Making your own Baryta?

gmikol · Sep 24, 2020

I've been away from the analog side of photography and alt process for quite some time, but I've rekindled a bit of an interest lately. I've been going through old notes, I'm looking at picking up a few things that had my attention back then and I'd still like to try.

One of those is the process of making one's own baryta (barium sulfate / gelatin emulsion) for sizing papers. I thought I had a PDF (or maybe a JPG) from an old text on how to do it, but it's also possible it's in a book that I own. Searching through my own stuff (how many computers ago was 10 years?) and with the Google, I haven't been able to find it.

I'm going out on a limb here that someone knows the document I'm talking about and can point me to it or post it here.

Any help is appreciated.

Thanks!!

Lachlan Young · Sep 24, 2020

gmikol said:
I've been away from the analog side of photography and alt process for quite some time, but I've rekindled a bit of an interest lately. I've been going through old notes, I'm looking at picking up a few things that had my attention back then and I'd still like to try.

One of those is the process of making one's own baryta (barium sulfate / gelatin emulsion) for sizing papers. I thought I had a PDF (or maybe a JPG) from an old text on how to do it, but it's also possible it's in a book that I own. Searching through my own stuff (how many computers ago was 10 years?) and with the Google, I haven't been able to find it.

I'm going out on a limb here that someone knows the document I'm talking about and can point me to it or post it here.

Any help is appreciated.

Thanks!!

I think you're looking for: http://www.thelightfarm.com/Map/PaperAndCoating/PaperAndCoatingPart4.htm

gmikol · Sep 24, 2020

That's interesting....appreciate the link, but it's definitely not what I was looking for.

The process, as I recall it, involved actually synthesizing the barium sulfate inside of a gelatin emulsion. i.e. adding 2 reagents and getting barium sulfate. Supposedly results in very fine particles. It was definitely a PDF or JPG from a historical text. The process with a blender would probably work, but at this point I'm determined to find the thing I'm looking for.

Lachlan Young · Sep 24, 2020

gmikol said:
That's interesting....appreciate the link, but it's definitely not what I was looking for.

The process, as I recall it, involved actually synthesizing the barium sulfate inside of a gelatin emulsion. i.e. adding 2 reagents and getting barium sulfate. Supposedly results in very fine particles. It was definitely a PDF or JPG from a historical text. The process with a blender would probably work, but at this point I'm determined to find the thing I'm looking for.

You may be referring to Kit Funderburk's book about papermaking at Kodak. You might also want to have a look at his post here and Ron's immediately above it for an outline of what is going on. I would point out that it could be potentially very dangerous to try synthesis with Barium salts in a home darkroom environment.

gmikol · Sep 25, 2020

Heh...no, that's not it either.

I did manage to track it down (sort of). It was something that Dick Sullivan had posted to the (seemingly now defunct) B&S carbon discussion board. Based on the link name, the source document was from 1914. The link is dead now, and I never archived the actual document to which it referred. I sent a quick note to B&S on the off chance that they can track it down. I'll post it here for completeness.

Appreciate the warning about barium salts...I am comfortable with the level of risk, and feel that those risks are manageable (speaking only for myself...everyone should educate themselves on the chemicals they are handling and evaluate those risks accordingly).

Lachlan Young · Sep 25, 2020

gmikol said:
Heh...no, that's not it either.

I did manage to track it down (sort of). It was something that Dick Sullivan had posted to the (seemingly now defunct) B&S carbon discussion board. Based on the link name, the source document was from 1914. The link is dead now, and I never archived the actual document to which it referred. I sent a quick note to B&S on the off chance that they can track it down. I'll post it here for completeness.

Appreciate the warning about barium salts...I am comfortable with the level of risk, and feel that those risks are manageable (speaking only for myself...everyone should educate themselves on the chemicals they are handling and evaluate those risks accordingly).

I'd tend to treat any document from that era that makes claims about particle size/ shape with a large amount of caution - and there are better & safer ways to get a suitable dispersion of Baryta ready for coating than trying to synthesize it in a gelatin solution. Do read Funderburk's book - especially pg 32 onwards - it probably answers most of your questions. The other important thing to note is that the Baryta layer is not really sizing the paper base (which is already internally sized), as much as placing an impermeable, non photochemically reactive & extremely smooth layer on it.

dwross · Sep 27, 2020

Hi gmikol. Just curious (my curse). Why do you want to size with baryta? Lachlan is correct. Barium sulfate in gelatin was/is used as a coating between the paper surface and the emulsion, not a sizing. I've never seen any literature that suggests otherwise -- which isn't to say it doesn't exist, of course. I'll be interested in what you find out. And, another correct thing: Synthesizing your own baryta is hazardous in the extreme.

gmikol · Sep 28, 2020

For the most part...it's about curiosity. About seeing if it can be done and how. Sort of the idea of "farm-to-table" alt-process. I realize and acknowledge that there are other, probably easier, ways to get a barium sulfate/gelatin emulsion.

And "sizing" was probably a poor choice of words. One of my thoughts about using it is as a highly reflective base for carbon printing using traditional papers or other substrates (e.g. not fixed out photo paper). Another thought was using it as the image-making medium for "carbon" prints...white gelatin instead of black.

I'm a mediocre photographer, artistically speaking (IMO), but I like to play around with process and method.

BJ68 · Sep 29, 2020

gmikol said:
That's interesting....appreciate the link, but it's definitely not what I was looking for.
The process, as I recall it, involved actually synthesizing the barium sulfate inside of a gelatin emulsion. i.e. adding 2 reagents and getting barium sulfate.

If you want you can use more or less the same approach for making silver gelatin emulsion e.g. http://thelightfarm.com/Map/KitchenLab/KitchenLabPart2.htm but you have only two Chemicals e.g. bariumchloride and potassium or sodium sulfate.

bj68

Making your own Baryta?

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