Loading Film Holders White or Black?

David A. Goldfarb · Jul 15, 2004

Regarding Timothy's question--I used to worry about whether I could match up the negs with the notes after the fact, but as long as I have a description of the scene, I can usually distinguish different versions just by looking at the negs and knowing what to expect. A neg developed for +1 will have more contrast than a neg developed for N, and a neg with more exposure will have more shadow detail, and a neg with a smaller aperture will have more DOF. If the differences aren't visible, then something's wrong.

Flotsam · Jul 15, 2004

brimc76 said:
I was talking to another photographer (who I had purchased a Crown Graphic Special from) and he remarked that I had my darkslides in backwards for exposed and unexposed film (silver side/ black side).

Show him this poll

George Losse · Jul 15, 2004

I use the white side for unexposed film. I don't think it matters much which side you use as long as YOU know which side is unexposed for you. And if your used to doing it one way don't try to change, that invites problems.

I will say that I have a pair of 8x20 holders that were made by Great Basin and they came with two black sides on the darkslide. Actually, it was just a piece of black plastic. I put a small piece of white tape on one of the side and now its the white side.

gma · Jul 15, 2004

I can't believe I am with the overwhelming majority for once. I always thought developed negatives are black and used white for unexposed.

DrPhil · Jul 15, 2004

I'm in the minority on this one. I'm sticking to the idea that if it's white it has seen the light. Works for me. Anything else might confuse me

As for film holders. I have a half dozen new riteway film holders that have little wheels for marking the exposure number. I'm of the opinion that they are a great idea but poor execution. You can't see the wheels in the dark while you're loading film. Thus, many of my negatives and chromes have random numbers along the edge. I can usually tell them apart from my notes though. Rite in the Rain field notebooks rock!!

jd callow · Jul 15, 2004

White out when loaded black after exposed. Can't say where I picked it up from and I've only been shooting LF for about 4 years. I did a shoot last fall with a good freind and she did black out when loaded. It got confusing but no problems.

glbeas · Jul 15, 2004

Timothy said:
What I have found is a more vexing problem is keeping track of "exposure numbers" in the darkroom. By this I mean: Let's say I bracket a particular composition nominal, one plus, one minus, one with a filter. When I get to the darkroom, after the lights are back on, how do I match up each neg with my meticulous notes ??
I have heard that some people modify their film holders to mark numbers on each neg. This sounds risky. I would like to hear other comments.

I have heard about cutting a pattern of notches on the edge of the holder that will show on the image to ID the film, runs on similar lines to the film notched for easy ID in the dark. Never bothered to try it though as I process all my 4x5 in a Nikor tank together and never bother to take notes. I'm having too much fun just shooting.

John McCallum · Jul 15, 2004

glbeas said:
I have heard about cutting a pattern of notches on the edge of the holder that will show on the image to ID the film, runs on similar lines to the film notched for easy ID in the dark.

Ah HA! Brilliant - thank you Gary.

damn why didn't I think of that. J.

Edit: by the way, may I ask - What is your avatar? intriguing, but unfortunately because of the size limitation, it's possible to make a wrong assumption (which I don't wish to do).

glbeas · Jul 15, 2004

John McCallum said:
Ah HA! Brilliant - thank you Gary.

damn why didn't I think of that. J.

Edit: by the way, may I ask - What is your avatar? intriguing, but unfortunately because of the size limitation, it's possible to make a wrong assumption (which I don't wish to do).

It's a stone satyre, found it on a wall at the Renaissance Festival a few years back.

removed account4 · Jul 15, 2004

i do it black = exposed ||| white unexposed
but as long as *you* know what is un- or exposed THAT's what counts

Ole · Jul 15, 2004

glbeas said:
I have heard about cutting a pattern of notches on the edge of the holder that will show on the image to ID the film, runs on similar lines to the film notched for easy ID in the dark. ...

If it's really important to know which is which, I'll dig up my Linhof holders. They're numbered, and expose the number on the film. Unfortunately I only have these in 9x12cm and 13x18cm, not "non-metric" sizes.

With the 18x24cm camera it's no problem, since I only have two holders...

bobfowler · Jul 15, 2004

I'm a white (or silver) for unexposed, black for exposed kinda guy.

papagene · Jul 15, 2004

Back when I first started shooting 4x5 (18 years ago), I figured Black meant no light hit the negative and White meant light had reached the film. Talk about dumb assumptions! But I still load my holders the same way, because that is what I am used to doing. And I am too old to try to figure out how to do it the right way.
gene

John McCallum · Jul 15, 2004

"Both. Double exposures and unexposed film is normal!" 1
There *had* to be one didn't there?

mobtown_4x5 · Jul 15, 2004

Loaded holders in box with camera- exposed holders in bag. I always shoot them all.

Dark slides ? Totally random!!

(sorry, guess I'm just a rebel [and a sloppy photog])

Matt

roy · Jul 16, 2004

[QUOTE=papagene But I still load my holders the same way, because that is what I am used to doing.

