Learn manual photography using digital compact?

A response in another thread has intrigued me. I want to learn manual 35mm film photography. It is going to be somewhat wasteful of time and money to use a lot of 35mm film and get it developed and printed during the learning process whilst I have knowledge of manual photography.

I don’t have a DSLR either.

What I do have is a compact camera that hardly gets any use. It’s a Canon PowerShot G7X MkII. I went through its instruction manual yesterday and it has a manual mode.

So, is it viable to learn manual photography using my compact just to get familiar with the concepts of ISO, aperture and shutter speed, with a view to applying that knowledge to manual 35mm photography, or are the two worlds apart?

Taz777 said:

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So, is it viable to learn manual photography using my compact just to get familiar with the concepts of ISO, aperture and shutter speed, with a view to applying that knowledge to manual 35mm photography, or are the two worlds apart?

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For learning manual operation, what you have is perfectly good (I checked your camera's specs on dpreview).

Maybe choose an ISO of 400 or 800 and leave it there for a few hundred shots while you experiment with shutter speeds and aperture. The screen is too small and limited for more than a cursory examination - you'll want to view your photos on a laptop or larger monitor. Later, try lower and higher ISO's. On a film camera, of course, once the film is loaded the ISO is fixed for that roll.

Also keep in mind that on a real 35mm film camera, setting of speed and aperture controls will be actually more convenient - something to look forward to.

Yes, it will work fine - anything with a manual mode will work fine. I see several things to learn here:

1) technique: use an external meter to measure exposure, you will need it with any manual camera later anyway. Depending on your budget you can go from a cell phone app to a fancy spot meter. Learn to measure the light and transfer your readings to the camera. Learn how your meter reacts to certain lighting situations. Study the effect of aperture and shutter speed. Digital is a good way to learn all this at little cost.

2) film: how the film reacts to lighting situations, as well as developing and printing techniques etc. This can obviously only be done with real film.

3) Composition, framing, in one word „photography“ or „art“- this is obviously works with both film and digital and from the cheapest cell phone to the most expensive digital.

Have fun L)

Yes, it will. Have fun and enjoy as you learn.

99.9% of photography is seeing, have fun !
( when you transfer your skills to film you will have to remember that your compact digital will expose your sensor like SLIDE FILM ( in a film camera )
so over expose means lighter image under expose means darker image, .. with negative film its the opposite for the NEGATIVE.. )

Theo Sulphate said:

For learning manual operation, what you have is perfectly good (I checked your camera's specs on dpreview).

Maybe choose an ISO of 400 or 800 and leave it there for a few hundred shots while you experiment with shutter speeds and aperture. The screen is too small and limited for more than a cursory examination - you'll want to view your photos on a laptop or larger monitor. Later, try lower and higher ISO's. On a film camera, of course, once the film is loaded the ISO is fixed for that roll.

Also keep in mind that on a real 35mm film camera, setting of speed and aperture controls will be actually more convenient - something to look forward to.

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What Theo has said about leaving the ISO at a particular setting is great advice for your goal of learning manual exposure. Also, double-check to make sure your camera doesn't have some type of Auto ISO setting, because that will defeat the purpose of this advice.

I have recently been using my digital camera to get a ballpark exposure reading for long/nightime film photos, so yes, put your camera on manual and start learning what ISO, aperture and shutter speed actually mean. The best part is you get instant feedback, if a photo is too dark open the aperture or use a slower shutter speed, too light, close down the aperture and/or decrease the shutter speed, you will be able to see the results of the change in settings straight away. You will start to get a feel for what are actually the only two controls available, shutter and aperture. So keep the ISO fixed and start learning, what a great idea to get started on film photography!

Thank you all so much for your advice! I totally forgot about my G7X Mkii previously. I've watched a couple of YouTube videos on manual shooting and it's beginning to make sense. I've enabled the wireless transfer feature on the G7X Mkii and my Mac so I can send any new photos to my computer by pressing a button on the camera. It means I can play 'for free' whilst I'm learning and can study the photos on a larger screen very easily.

