Kodak Sepia toner

[Melvin J Bramley]

I have an ancient package of Kodak Sepia toner to make 946 ml of toner.
Is this to be diluted for use ?
What is the shelf life of the mixed toner?

 

[F4U]

If it's one of those little packets about the size of the spice packet in Hamburger Helper, no it's not to be diluted. But what about the packet of bleach that's supposed to come with it? It's of no use without that, as I recall it. Be forewarned, that stuff smells to high heaven. Worked nice though. But your prints need to be well-fixed and washed first or else it will cause yellow splotches.

 

[Melvin J Bramley]

If it's one of those little packets about the size of the spice packet in Hamburger Helper, no it's not to be diluted. But what about the packet of bleach that's supposed to come with it? It's of no use without that, as I recall it. Be forewarned, that stuff smells to high heaven. Worked nice though. But your prints need to be well-fixed and washed first or else it will cause yellow splotches.

Yes there are two packages.
Fortunately I have a fan in my darkroom.
How long does the smell linger?
I shall try it out when the wife is out of the home!

 

[F4U]

I suppose the smell lingers no longer than a rotten egg, which is exactly what it smells like. Maybe 2 rotten eggs. But it works nice. As I recall it softens up the gelatin on the print more than anything else there is, which means you have ti fix it again with hardening fixer and go through the washing routine all over again. It's been 50 years, but seems like that was the procedure.

 

[MattKing]

I like to be outside on the deck when I use sepia toner.
It smells.
By the way, you can bottle the working solution and re-use it, until it loses activity.

 

[F4U]

Can you even get it any more? I gave up on finding any new Colorvir. I can't believe how many years have passed as a working man. Now retired, it can be heartbreaking the things I intended to do when I had time and can afford it, but none of it is even there any more.

 

[Melvin J Bramley]

I suppose the smell lingers no longer than a rotten egg, which is exactly what it smells like. Maybe 2 rotten eggs. But it works nice. As I recall it softens up the gelatin on the print more than anything else there is, which means you have ti fix it again with hardening fixer and go through the washing routine all over again. It's been 50 years, but seems like that was the procedure.

Glad you told me that one!
Fortunately I have a package of equally old Kodak fixer with hardener.

 

[Melvin J Bramley]

I like to be outside on the deck when I use sepia toner.
It smells.
By the way, you can bottle the working solution and re-use it, until it loses activity.

Useful info, thanks.

 

[mshchem]

Yes, I have an exhaust blower in my darkroom that's overkill, I still rarely use sulfide toners because of the stink. Outdoors is the best plan. Keeping the sulfide bath cool (20°C) helps too. The really stinky stuff is the old Kodak Brown toner, direct sulfide toner, no bleach. Sepia toner IIRC, isn't quite as noxious.

 

[MattKing]

In order to deal with the hardening issue, I have several of those little Part B bottles of hardener that came packaged with the Kodak Rapid Fixer in the past, and apparently still do.
I use them to make up a hardening bath - 1 part Part B + 13 parts water.
I use that for each toned print - 3 minutes with agitation is probably more than enough.
Then re-wash.
Or you can re-fix in hardening fixer, if you wish.

 

[koraks]

. But what about the packet of bleach that's supposed to come with it? It's of no use without that, as I recall it. Be forewarned, that stuff smells to high heaven.

If it's the smelly kind of sepia toner, it can also be used without bleach, toning the print directly. The smelly sepia stuff is sodium sulfide. This can be used either for direct toning (kind of slow, but if you warm up the solution, it'll be doable) or indirect toning using a rehalogenating bleach first (much faster action).
The more modern and more flexible odorless sepia toners are based on thiourea and those only work if you bleach first.

I suppose the smell lingers no longer than a rotten egg, which is exactly what it smells like.

Which is also exactly what it is - hydrogen sulfide. It's rotten egg smell, literally.

Can you even get it any more?

Sodium sulfide is fairly easy to procure. In the mainland US, try e.g. https://stores.photoformulary.com/s...-only-choose-ups-ground-shipping-at-checkout/
Here in Europe I've also bought it without any problem. It's a cheap and common bulk chemical.

 

[Ian C]

In bleach-redevelopment sepia toning, the hydrogen sulfide (rotten-egg smell) of the toning bath (2nd step in the process) can spoil unexposed, or exposed but undeveloped) films and papers. Such affected materials become fogged, which is evident after developing.

You should do the toning step in a different room than where these light-sensitive materials are kept. The bleaching step doesn’t generate any injurious gases.

 

[cliveh]

As matt advised, I always sepia tone outside including make up of solutions.

 

[pentaxuser]

I like to be outside on the deck when I use sepia toner.

Presumably no-one sepia tones outdoors in Winnipeg ín January except professional huskies

pentaxuser

 

[koraks]

Presumably no-one sepia tones outdoors in Winnipeg ín January

You'd have to be very fast, I imagine. Retouching a print using an ice pick sounds like a lot of work.

 

[pentaxuser]

You'd have to be very fast, I imagine. Retouching a print using an ice pick sounds like a lot of work.

pentaxuser

 

[cliveh]

You dress for the occasion.

 

[MattKing]

Presumably no-one sepia tones outdoors in Winnipeg ín January except professional huskies

pentaxuser

-3C today in Winnipeg today.
Not too bad really - after all, it could be Scotland

 

[Truzi]

-3C today in Winnipeg today.
Not too bad really - after all, it could be Scotland

That's what we had in Cleveland, Ohio, today. The last few days were colder, and we're looking at negative F next week