Kodak's New Vision2 color Negative 2 electron film technology

Tom Hoskinson · Dec 28, 2005

From a Kodak Research and Development Press Release:

http://www.kodak.com/US/en/corp/researchDevelopment/productFeatures/vision2.shtml

"People still spend their hard-earned money to go to the movies because the experience is so great - the sound, the story come to life, and big, vivid pictures. Movies just look great. Even the big-screen televisions costing thousands of dollars don't give the same look as the big-screen theater. Now the movies, along with television programs and commercials originated on a new film from Kodak, can look even better.
Kodak scientists and engineers teamed to develop the new Kodak Vision2 500T color negative 5218 film, a breakthrough in motion imaging technology. Their Vision2 film design combines major technological innovations with innovative design to provide a new type of paint for the cinematographers' palettes and a better starting place for both optical and digital post-production."

Tom Hoskinson · Dec 28, 2005

Kodak's two-electron sensitization technology (in comparison with Kodak's T Grain technology wherein single incident photon striking a T Grain produces one electron):

Kodak's patented two-electron sensitization technology: This technology involves a fragment-able electron-donor compound designed to work with the sensitizing dyes to create the potential for two electrons from a single incident photon. Doubling the number electrons enhances the speed performance of the film and contributes to the stabilization of the latent image. The result is more detail in low-light scenes and extended depth of field.

Matt5791 · Dec 28, 2005

I use Kodak Vision2 500T in Super8 (they released it in the format last year) and it is amazing considering the speed and the tiny super8 frame. It enables the use opf Super8 in incredibly low light situations. And the exposure latitude is incredible.

Matt

Brac · Dec 28, 2005

So when, if ever, does this technology get incorporated into Kodak's 35mm still films? Guess we shouldn't hold our breath.

Tom Hoskinson · Dec 28, 2005

Brac said:
So when, if ever, does this technology get incorporated into Kodak's 35mm still films? Guess we shouldn't hold our breath.

Don't hold your breath - good advice.

The color negative Vision2 100T 5212/7212 motion picture films are currently available in long rolls for:

65mm
35mm
16mm

I'm tempted to pick up a 100 foot roll of the 35mm and try it out in my Contax RTS-II with the long roll back. I know that FotoKem will process it for me and make a single light work print.

nworth · Dec 28, 2005

Vision 2 appears to be an amazing technology. The blue layer has significant grain, but is still amazing for a 500 speed film. The other layers are extremely fine grain. Sharpness seems to be quite improved as well. The technology seems to have been applied to the other Vision 2 films as well. I looked at the 50D data, and that film is significantly improved and really outstanding. Given the way things work, I'm sure this technology will migrate quickly into the Kodak still films. One thing to note is that the two electron technology is dependent on the color forming dyes. This seems to mean that it will only be applicable to color films and to chromogenic black and white - not to ordinary black and white film. From the release, I suspect that the expiration date may need to be more carefully observed on these films, too.

pentaxuser · Dec 28, 2005

Tom Hoskinson said:
Don't hold your breath - good advice.

The color negative Vision2 100T 5212/7212 motion picture films are currently available in long rolls for:

65mm
35mm
16mm

I'm tempted to pick up a 100 foot roll of the 35mm and try it out in my Contax RTS-II with the long roll back. I know that FotoKem will process it for me and make a single light work print.

Presumably if this represents a real breakthrough and if adaptation to 35mm stills photography is straightforward as would appear to be the case from your forthcoming try-out then you'd think that Kodak would launch it very soon to gain the edge on Fuji.

If so then great news for 35mm colour neg users. Kodak has lost me to Fuji and I can't be alone so getting ex-kodakers back into the fold would be its objective. I would have thought this must represent a fair slice of the business.

Pentaxuser

Photo Engineer · Dec 28, 2005

I have been told that work on putting this technology into consumer products is going ahead on schedule. No one will reveal anything else here.

PE

Tom Hoskinson · Dec 28, 2005

Yes, I think you are correct about the Vision2 technology probably being limited to color and chromogenic films.

BTW the 2 electron effect is an interaction between a fragmentable electron-donor compound and the sensitizing dyes (I'm wondering if this electron-donor compound is there as a grain dopant or as another emulsion layer?)

Photo Engineer · Dec 28, 2005

Tom Hoskinson said:
Yes, I think you are correct about the Vision2 technology probably being limited to color and chromogenic films.

BTW the 2 electron effect is an interaction between a fragmentable electron-donor compound and the sensitizing dyes (I'm wondering if this electron-donor compound is there as a grain dopant or as another emulsion layer?)

Tom, it is a grain dopant as I understand it. It is added with the sensitzing dye when the grain is sensitized to the proper region of the visible spectrum.

There are a host of 'supersensitizers' in use today that perform some of this same function by other means and not as effectively. There are several chapters on this general topic in Mees and James.

This topic may be discussed at the ICIS in Rochester in May. The key name in this to research is Annabel Muenter. You will probably find some information under her name, as well as some done in France on a similar track but quite different chemically. The latter work was done at a university IIRC, and was done in cooperation with Agfa. It was never commercialized.

The 2 electron sensitization should work with color or B&W films as long as they are spectrally sensitized.

PE

Tom Hoskinson · Dec 28, 2005

Thanks, PE!

This is a very interesting topic! I'll be looking for Annabel Muenter's work.

Struan Gray · Dec 28, 2005

If P.E. is thinking of the same French work that I am, the work was published in Nature, which unlike most scientific journals is still quite easy to track down.

"Enhanced yield of photoinduced electrons in doped silver halide crystals"
Jaqueline Belloni et al.
Nature vol 402, pp 865-867 (1999).

Photo Engineer · Dec 28, 2005

Struan Gray said:
If P.E. is thinking of the same French work that I am, the work was published in Nature, which unlike most scientific journals is still quite easy to track down.

"Enhanced yield of photoinduced electrons in doped silver halide crystals"
Jaqueline Belloni et al.
Nature vol 402, pp 865-867 (1999).

Struan, that is it. There is also a web page with the information.

Thanks.

PE

braxus · Jan 14, 2006

Is this the same technology that Agfa developed and shelved? When Agfa went bust didn't Fuji buy the rights to this technology recently?

Photo Engineer · Jan 14, 2006

No, these technologies are not related in any way AFAIK.

I have no idea who owns the rights to the work by Belloni.

The Kodak work has been in use since Vision 2 was released and was under development at EK for years prior to that.

PE

Claire Senft · Jan 14, 2006

In 1991 Photo-Techniques magazine had an article by Dr Robert Champman on fomate..doped films based upon the article in Science magazine. He estimated that they would be on the market within 5 years. Funny thing, I was just rereading the article today and wondering when this technology would hit the market place.

Photo Engineer · Jan 14, 2006

I doubt if it ever will. And Chapman said a lot that was not exactly 'correct'.

PE

ajuk · Jan 18, 2006

braxus said:
Is this the same technology that Agfa developed and shelved? When Agfa went bust didn't Fuji buy the rights to this technology recently?

I did ask before if anyone would buy the right to AGFA's propriatry technologies, What is this Fuji bought?

Kodak's New Vision2 color Negative 2 electron film technology

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