Leica M2 repair without full CLA

martinb0820 · Jul 31, 2020

I have a 1958 M2 on which the frame counter has become difficult to manually turn to reset, although it works fine when counting frames. The camera is otherwise in great shape.

I am looking for recommendations for someone who could perform a quality, targeted repair instead of a full rebuild. Information about cost, turn-around time, level of communication, etc. would also be welcome. (Of course, if other issues were to be identified in the course of the repair, I would want them addressed.)

Thanks in advance!

MattKing · Jul 31, 2020

A CLA isn't a rebuild, it is relatively simple, normal maintenance: Clean, Lubricate and Adjust maintenance.
I can understand why repair technicians might be unwilling to do repair work without a CLA, because the likelihood of there being further problems with the camera would be high.
That being said, I hope you find what you are looking for.

martinb0820 · Jul 31, 2020

Based on what I see on-line a CLA is sometimes whatever the tech defines it to be.

MattKing · Jul 31, 2020

martinb0820 said:
Based on what I see on-line a CLA is sometimes whatever the tech defines it to be. Based on price quotes and associated information, one of the responses represented essentially a full tear-down.

In the case of some cameras, of course, one does need to substantially dis-assemble the camera in order to access those parts that might benefit from/require cleaning, lubricating and adjusting. Perhaps an M2 is like that.
I agree that that some repair technicians aren't willing to limit their services to what might be appropriately described as a CLA, even if that is the label they use.

John Koehrer · Jul 31, 2020

Warrantee is the bugaboo. What happens when/if a fault isn't noticed when your counter is fixed. Is the
shop that did the counter service responsible for that fault under warrantee? The shops I had worked at did
covered the full camera and didn't do partial fixits.

summicron1 · Jul 31, 2020

I had a repair done on an M3 once -- spring that returns the film crank broke -- and insisted on that only being fixed for, as I recall, maybe $80 or so.

Damn thing needed a full service a year later.

Lesson? Pay the bux to get the whole thing done right the first time.

rknewcomb · Jul 31, 2020

http://www.yyecamera.com/
He does very good work and his prices are good. Check out his webpage. He responses to emails very quickly.
I agree with the other comments, get it cla serviced and repaired all at once.

OrientPoint · Jul 31, 2020

I can recommend yyecamera as well. Great work, good price, and excellent communication.

logan2z · Jul 31, 2020

Another vote for YYE. He did a great job on my M4, and turned it around very quickly and for a reasonable price.

Patrick Robert James · Jul 31, 2020

If you are just concerned about the money you could do it yourself. You just need the clamps which you can get on ebay for maybe thirty bucks. Repair manuals are available online. Your problem is more than likely just dirt.

If it were mine and I had it for that long, I'd get it taken care of. I'd send it to Don Goldberg (DAG Camera) and have him work it over. You only live once....

MarkS · Aug 1, 2020

It's only 62 years old. Why should it need servicing? \facepalm\
Get it done right, once, and then use it for the rest of your life.
Seriously, if you do that, you'll be very pleased with how much more smoothly your camera works.

btaylor · Aug 2, 2020

Another vote for Youxin. He CLA’d my M2- very nice work, fast turnaround.

mshchem · Aug 2, 2020

martinb0820 said:
Based on what I see on-line a CLA is sometimes whatever the tech defines it to be.

Where are you located? There's a shop in Rock Island Illinois USA that can fix anything. I think they have employees there from 20 to 85 years of age. They will still fix projectors. I had them go over a early Mamiya 35mm rangefinder, fixed the shutter bunch of stuff for something like 150 dollars. I didn't need the camera, so pretty. I sold it to a friend (100 $) who's getting his masters in journalism, full ride scholarship. He has used it and a Cosina Voigtländer.

http://www.united-camera.com/

These guys are awesome, tell them what you need.

Ian Grant · Aug 2, 2020

MattKing said:
A CLA isn't a rebuild, it is relatively simple, normal maintenance: Clean, Lubricate and Adjust maintenance.
I can understand why repair technicians might be unwilling to do repair work without a CLA, because the likelihood of there being further problems with the camera would be high.
That being said, I hope you find what you are looking for.

Here in the UK official Leitz repairers normally do a full strip down service when doing repairs. I cracked the glass in the view finder of my M3, it went to Leitz themselves for repair and they said they would have to do a full service. I was lucky it came back with just the view finder glass changed, Leitz were very honest and stated the camera had in fact been fully serviced 18 months to two years earlier by the dealer I'd bought it from.

I had my Rolleiflex Automat repaired a few months ago and that was a full strip down and rebuild, that included stripping down the shutter and removing the shutter and aperture blades. The same is done with LF lens shutters.

