Macro with 35mm

tadman · Sep 12, 2014

My spare time I spent wandering around the bush, Western Australia, taking photos of wild flower/orchids, which I stack.

I use a Nikon D800 with Voigtlander 125mm apo macro lens or a Leica 100 mm R macro lens would I gain anything in using a Contax 120mm apo macro medium format lens, your input please

paul_c5x4 · Sep 12, 2014

What film do you use in the Nikon ?

wildbill · Sep 12, 2014

Analog photography users group. A.P.U.G

No

ME Super · Sep 12, 2014

The OP is asking about lenses, not pixels. Last time I checked, lenses worked on both kinds of cameras. If I had experience with a Contax 120mm APO macro medium format lens, I'd share.

OP, take this with a grain or two of salt: I'm not sure how you're going to get a medium format lens to mount on your camera body. If you've got that solved, the Contax 120mm lens will be slightly shorter in focal length than your 125mm Voigtlander lens. Not knowing how close the two will focus, I can't say how much you'll get in terms of coverage area. The medium format lenses have a larger coverage area, which theoretically should get you better corner-to-corner sharpness, probably no vignetting problems either, since 35mm film (this is ANALOG photography, after all) is smaller than 6x4.5cm, 6x6cm, 6x7cm, 6x9cm, or 6x12cm, all of which are "medium format" frame sizes.

Sorry, I can't help you with the stacking either. No experience with that.

Rick A · Sep 12, 2014

paul_c5x4 said:
What film do you use in the Nikon ?

Inquiring minds want to know.

bdial · Sep 12, 2014

I agree with ME Super that you may get slightly better corner sharpness because the lens is designed for more coverage.
Other than that, I am sure that all three are excellent lenses and my expectation would be that it will be very difficult to see a meaningful difference.

summicron1 · Sep 12, 2014

i doubt seriously you would gain anything by using a different lens, especially from a medium format camera. Concentrate on composition and light, the the technical differences among the lenses you are using now are too small to bother with.

fotch · Sep 12, 2014

paul_c5x4 said:
What film do you use in the Nikon ?

Digital shooters don't know anything, the digital camera does it all.

Rick A · Sep 12, 2014

fotch said:
Digital shooters don't know anything, the digital camera does it all.

:crazy:

ME Super · Sep 12, 2014

All, just because the guy is shooting digital doesn't mean that we can't help him with lenses. He wasn't asking about any sort of post-processing, just asking about lenses, which last time I checked, the only cameras that don't have a lens are the ones of the pinhole variety.

I can't help him with stacking, but I'd think that we could at least give him a hand with lens choice. For what it's worth, summicron1 probably hit the nail on the head with lens choice.

ic-racer · Sep 12, 2014

tadman said:
would I gain anything in using a Contax 120mm apo macro medium format lens,

Maybe I'm the first to tell you but the Nikon D series cameras are the worst film cameras made. No matter which lens you place on it, it won't expose a negative properly (if at all).

Dr Croubie · Sep 12, 2014

tadman said:
My spare time I spend wandering around the bush, Western Australia, taking photos of wild flower/orchids, which I print to RA4.

I use a Nikon F6 and Ektar, with a Voigtlander 125mm apo macro lens or a Leica 100 mm R macro lens. Would I gain anything in using a Contax 120mm apo macro medium format lens. What is your input please?

Fixed, now we can answer your lens question (and fixed some grammar too, because I'm a picky bastard).

As far as I know, Contax 645 lenses are electronic aperture like Canon EF and Mamiya 645. As in, you need a proper camera body to stop-down the lens, or you're stuck shooting wide-open. There are special electronic adapters available to do this using Canon EF to smaller formats, I'm sure there must be the same for C645 to 35mm formats, but my guess is that they'll be expensive.
Or, you get an adapter with built-in iris like Dead Link Removed.

