Kodak Axes Digicams, but keeps film

[CGW]

Is a "new" Kodak taking shape?

http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2012/02/09/business/09reuters-kodak.html?hp

 

[Thomas Bertilsson]

Very interesting development.

 

[wildbill]

good riddance, The only people I know that own them can't figure out how to use them. I hope this doesn't affect their CEO's Christmas bonus. Time to make film and paper!

 

[railwayman3]

Maybe the "snapshot" digicam market is saturated? And perhaps a majority of "family-picture" users have no reason or interest to be updating to the latest model every year? While others will be happy to use their smartphones, particularly as the camera functions are improving?

 

[keithwms]

They were making digicams? I wasn't aware...

 

[kb3lms]

I hope this doesn't affect their CEO's Christmas bonus.

Probably done BECAUSE it affected the CEO's Christmas bonus!

 

[Photo Engineer]

Kodak announced ~200 immediate layoffs in the commercial ink jet printer division on Wednesday.

PE

 

[kb3lms]

Ouch! I always hate to hear about layoffs.

 

[PKM-25]

I talked to Audrey Jonckheer via email a few days ago, she said in terms of film being produced, it is the way it has always been, is business as usual at Kodak and that they look at the numbers closely every month. The products have to be used in sufficient quantities for it to be produced, reasonable for sure.

So I think more promotion on our part is in order, the advertising budgets for many companies, not just Kodak, have been tightened over the years post Sept. 2008 and some have not fully come back as ad and marketing departments took to social media to get the word out at a much lower cost. Kodak has good presence on Facebook and I am now going to post regularly there to give a visual plug to what is being done with Kodak films. It really is up to us to keep film around and that includes helping ALL film makers advertise and market.

 

[holmburgers]

I'm with railwayman... everybody is using cell phone cameras these days, nearly everbody. It's been the quiet revolution in snapshots over the last couple years.

It's kinda crazy, but if you think about it, it's really the perfect camera for anyone that doesnt ultimately want anything more than just a decent image of an event. You're carrying your phone with you anyways, and the quality is quickly becoming acceptable.

And beyond that, since they're convinced that mega-pixels are the only measure of photo quality, they think they're right in there with the best digital cameras!

 

[Thomas Bertilsson]

I'm with railwayman... everybody is using cell phone cameras these days, nearly everbody. It's been the quiet revolution in snapshots over the last couple years.

It's kinda crazy, but if you think about it, it's really the perfect camera for anyone that doesnt ultimately want anything more than just a decent image of an event. You're carrying your phone with you anyways, and the quality is quickly becoming acceptable.

And beyond that, since they're convinced that mega-pixels are the only measure of photo quality, they think they're right in there with the best digital cameras!

I know it's a poor venue for discussing this, but I took a picture photographed with the new iPhone 4S, and I did some minor adjustments in Photoshop, and subsequently printed an 8.5 x 11 on the Epson R2400, and it is a gorgeous print! The camera in that phone is actually damned good, especially in low light it's miles better than my own iPhone 4, and better than the little Nikon P&S digital camera too. I don't think there's a future for digital cameras other than what's in a phone, or an SLR. I wouldn't be surprised to see an SLR that you can dock the iPhone to either, or have pictures transferred via Bluetooth while you're shooting. The possibilities are endless, and I believe we've only just seen the beginning yet.

I don't know if that adds anything to the discussion or not, as I feel I'm digressing a little, but in my mind what's happening at Kodak will hopefully allow the company to survive, while some really tough sacrifices have to be made. It's bound to have sad consequences, but hopefully some good news for those that still have a job.

 

[Mackinaw]

This is reassuring. From today's BJP:

"However, the firm has moved to reassure film photographers. "Kodak's continuing consumer products and services will include the traditional film capture and photographic paper business, which continues to provide high-quality and innovative products and solutions to consumers, photographers, retailers, photofinishers and professional labs," it says in a statement."

More here:

http://www.bjp-online.com/british-j...03/kodak-phases-digital-businesses-film-alive

 

[PKM-25]

I did a show last year from my iP4 in Hipstamatic mostly in 9 x 9's and sold enough to pay for 8 iPhones. Two of the prints went as big as 30 x 30 and looked very cool. I also hope that Kodak comes out of this in much better shape...