@Theo Sulphate - Yes, I'll be sure to fix the ISO and experiment with the shutter speeds and aperture.

@etn - I'll search for a light meter app for my phone. If I can't find one I'll Google for a not-too-expensive light meter.

@Stephen Prunier - Thank you for the encouragement! It's a bit bewildering at the moment but I'm sure it will start to make some sense soon.

@jnantz - That's a very interesting point you've made there! I shall bear that in mind.

@Ariston - I believe the 'M' mode on the G7X Mkii has no auto ISO, but I will read the documentation once again to make sure.

There are a lot of things you can learn about light and photography that are camera independent. Your fixed lens digital camera is as good as anything for learning about them.
And using the manual exposure mode on that camera will give you some useful familiarity with shutter speeds, apertures and light meter readiness, as well as how they interact with each other.
Mostly though, they will give you some vocabulary and context, which you can then make use of when you go about learning how to get what you want from your film camera.
There will be differences in how the two respond, but they will be differences of quantity and, to a lesser extent, qualities, not differences of type. For example, for a particular scene, you might get more pleasing results with film increasing exposure an extra half stop when compared with the meter reading and the most pleasing result with digital.
There are also some more complex differences that flow from the differences in "sensor" sizes and the resulting differences in depth of field, but those complexities can wait until you have learned a bit more.
The most important thing is to enjoy the process, and to enjoy the learning. If you keep at it, you can probably get lots of enjoymentfrom learning the differences as well as the similarities.

What jnantz said in post #5 is important to know: exposing an image with a digital camera is like using transparency ("slide") film rather than negative film.

With digital and slide film, you don't want to overexpose the bright areas (highlights) when trying to capture detail in the shadows, because once detail in the highlights is gone, you can't recover it. So in that case expose just enough that highlights appear properly bright, but still retain detail. It's easier to pull detail out of the shadow areas in those cases.

With negative film, it's the opposite. Ensure you've given enough exposure to get the shadow detail you want and don't worry about the highlights because you're unlikely to expose the bright areas into total opaque blackness on the negative. The worst thing you can do with negative film is underexpose it into a thin near-transparent celluloid having no detail whatsoever.

What etn writes in post #3 is also important. You need to know whether your meter is looking at a spot, a central area, or the entire scene. Also, when an area is metered, the meter is telling you what exposure is needed to produce a middle gray tone. If you meter bright sand at the beach and then use that value, the sand will appear gray (if B&W) or darker than you'd expect (if color), so what you have to realize is that if the meter is giving you a value for an area you know you want to be brighter, you'll have to compensate by overexposing slightly. A good thing for your practice would be to photograph dark curtains in a room and then light curtains and see how you need to adjust exposure away from the meter setting to get the proper tone.

Taz777 said:

@etn - I'll search for a light meter app for my phone. If I can't find one I'll Google for a not-too-expensive light meter.

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There is a lot to be said about meters - different types and models exist, each with their pros and cons. Feel free to start a new thread if you want to pick our brains on this topic! You can possibly find cheaper ones on the 2nd hand market.
I don‘t have much experience with meter apps but from what I saw they can even do spot metering to some extent. It might be necessary to check the accuracy of your app of choice against a real meter. The meter built into your digital camera should be fine for this.

Taz777 said:

@jnantz - That's a very interesting point you've made there! I shall bear that in mind.

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yeah reduced exposure latitude mimics it too .. so if it is BW you are trying to mimic its just a view/seeing thing nothing else is the same ..c41 well you have color but that's it...
dont' forget to have fun !

john

The basic principles of photography are independent of the capture mechanism (sensor or film) so there is no problem with your approach. To maximize your education value from this exercise, review the histograms from your images, either with the camera or image management software on your computer and look for clipping of highlights or shadows.

On the other hand, it only takes a roll or two to learn basic manual film photography (although you may spend a lifetime perfecting this). C-41 and B&W film have great latitude, and you can get decent images very quickly. I doubt I am the only person here to have learned basic photography with a no-frills, fixed focus, fixed aperture of f8, and fixed shutter speed of 1/125s camera.