As for IQ? No idea. An Apo-Makro-Planar should be about as good as it gets, without going to Coastal Optics. But Leica and Voigtlander don't make crap either.
With such a (there was a url link here which no longer exists), you're much better off switching to Velvia or something if you're chasing absolute lp/mm (or CMS 20 looks good if you can live with B+W).
As for the MM? 1:1 is 1:1, no matter the image circle. So if all of those lenses (I haven't checked) focus to 1:1 Maximum Magnification, you won't get any smaller insects filling your frame (although last time I checked, a WA orchid is bigger than 24x36 anyway, so maybe all you need is 1:2).
Working distance-to-subject will be a bit longer with the 120/125 compared to the 100, but all will be enough anyway, it's a flower not a Funnelweb.

John Koehrer · Sep 12, 2014

Just saw a NATGEO article on funnelweb spiders. I'd suspect they can move quicker than I so that's still way too close.

Dr Croubie · Sep 13, 2014

John Koehrer said:
Just saw a NATGEO article on funnelweb spiders. I'd suspect they can move quicker than I so that's still way too close.

Not sure if they can move fast, but they don't really have to. They'll just happily crawl into the clothes you've thrown on the floor overnight, and wait there patiently until you put them on the next morning...

pdeeh · Sep 13, 2014

It's always good to make a newcomer to APUG feel so welcome - sarcasm, attacking digital photography and digital photographers and so on ... it's all absolutely on the money.

I'm sure the OP feels that (if he shoots film as well as digital) this is the place where he'll feel at home, and (if he doesn't shoot film at the moment but perhaps might like to in the future) then he'll feel this is the place where he can come for friendly advice and not have the piss ripped out of him and told, in effect, to fuck off because he's not part of the gang.

Well done to all those who made the effort to behave like small-minded cretins. You make me very proud to be a member of the APUG community.

tadman · Sep 26, 2014

Well gentlemen over the many years I have been on this planet many people have tried to take the piss many have failed, have been through the film period, I can still remember a couple of weeks ago or so, was at the end of WW2 using flash powder,contact printing, 1/4 plate cameras and etc.
Never mind the blowhards they think they are being so clever/smart, thanks to those who did supply some useful info
tadman

darkosaric · Sep 26, 2014

tadman said:
Well gentlemen over the many years I have been on this planet many people have tried to take the piss many have failed, have been through the film period, I can still remember a couple of weeks ago or so, was at the end of WW2 using flash powder,contact printing, 1/4 plate cameras and etc.
Never mind the blowhards they think they are being so clever/smart, thanks to those who did supply some useful info
tadman

Tadman,

welcome to APUG . Here people are nice and friendly, sometimes they like to pick some posts and make a day more fun with some remarks. Not once I was the victim myself, and sometimes I make those remarks .

No mean intentions for sure are in those comments. Stick around and enjoy in this forum .

Regards,

pdeeh · Sep 26, 2014

I think it's very nice of you darko to look for the best in people, but I think you are mistaken if you think that some of those remarks were just made "in fun".

L Gebhardt · Sep 26, 2014

I use a Mamiya 645 120mm Macro lens on my Nikons (film and D800E). The results are excellent. I have not tried any of the lenses you mentioned, but I imagine they will all work if the right adapter is available.

Dan Fromm · Sep 26, 2014

L Gebhardt said:
I use a Mamiya 645 120mm Macro lens on my Nikons (film and D800E). The results are excellent. I have not tried any of the lenses you mentioned, but I imagine they will all work if the right adapter is available.

Larry, what are your usual subjects and does your adapter stop the lens down automatically?

I ask because when I was actively shooting closeup with 35 mm -- the loss of KM ended that, I just can't reconcile myself to E6 with ND filters -- I used Nikons with MicroNikkors and found auto diaphragm essential with moving subjects. Moving subjects includes apparently stationary ones that can be moved by the wind.

I can't have auto diaphragm with my 2x3 Graphics and Cambo so have given up on moving subjects. My success rate with flowers isn't that good thanks to imperceptible breezes.