I know it's a poor venue for discussing this, but I took a picture photographed with the new iPhone 4S, and I did some minor adjustments in Photoshop, and subsequently printed an 8.5 x 11 on the Epson R2400, and it is a gorgeous print! The camera in that phone is actually damned good, especially in low light it's miles better than my own iPhone 4, and better than the little Nikon P&S digital camera too. I don't think there's a future for digital cameras other than what's in a phone, or an SLR. I wouldn't be surprised to see an SLR that you can dock the iPhone to either, or have pictures transferred via Bluetooth while you're shooting. The possibilities are endless, and I believe we've only just seen the beginning yet.

I don't know if that adds anything to the discussion or not, as I feel I'm digressing a little, but in my mind what's happening at Kodak will hopefully allow the company to survive, while some really tough sacrifices have to be made. It's bound to have sad consequences, but hopefully some good news for those that still have a job.

 

[PKM-25]

A good article in the Wall Street Journal about film's niche usage in a digital age:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204555904577169062463961458.html

 

[fotch]

After owning one of their first (DC120) digital camera, I would never get another one. They are a great film company and that is what they should stick to.

 

[keithwms]

I know it's a poor venue for discussing this, but I took a picture photographed with the new iPhone 4S, and I did some minor adjustments in Photoshop, and subsequently printed an 8.5 x 11 on the Epson R2400, and it is a gorgeous print!

Not surprising at all! And bear in mind the bigger picture which is that more and more people want to share their shots rather than print them with any seriousness. Like I've been saying for some time, digicam makers are going to get their clocks cleaned by even cheaper smartphone cameras, with which sharing is easy and natural. There is s till a big gap between the pocketable smartphones and the "serious" dslrs.... many of which don't even need to have mirrors, frankly.

What is extraordinarily odd to me is that the digicam makers haven't caught on and made web-ready cameras that would, you know, have twitter or facebook button on the back or something. It's what the kids want and very easy to implement.

 

[Tim Gray]

What is extraordinarily odd to me is that the digicam makers haven't caught on and made web-ready cameras that would, you know, have twitter or facebook button on the back or something. It's what the kids want and very easy to implement.

I'm sure someone has done that. It's just really hard to compete with the phone in your pocket that does that exact thing just as well.

 

[CGW]

Not surprising at all! And bear in mind the bigger picture which is that more and more people want to share their shots rather than print them with any seriousness. Like I've been saying for some time, digicam makers are going to get their clocks cleaned by even cheaper smartphone cameras, with which sharing is easy and natural. There is s till a big gap between the pocketable smartphones and the "serious" dslrs.... many of which don't even need to have mirrors, frankly.

What is extraordinarily odd to me is that the digicam makers haven't caught on and made web-ready cameras that would, you know, have twitter or facebook button on the back or something. It's what the kids want and very easy to implement.

There's already a dead end taking shape with mirror-less bodies designed to look like their film ancestors, e.g., the Olympus OM-D, Pentax K-01 and the Fuji X10. EVFs are making mirrors and prisms obsolete--Sony's NEX bodies a case in point.

Schneider's already making iPhone lens kits:

http://www.iprolens.com/

 

[removed-user-1]

I found it interesting that the NYT article did not mention the fact that Kodak's film business is still profitable (unless I missed it, but I read through it twice just to be sure). As far as digicams go I think Kodak is making a good move in getting out of the market.

99% of my photography is done on film. I have two digital cameras; one is a little Panasonic point-n-shoot which is actually pretty good, and the other is my Android phone which is also capable of good images. Guess which one never gets used? In fact the battery isn't even charged...

 

[keithwms]

There's already a dead end taking shape with mirror-less bodies designed to look like their film ancestors

Well, I don't think it's a dead end at all. Many of us who happily use RFs don't think it's a dead end at all. Yes, mirrorless cameras have a long way to go, and there will be many incremental advances before it's fully mature, but... that's exactly what you want when creating a new market. Hear me now believe me later, cameras with mirrors (including digitals) will go out of mass production within a decade.