Ian

guangong · Aug 2, 2020

Some years ago my daughter cracked the illumination window on her M3. Don Goldberg told me that while replacement was available and a simple repair in itself, getting to the window required removal of top plate and recommended to do nothing until camera required CLA or major repair. Temporary/semipermanent fix with book mending tape.
My house had fire with much smoke and soot damage. Sent all my Leicas to Ye for assessment. He only serviced cameras that needed service and simply returned those that didn’t. Both Ye and Don are highly ethical.
Sixty years is a long time. Leicas should be serviced at least ever two or three decades.

David Reynolds · Aug 3, 2020

I also recommend Youxin Ye . He has CLA'ed both my M3 and M4 as well as a couple of lenses. Does great work and fast turn around.

film_man · Aug 5, 2020

You're paying for time and given most of the time is taking the camera apart and putting it together the savings compared to a CLA which you'll have to do at some point are probably not worth it. I think I read somewhere that removing the top plate on a Leica means the rangefinder has to be aligned anyway so all you're saving in the end is not that much. And as other said, fixing that counter means they'll give you some sort of warranty however if anything else happens while the warranty is active good luck debating whether it was down to random luck or opening the camera in the first place for that little fix you wanted. You may say you won't do that but the repairer wouldn't take the risk.

Oldwino · Aug 15, 2020

My M2 counter is also hard to reset, but then I learned a little trick. Advance the wind lever about halfway, then the counter disengages and turns very easily.

Huss · Aug 15, 2020

Oldwino said:
My M2 counter is also hard to reset, but then I learned a little trick. Advance the wind lever about halfway, then the counter disengages and turns very easily.

That sounds like intentional design, preventing accidental movement.
A feature not a bug!

Oldwino · Aug 16, 2020

Huss said:
That sounds like intentional design, preventing accidental movement.
A feature not a bug!

exactly.

martinb0820 · Sep 6, 2020

MarkS said:
It's only 62 years old. Why should it need servicing? \facepalm\
Get it done right, once, and then use it for the rest of your life.
Seriously, if you do that, you'll be very pleased with how much more smoothly your camera works.

Facepalm? Where is the levity here ?

It did have a CLA from Leica when they were still performing them on M2s. That made a noticeable difference; for example, prior to the CLA the rewind button would stay depressed instead of popping out on its own. However, at this time, other than the frame counter, it's working great; my belief in "if it isn't broken, don't fix it" is apparently an anachronistic philosophy at odds with current consensus.

So I'm ready to throw in the towel and get a CLA since that appears to be what it will take to get a fix.

Following on from that decision, I'm stuck on how to ship and insure it for shipping. Recent experiences with all the carriers (FedEx, UPS, USPS) have been far from stellar (lost packages, deliveries to incorrect addresses, four week delays... and horrible customer service.)

Do people shipping vintage Leicas for repair generally purchase third party insurance? In the (admittedly unlikely) event that FedEx were to lose or damage mine, how would I establish the value of a near mint 1958 camera? (They probably wouldn't adjust a 1972 receipt for inflation!) The verbiage on the FedEx Web site strongly implies that they'll pay the lowest amount they can get away with.

Advice would be welcome!

martinb0820 · Sep 6, 2020

Huss said:
That sounds like intentional design, preventing accidental movement.
A feature not a bug!

Well, I've had the camera since 1972 and the frame counter wheel was always just right until recently - tight enough to not be changed accidentally, but easy to intentionally change. (My bad - I was busy playing with Sony mirrorless for awhile and didn't exercise the Leica. A mechanical camera like the M2 really needs to be used, not just looked at.)

And that workaround didn't work...

martinb0820 · Sep 9, 2020

guangong said:
Some years ago my daughter cracked the illumination window on her M3. Don Goldberg told me that while replacement was available and a simple repair in itself, getting to the window required removal of top plate and recommended to do nothing until camera required CLA or major repair. Temporary/semipermanent fix with book mending tape.
My house had fire with much smoke and soot damage. Sent all my Leicas to Ye for assessment. He only serviced cameras that needed service and simply returned those that didn’t. Both Ye and Don are highly ethical.
Sixty years is a long time. Leicas should be serviced at least ever two or three decades.

I think three decades sounds about right. It should be about 30 years since its last CLA at Leica in another five or so....

martinb0820 · Sep 9, 2020

martinb0820 said:
I have a 1958 M2 on which the frame counter has become difficult to manually turn to reset, although it works fine when counting frames. The camera is otherwise in great shape.

I am looking for recommendations for someone who could perform a quality, targeted repair instead of a full rebuild. Information about cost, turn-around time, level of communication, etc. would also be welcome. (Of course, if other issues were to be identified in the course of the repair, I would want them addressed.)

Thanks in advance!

It seems like the general assumption here is that the camera has never been serviced in 62 years. Actually, it had a CLA by Leica in the 90's.

Ko.Fe. · Sep 9, 2020

No CLA from 1992? Bad ownership.

Leica M2 repair without full CLA

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Leica M2 repair without full CLA

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