RalphLambrecht · Sep 26, 2014

Rick A said:
Inquiring minds want to know.

never mind wich film.How he gets it into a D800 is what I like to see and know.

TooManyShots · Sep 27, 2014

Macro lenses are generally pretty sharp to begin with. Stop down to f8 or smaller. Use off camera flash. I have a $140 Nikon AF D 28-105 lens, shooting on a D300. The image quality is frighteningly sharp. There is no point trying to use a medium format macro lens on 35mm.

L Gebhardt · Sep 27, 2014

Dan Fromm said:
Larry, what are your usual subjects and does your adapter stop the lens down automatically?

I ask because when I was actively shooting closeup with 35 mm -- the loss of KM ended that, I just can't reconcile myself to E6 with ND filters -- I used Nikons with MicroNikkors and found auto diaphragm essential with moving subjects. Moving subjects includes apparently stationary ones that can be moved by the wind.

I can't have auto diaphragm with my 2x3 Graphics and Cambo so have given up on moving subjects. My success rate with flowers isn't that good thanks to imperceptible breezes.

My usual subjects are plants, flowers and fungi. The adapter I have does not support an auto diaphragm. It does have a rod that stops the lens down when mounted. The Mamiya lenses have a lever to quickly open, but I just use the aperture ring.

For insects and other moving subjects I use a shorter Nikon AF macro, or the 300mm f/4, sometimes with an extension tube.

I use clamps a lot to hold plants still, as well as folding light diffusers to even the light and block the wind.

benveniste · Sep 27, 2014

tadman said:
My spare time I spent wandering around the bush, Western Australia, taking photos of wild flower/orchids, which I stack.

I use a Nikon D800 with Voigtlander 125mm apo macro lens or a Leica 100 mm R macro lens would I gain anything in using a Contax 120mm apo macro medium format lens, your input please

Based on my own experiments with a Nikon D800 and a Pentax 120mm f/4 Macro, I'd say "not very much if anything" but you don't lose a whole lot either. IIRC, the Leica requires an extension tube to reach 1:1; both the Voigtländer and the Contax do not, but I suspect that due to the longer register distance you'll lose a bit of working distance with the Contax. You'll also have to use stop down metering, but I think you have to do that with the Leica as well.

While I do understand the urge to get the last quantum of sharpness out of your D800, especially "around the bush" any differences in optical qualities between top-quality lenses such as these is going to get lost in the noise. But here's a shot I did with the Pentax 120mm macro, an F100, and Ektar 100 a couple of years back:

tadman · Sep 27, 2014

Now the junk is over let us get down to the real world. Film and the D800, it is all done with mirrors and trickery!!
Flowers and movement – have a look around in the forest/woods/bush for small straight twigs prune until left with a Y shape twig use a couple of these too lightly prop flower stem, works a treat and are free, don’t forget to remove when finished.
Funnel web spiders, not this side of the continent am pleased to say it’s too hot and dry in the summer for them to exist, but we do have our fair share of snakes, not a problem if you leave them alone.
I brought a very nice Contax 645 120mm macro from this forum am now waiting for an adapter from Steel Chen in China which connects lens to camera electrically, for the 120mm it is only aperture control, with this lens I will only use f4/ f5.6, the less dof the better, a lot of the WA orchids and flowers are quite small say 50mm to 150mm high, so with my Gitzo tripod flat on the ground and a right angle viewer I get ‘down to it’, most of these I focus stack at intervals of parts of a millimetre to 3 or 5mm, as few as 4 photos to 20 plus for the large ones, most important no movement hence the twigs, these stacks give me a semi 3D image with a wonderful bokeh.
My Leica R 100 has a Elpro 1:2 – 1:1 which I can screw on if I need 1:1.
Like most of us I take photos for the enjoyment of being out in the wide blue yonder while I can, but if we all did the same thing what a grey boring world it would be, that what make photography such a medium.

Macro with 35mm

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