 

[Chan Tran]

Well, I don't think it's a dead end at all. Many of us who happily use RFs don't think it's a dead end at all. Yes, mirrorless cameras have a long way to go, and there will be many incremental advances before it's fully mature, but... that's exactly what you want when creating a new market. Hear me now believe me later, cameras with mirrors (including digitals) will go out of mass production within a decade.

Many cameras nowaday resemble a rangefinder camera but the only true rangefinder digital are the Leica M8 and M9 and the old Epson RD-1. All have Leica M mount.

 

[CGW]

Well, I don't think it's a dead end at all. Many of us who happily use RFs don't think it's a dead end at all. Yes, mirrorless cameras have a long way to go, and there will be many incremental advances before it's fully mature, but... that's exactly what you want when creating a new market. Hear me now believe me later, cameras with mirrors (including digitals) will go out of mass production within a decade.

Not talking about film cameras. Had a chance to play with a Sony NEX-7 with its killer EVF. It won't be long before OLED viewfinders rule. No prophetic statements necessary.

 

[jeffreyg]

Does anyone remember Polaroid's instant slide film? Does anyone remember Polaroid? I have one of the processor's in hardly used condition ... any offers?

http://www.jeffreyglasser.com/

 

[Henning Serger]

Hello Daniel,

I talked to Audrey Jonckheer via email a few days ago, she said in terms of film being produced, it is the way it has always been, is business as usual at Kodak and that they look at the numbers closely every month. The products have to be used in sufficient quantities for it to be produced, reasonable for sure.

which is confirmed by the bjp article posted above and also here in a German article quoting a Kodak rep saying Kodak intends to continue production of film and photopaper:

http://www.n-tv.de/wirtschaft/Kodak-versucht-es-wieder-analog-article5457701.html

So I think more promotion on our part is in order, the advertising budgets for many companies, not just Kodak, have been tightened over the years post Sept. 2008 and some have not fully come back as ad and marketing departments took to social media to get the word out at a much lower cost. Kodak has good presence on Facebook and I am now going to post regularly there to give a visual plug to what is being done with Kodak films. It really is up to us to keep film around and that includes helping ALL film makers advertise and market.

+1.
People can make a difference, consumers can make a difference, we all film shooters can make a difference and change things.
Not only shooting film on a regular basis by ourselves, but also spread the word being active to get others interested in the joy of shooting film.
Film has so much to offer.
If you show it to others interested in photography, especially younger photographers (at least that is my experience) and explain the possibilities and strengths of the medium and what makes it unique, you will have success (again my experiences; I've got many people into shooting film during the last years).
Imagine, if each film shooter convince at least two or three others to shoot film.
Then photo film will be on the safe(r) side.

But of course it is not only our mission. It is definitely the duty of all companies which earn their income by selling film, photochemicals, photopaper and development services.
It is the duty not only of film manufacturers, but especially the duty of specialised distributors like Freestyle, Maco, Fotoimpex etc., and the duty of professional labs.
They must stop their inactivity and start marketing for film.
They want to sell film, therefore they have to convince consumers to buy film.

Best regards,
Henning

 

[Steve Smith]

People can make a difference, consumers can make a difference, we all film shooters can make a difference and change things.
Not only shooting film on a regular basis by ourselves, but also spread the word being active to get others interested in the joy of shooting film.
Film has so much to offer.
If you show it to others interested in photography, especially younger photographers (at least that is my experience) and explain the possibilities and strengths of the medium and what makes it unique, you will have success (again my experiences; I've got many people into shooting film during the last years).
Imagine, if each film shooter convince at least two or three others to shoot film.
Then photo film will be on the safe(r) side.

My thoughts exactly but written more eloquently than I would have done.

It is the duty not only of film manufactureres, but especially the duty of the specialised distributors like Freestyle, Maco, Fotoimpex etc., and the duty of professional labs.
They must stop their inactivity and start marketing for film.
They want to sell film, therefore they have to convince consumers to buy film.

I don't think Kodak has any choice now. They are going to have to market their film products rather than consider them an embarassment to be hidden away.


Steve.