At the end of the day, you do what works for you.

Johnny V · Jul 16, 2004

The standard is "White" side for unexposed film and "Black" side for exposed film. And also "Black" if empty.

If you are just shooting for yourself it doesn't matter but if you are assisting or working in a professional envoriment then it matters for sure. You'll be out on your butt if you hand a professional photographer holders ready to shoot with the black slide out.

DKT · Jul 16, 2004

Johnny V said:
The standard is "White" side for unexposed film and "Black" side for exposed film. And also "Black" if empty.

If you are just shooting for yourself it doesn't matter but if you are assisting or working in a professional envoriment then it matters for sure. You'll be out on your butt if you hand a professional photographer holders ready to shoot with the black slide out.

no kidding. I worked with a guy once in our studio who goofed and forgot to reverse the slides once. this fouled up holder found it's way back into the unexposed film bin in the main studio--where later that day someone (the head shooter) picked it up and used it on the big shot of the day. which was a real production too. we always double up on the film, but still--this guy wasn't a happy camper after being chewed out when the film was processed and his shot was double exposed with the other. it could have been a mistake--but he dug a hole for himself even further by denying it. absolved himself of any responsibility--which meant that he couldn't be trusted in the future--which meant his duties pretty much entailed sweeping the floor...

another stupid move--an assistant used to remove the ground glass back to insert the holder & then put it back on. another guy used to put the rear caps back on the lenses mounted to the camera after the shoot. so when you go to the next setup and pop the lens open it's dark on the g.g. because some dumbass has put the cap back on....

these last 2 guys developed these weird habits working by themselves but in the company of others--they turned from amusing little problems to downright annoying ones resulting in short work careers...

Helen B · Jul 16, 2004

In the movies we use white tape (sometimes coloured) for unexposed (recans and short ends - otherwise it is the manufacturer's coloured tape) and black tape for exposed, so I use the same convention with my film holders. I agree that the logic of it is unimportant - but it is fairly important for everyone in a team to follow the convention.

Best,
Helen

Tom Duffy · Jul 16, 2004

Many of my holders are so old, it's silver side out for unexposed and black side out for exposed

Why? Because thats the way it's supposed to be.

Dr. Phil, remember the line from the Robert Redford movie Brubaker?

hortense · Jan 21, 2006

Loading Holders

DrPhil said:
Do you put the white side out for unexposed film? Or the black side out?

"Flotsom: Simple, after development unexposed film is clear (white), exposed film is black.
Robert: Dark = Never seen light. White = Seen light"
Confusing but I vote for Flotsam (because that's the way I do it).

John Kasaian · Jan 22, 2006

My holders are mostly old Kodak woodies so its silver for unexposed halides and black for exposed. This makes sense to me, so I apply it to my plastics as white/unexposed and black/exposed.

Of course, it dosen't matter as long as you are consistent.

Then again, after you die and your kids put your gear up for sale on eBay and maybe you've got an undeveloped shot of, say Elvis or Jimmy Hoffa wouldn't you want to give someone a clue about what priceless treasure awaits them in the dark room?

JLMoore3 · Jan 22, 2006

White = Take it to the light, Black = Take it to the dark(room)

A mnemonic I learned in my first photo class in High School (1972!).

dphphoto · Jan 22, 2006

If you ever send your loaded film holders to a professional photo lab to get the film developed, you better have the black side out to indicate that the film is exposed. Otherwise, they won't process the film.
But then, a lot of labs want you to unload the film yourself. Dean

Denis P. · Jan 22, 2006

JLMoore3 said:
White = Take it to the light, Black = Take it to the dark(room)
A mnemonic I learned in my first photo class in High School (1972!).

Well, I entered the LF game only a few months ago, and one of my main sources were Paul Butzi's instructions (Loading Film Holders), where he recommends "white for unexposed" system. I checked some other pages, and that seemed to be the prevailing standard, so I learned to do it that way.

Although I must admit that the proponents of the "other" system also have some valid points. For me, it's easy to remember that "dark side out" means "intended for darkroom", just like John said above...

Denis

Loading Film Holders White or Black?

Which side out for unexposed film?

White side out.

Black side out.

Both. Double exposures and unexposed film is normal!

David A. Goldfarb

Moderator

Flotsam

George Losse

gma

DrPhil

jd callow

Moderator

glbeas

John McCallum

glbeas

Attachments

removed account4

Ole

Moderator

bobfowler

papagene

Membership Council

John McCallum

mobtown_4x5

roy

Johnny V

DKT

Helen B

Tom Duffy

hortense

John Kasaian

JLMoore3

dphphoto

Denis P.

Loading Film Holders White or Black?

Which side out for unexposed film?

White side out.

Black side out.

Both. Double exposures and unexposed film is normal!

Moderator

Moderator

Attachments

Moderator

Membership Council

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency