Leitz Focotar 5cm 4.5 disassembly help needed!

[Ghak]

Hi all,

There are few older posts on this topic, but need a bit more help.

I'm trying to disassemble an earlier version (DOOCQ) that I am trying to clean. Based on the instructions posted here on Photorio, I've removed the two back lenses, but cannot remove the ones in front of the aperture.

I think I remove the small screw, and turn the ring with the slits in them -- but it's super hard, won't move at all (as you can see, I've stripped it a bit already.

Can somebody help me and advise what I should do to remove the front lens assembly?

Thank you so much!

 

[koraks]

In all lenses I have come across so far, the front group removes from the front side. Usually the faceplate has to be unscrewed, which can be tricky to get sufficient grip on, and then you usually gain access to 3 or so micro screws that guide the next step.
However, the front side of this particular lens looks a little different from what I usually get my hands on.

Anyway, since it's just a 50/4.5 enlarger lens, 'worst' case is you'll have to replace it with a virtually equally excellent 50mm EI Nikkor

 

[Ghak]

Thanks Koraks, yeah there is nothing on the front side that looks like it can be removed. The large ring in the back is screaming "remove me!" but even with the small side screw removed, it won't budge. Maybe I need to grease it up a bit to loosen...

 

[Lachlan Young]

In all lenses I have come across so far, the front group removes from the front side.

The oddest enlarging lens barrel design I've encountered is the TTH Ental - everything is accessed from the front, so cleaning the elements behind the aperture means removing the aperture assembly.

Anyway, since it's just a 50/4.5 enlarger lens, 'worst' case is you'll have to replace it with a virtually equally excellent 50mm EI Nikkor

Funnily enough, the most commonplace (historically at least) replacement for the Focotar on the Focomat 1c seems to have been the 50/2.8 EL-Nikkor.

 

[choiliefan]

I have a 50mm APO Rodagon on my 1C which required the addition of an iirc 8mm extension tube.
The Nikkor may or may not require some additional spacer. The DOORX tube is the extension for my old Focotar when mounted on the 1C.

 

[kobaltus]

I also have one dirty old focotar. Built like a tank. Same problem... Some rumors exist, that germans were using glue during assembly.

 

[gone]

Isn't that the back side of the front element that I'm seeing in your photo? Couldn't you take a swab and clean it right where it is?

 

[Kino]

Thanks Koraks, yeah there is nothing on the front side that looks like it can be removed. The large ring in the back is screaming "remove me!" but even with the small side screw removed, it won't budge. Maybe I need to grease it up a bit to loosen...

Grease is not the answer. If anything at all, a drop of acetone on the threads might help if they used lacquer to lock the threads. I assume it is painted brass or metal of some sort, but if it is not, skip the acetone.

Have you tried a friction tool on the front of the lens?

 

[Robbie Bedell]

OK, I have been wrestling with this problem for a long time. I have learned that the best first thing to do is to attempt to open the lens from the front. The lenses suffer through the years from the typical lubricant haze common to many older lenses. The haze seems to be worse in the front elements of the lens, which makes sense as enlarger lenses are always facing downward throughout their lives. So try to unscew the front with a rubber gripper tool. Amazingly on some that I have tried, they unscew very easly. Some of the early ones have notches, others do not. Nothing like the battle to open the rear cells. I have no idea why Leica made these things so complicated. The engineering and construction must have easlily doubled or tripled the price of the lens. I also like to clean Kodak Ektar enlarging lenes, which are very fine lenses. Those lenses are so simple to open and clean. Someday I will get to the bottom of fixing the older focotars. I have used them for years and as far as I am concerned when clean they are the best lenses for 35mm work. But you might find that the lens only needs cleaning in the front group. Good luck! They are a challenge!!

 

[Tel]

Grease is not the answer. If anything at all, a drop of acetone on the threads might help if they used lacquer to lock the threads. I assume it is painted brass or metal of some sort, but if it is not, skip the acetone.

Have you tried a friction tool on the front of the lens?

This is why they make those nesting rubber cones--many lenses have "beauty rings' on the front with no holes or slots to get your spanner wrench into. Friction is the way to go with these, though many years ago I did drill some holes in one particularly stubborn ring and use my spanner on it. (NOT recommended.) As the other responses indicated, you will not get the front element out through the rear of the housing.

 

[Nicholas Lindan]

There is a Youtube video on taking apart a later version that may help:

I cleaned one of the early versions. Like many, I couldn't find any way to remove the front cell. I found I only had to remove the rear cell as this gave me access to the inner surfaces of both cells. The lens surfaces inside each of the cells had stayed clean and so I ended up with no need to remove the front cell.

 

[Robbie Bedell]

There is a Youtube video on taking apart a later version that may help:

I cleaned one of the early versions. Like many, I couldn't find any way to remove the front cell. I found I only had to remove the rear cell as this gave me access to the inner surfaces of both cells. The lens surfaces inside each of the cells had stayed clean and so I ended up with no need to remove the front cell.

Nicholas, Were you able to get past the aperture when you removed the rear cells? I guess I mean, were you able to remove the aperture mechanism as a whole and then get it all back togther again? That's where I always get stuck.

 

[Nicholas Lindan]

Were you able to get past the aperture when you removed the rear cells? I guess I mean, were you able to remove the aperture mechanism as a whole and then get it all back togther again? That's where I always get stuck.

With the aperture wide open there was clear access to the back of the front cell. I used a Q-Tip, wrapped in a PecPad or Kimwipe (or I'm assuming I did, it was ~25 years ago).

I remember holding the lens and turning it over and over, wondering "OK, now how do I get in?" But then I found I didn't need to get far into the lens and it wasn't that hard to clean.

 

[Robbie Bedell]

Ah, got it. Thank you Nicholas!

 

[Robbie Bedell]

Hi all,

There are few older posts on this topic, but need a bit more help.

I'm trying to disassemble an earlier version (DOOCQ) that I am trying to clean. Based on the instructions posted here on Photorio, I've removed the two back lenses, but cannot remove the ones in front of the aperture.

I think I remove the small screw, and turn the ring with the slits in them -- but it's super hard, won't move at all (as you can see, I've stripped it a bit already.

Can somebody help me and advise what I should do to remove the front lens assembly?

Thank you so much!

I wanted to show how I was able to remove the front elements from the Focotar I have been working on. I bought this as a practice lens. As you can see the the whole front lens assembly just screwed out the the rubber gripping tool at left. Unless you are attemting to open the whole lens I would not suggest taking the small screw out. The screw locks the outer black barrel to the lens and if that gets rotated your indexes to the aperture settings will be off. Also, unless you want to get deeper into the lens, do not reomve the larger ring on the back. The larger ring will release the inner barrel of the lens. It sounds complicated...and it is. In the next couple of days I will show you what the inner lens looks like. It can be a bear to reassemble properly. It's best to take photos and scribe things with a pencil as you go. I am still trying to get the two rear elements out of mine...as you did! Live and learn!

 

[Tel]

That's how you do it!