can it be above mint??? Makes no sense. And "minty"... what does that mean? Some places rate things Bargain and they are just perfect, others rate them Excellent and they're in terrible shape. It is best to ask questions and get pictures when possible.

When Adorama hasn't had pictures online I've asked for pictures and they've been pleased to provide them for me. Good pictures and description and a good return policy from anyone should be enough. You shouldn't really need two years to decide that your camera is a piece of junk.

revdocjim · Jan 5, 2011

HelenOster said:
But would it make any difference if we called it 'sausages'?

Like I said, I have no beef with your company Helen and no desire to start any sort of argument. I also don't dispute that your company does define their grading system clearly. But in response to your question, yes it would make a difference. Words like "good", "excellent", "junk" and "sausage" are not completely arbitrary or meaningless. Regardless of how your fine print defines your use of them, they are words that carry inherent meaning and give distinct impressions to the potential customer. There is something to be said for "calling a spade a spade", especially in the business world where your company's success depends on earning and keeping the trust of the customer.

HelenOster · Jan 6, 2011

revdocjim said:
......There is something to be said for "calling a spade a spade", especially in the business world where your company's success depends on earning and keeping the trust of the customer.

My apologies, I had perceived initially that your concerns were primarily against our listing and selling of such items at all, more than the use of the word 'good' - as the accompanying description is quite explicit.

I have passed your comments regarding the use of 'good' to describe the units in question to the used department for their consideration.

Steve Smith · Jan 6, 2011

hpulley said:
So we have Mint+++ but how can it be above mint??? Makes no sense.

That's like buying your clothes in Extra Medium size.

Steve.

hpulley · Jan 6, 2011

Steve Smith said:
That's like buying your clothes in Extra Medium size.

Steve.

Haha, like Extra Virgin olive oil. You are or you aren't LOL

phirehouse · Jan 6, 2011

I can't stand the use of the word "minty"

revdocjim · Jan 6, 2011

No problem Helen! FWIW, KEH uses the terms "Bargain", "Ugly", and "As Is" for categories that roughly correspond to Adorama's "Excellent", "Good", and "Fair". My personal take is that KEH's terms have the effect of conveying to the potential customer that they are being extremely honest about the condition of their products and not trying to sugar coat anything.

HelenOster · Jan 6, 2011

revdocjim said:
No problem Helen! FWIW, KEH uses the terms "Bargain", "Ugly", and "As Is" for categories that roughly correspond to Adorama's "Excellent", "Good", and "Fair". My personal take is that KEH's terms have the effect of conveying to the potential customer that they are being extremely honest about the condition of their products and not trying to sugar coat anything.

The new ratings are now as follows:

N) New (Brand new)
All original packaging and manuals included.
D) Demo (Like New)
Like New with little or no signs of use.
E+) Excellent Plus
May have slight wear but only visible under close up inspection.
E) Excellent
Lens Glass very clean - cosmetically may show slight wear and/or signs of use.
E-) Excellent Minus
Shows signs of moderate use - Lens Glass is perfect but may have some dust which will not affect picture quality.
V) Very Good
Appears well used and may include dings, brassing, scrapes and bruises but is in fully functional condition. Glass may have marks or haze that should not affect picture quality.
G) Looks Ugly but works fine
Appears to have been used very heavily with multiple dings, scrapes, scratches and heavy brassing. Glass may have fungus, excessive dust and/or scratches that can affect picture quality.
F) Fair Item works with certain malfunctions. Read comments for exact malfunction details.
X) For parts only. (except when otherwise specified)
OB) Open Box
Was on display in our retail store, or used once or twice for training our sales associates or returned for any number of reasons.

Mamiya RB67 Info

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