Liquid emulsion, time to dry?

OMU · Dec 29, 2010

I have bought a bottle of liquid emulsion from Foma, and I am going to give it a try.
(And later I hope to use it for Bromoil)

Any advice how to store the paper for drying after I have coated it with the emulsion?

And how long will it take before it dries?
(Know it depends on the temperature etc. But as “starting point” as we say here on APUG

gandolfi · Dec 29, 2010

I (we) have a "dark darkroom" so here it is easy. (A room for uprolling films and space with a shelve with many shelves. The room has red light but when it is shut, it is pitch black in there..)

If you don't habe that, maybe some cardboard boxes? Or under a table where you can hang a black fabric to minimize light ?

My experience is, that the first layer will dry in about one hour - the second in about two..
(You can put the second layer on even though the first layer isn't 100% dry - the paper has to look totally matt though...)

have fun.

Jerevan · Dec 29, 2010

It's strange - I think I responded to these questions just a few days ago. The book Silver Gelatin says 30 minutes with a hairdryer on cold or 1-2 days without it (it needs to be thoroughly dry). Boxes for Ilford paper would work fine for storing the drying papers. I guess even a Foma box would do.

EDIT: no, I am not going crazy - I had to look it up - I posted in the scandinavian Bromoil thread right before christmas. Whew!

gandolfi · Dec 29, 2010

Jerevan said:
It's strange - I think I responded to these questions just a few days ago. The book Silver Gelatin says 30 minutes with a hairdryer on cold or 1-2 days without it (it needs to be thoroughly dry). Boxes for Ilford paper would work fine for storing the drying papers. I guess even a Foma box would do.

EDIT: no, I am not going crazy - I had to look it up - I posted in the scandinavian Bromoil thread right before christmas. Whew!

saw that...

1-2 days are more than enough!
In my experience a couple of hours would suffice.

It all depends on the surface used. The paper I use dries quickly; however if applied on glas or other hard surfaces it can take more than 24 hours....

removed account4 · Dec 29, 2010

gandolfi said:
saw that...

1-2 days are more than enough!
In my experience a couple of hours would suffice.

It all depends on the surface used. The paper I use dries quickly; however if applied on glas or other hard surfaces it can take more than 24 hours....

i have put liquid emulsion on glass ( not foma but liquid light and stuff i made by hand )
and dried it fast with a hairdryer. i used low but not cool setting with no problems.
i have tried to use a hairdryer with paper, but it dries to fast and the paper
curls and buckles .. air dry seems to work much better ...
but i am using thin paper, perhaps too thin and that is why it gave trouble.

Colin Corneau · Dec 29, 2010

A paper safe would work too, no?

OMU · Dec 29, 2010

Nor in APUG or in life there is seldom only one answer to a question

Jerevan, I saw your answer in the Scandinavian forum. Thanks.

It was Christmas and I got few answers. Perhaps there were second opinions and experiences - and so it was.

Jerevan · Dec 29, 2010

Yeah, I know; only one answer to a question is rare.

Sometimes, I do a drive-by-reply when in the midst of something else. More often than not, I type an answer and then delete it. And remembering which of the two I did in a certain thread is not always easy.

totalamateur · Dec 29, 2010

My solution

I built this with a handsaw, about $20 worth of cheap plywood and fairing strips, wood glue and a lot of gaffers tape (to make it light tight).

Works good for drying, but if you are using a gelatin emulsion you have to make sure it sets on a level surface first, otherwise the emulsion creeps to one side, as mine is nowhere close to being level.

A quick coat of spray enamel on the inside kept the dust down. The door folds from the bottom up on a gaffer tape hinge (ghetto, but works) and has a lip that wraps around the outside of the box. To test light tightness I set taped a piece of ortho film inside and set the box in direct summer sun for 6 hours. No exposure.

gandolfi · Dec 30, 2010

totalamateur said:
I built this with a handsaw, about $20 worth of cheap plywood and fairing strips, wood glue and a lot of gaffers tape (to make it light tight).

Works good for drying, but if you are using a gelatin emulsion you have to make sure it sets on a level surface first, otherwise the emulsion creeps to one side, as mine is nowhere close to being level.

A quick coat of spray enamel on the inside kept the dust down. The door folds from the bottom up on a gaffer tape hinge (ghetto, but works) and has a lip that wraps around the outside of the box. To test light tightness I set taped a piece of ortho film inside and set the box in direct summer sun for 6 hours. No exposure.

that actually looks a lot like ours - ours is much bigger, and the shelves are made of a metal grid (small holes) so the materials can get air from down, while drying.

Also, ours is leveled...

Great thingy - good for emulsion drying, but also for drying fiber based papers and so on...

Athiril · Jan 1, 2011

Jerevan said:
It's strange - I think I responded to these questions just a few days ago. The book Silver Gelatin says 30 minutes with a hairdryer on cold or 1-2 days without it (it needs to be thoroughly dry). Boxes for Ilford paper would work fine for storing the drying papers. I guess even a Foma box would do.

EDIT: no, I am not going crazy - I had to look it up - I posted in the scandinavian Bromoil thread right before christmas. Whew!

Put some dessicator in there. The moisture needs to go somewhere, drying will slow down the more humid the air gets in there.

OMU · Jan 4, 2011

Hi again and thanks for your answers;

I used brush and dried the paper/emulsion in empty boxes for photo paper.
After an hour it was dry enough to add on the second layer.

And there I left it and I hope to play with it tomorrow

Slavomir Polivka · Jan 4, 2011

The answer to this question is not so easy because it depends on many factors (in addition to temperature and air flow, relative. humidity also the quality and character of the paper, the method of applying the emulsion, hardener content, etc.)

Recomendation from Foma Bohemia for temperature 20 degrees Celsius and relative humidity 40-60%.

minimum 10 hours when emulsion is applyed with brush.
minimum 6 hours when sprayed. 6 hours for each sprayed layer.

The point is that the emulsion dries not only on the surface. This would cause problems by the use of developer etc.
Given time can be shortened with a faster flow of dry air when you use hair dryers or the like.

bsdunek · Jan 4, 2011

I went to a kitchen shop and bought stacking cooling racks. Not very expensive. I have a cabinet in my darkroom that I put them in with the paper on them. I don't want them to touch or they might stick.
I leave them a couple of days and have had good success. I use Rockland Colloid Liquid Light, but assume most of these emulsions are similar.

OMU · Jan 9, 2011

After tree dayes I used the paper.
Some of them were dry enough for use. But a few were to soft and the emulsion rambled (?) in the developer.
So I gess the emulsion need more time to dry in boxes.

Suppose I need to build a rack.

JWinters · Mar 1, 2011

CD racks are useful for 4x5 too. People throw them out a lot. I've found them especially useful for students coating plates in large numbers.

studiocarter · Mar 10, 2011

A shoe box works for 4x5 glass plates. The box will warp from the moisture it absorbes overnight so I wrap it in a black cloth. The next day another box replaces it and the first one is allowed to dry.

Liquid emulsion, time to dry?

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